No early voting. No mail in voting. No electronic voting just scan-Tron style with paper as a backup. National voter ID. Purge the rolls. Only military, disabled and jobs out of town get absentee. Purple ink on right index finger. Poll watchers have full access. It’s really that simple folks. We don’t need a four hundred page law.
I only disagree that it should be the thumb dipped. And with such a huge gap between us, we must argue and opine and actually do nothing meaningful. /s
Nothing wrong with it. But that isnt the issue at hand. We have multiple cases of fraud, easily provable, and no arrests. Get the cases moving. Make the arrests. Get sworn testimony on how widespread this is with details. Prosecute the offenders with the stiffest penalties and prison time. Then when all the info is out, and the dust settles, and we know exactly how, when, who, and what, then we can write legislation to counter it all. Not waste time on something that will more than likely get struck down as unconstitutional, as it is at the state level, and in state legislatures that are decided the manners of voting for each state.
It will go nowhere with a Dem majority in the House.
So it really is just useless posturing.
But actually arresting, charging and jailing people by the dozens would have more of a chilling effect than introducing legislation that will never pass.
About 200 years late. The one thing the founders didn't account for was "Americans" losing a core principle of morality and honesty, despite difference of opinion.
How to introduce effective laws if the Dems ignore them? They did in this election cycle, at least by plugging devices into the internet that should not have been.
If Donald wins, the momentum will be carried through to the 2022 elections. With such fraud exposed the house will be taken and the law passed for 2024 election! Seems plausible at least.
There are ways of building software which makes voting far MORE reliable, and auditable. You can also manually count votes to double check the numbers and ensure you're within a margin of error, so I'm not saying don't manually count.
Imagine you suspect electronic fraud, or suspect votes were flipped. Software that was built correctly would treat EVERY ballot as a record, like a bank transaction. Any total number of votes is built from a query and a count of records.
At any time, you could check the time a ballot was cast, what was selected, the location, the machine, and much more. If someone just fed in a large number of ballots, or 100% of ballots were for one candidate, you could audit the records and find it easily. You could check for abnormalities, like a batch where nobody selected anything but the presidential candidate.
Clearly, the vendors were are currently using outsourced building the software to low-wage 3rd world countries, which is why it's such a dumpster fire. However, if we can write banking software, there's no reason we can't write reliable voting software. (I'm saying this from the perspective as a Sr Software Engineer).
I'm a software engineer for a fortune 20 company. A counting machine is easy, and just as easy to add fraud into it.
You're fooling yourself if you think the issue is the developers. This isn't happening by chance. Flip a coin a million times, right now it comes up Biden every time.
A counting machine is easy, and just as easy to add fraud into it.
It would be a disaster to build voting software as a counting-machine, and yet that appears to be how all voting software is built. That is unless your goal is to make it impossible to audit and enable fraud.
The difference is there are ways of writing a voting system that can be audited, and if you do it in a way where each ballot is a record, suddenly the fraud becomes more (not impossible but) auditable and traceable.
For example, you could take 2% (or even 0.5%) of the ballots in a district, and check them against the database-record for that ballot. If you find a single mismatch, and verify that it was counted incorrectly or doesn't exist, you have enough evidence to initiate an investigation, and most likely throw out the entire automated count.
I'm obviously only describing a small slice of such a system, or how you could audit it (I'm not building such a system at the moment, nor care to write a book on the topic. I'm aware there are many other edge cases to explore, like it creating fake records where no ballot exists, etc, but there are various ways you could test that.
If you used a standard database, like postgresql to store records, you could always run manual queries on the database to verify (for example) the software maybe accurately stored all the votes, but decided to fake the count.
If I wasn't working on another anti-censorship software-project full time (which is arguably many times more complex), I think there could be a business opportunity here and it's arguably not a difficult problem. Just if anyone here is considering doing it, please don't build another counting machine.
Its called VOTER REFORM! A strongly worded letter isn't going to cut it. There are drastic changes that need to be made to prevent this from happening again. Democratic strongholds will squeal, threaten and refuse to cooperate. This must be a state wide mandatory change.
No early voting. No mail in voting. No electronic voting just scan-Tron style with paper as a backup. National voter ID. Purge the rolls. Only military, disabled and jobs out of town get absentee. Purple ink on right index finger. Poll watchers have full access. It’s really that simple folks. We don’t need a four hundred page law.
I only disagree that it should be the thumb dipped. And with such a huge gap between us, we must argue and opine and actually do nothing meaningful. /s
And stiff penalties with teeth if any of those are broken.
10 years for each count. This is worse than any NFA violation.
I'd also add that ballots are standardized across the entire US and printed on counterfeit proof paper supplied by DHS.
Oh look, a strongly worded letter. Let us not arrest these fucks, let us propose legislation....... Simpsonsralphieimhelping.gif
I don't see how this is bad. What's wrong with nationwide voter ID laws when only US citizens should be voting?
What's wrong with cross-checking the voter rolls to make sure someone doesn't vote in multiple states?
Not all legislation is bad.
Nothing wrong with it. But that isnt the issue at hand. We have multiple cases of fraud, easily provable, and no arrests. Get the cases moving. Make the arrests. Get sworn testimony on how widespread this is with details. Prosecute the offenders with the stiffest penalties and prison time. Then when all the info is out, and the dust settles, and we know exactly how, when, who, and what, then we can write legislation to counter it all. Not waste time on something that will more than likely get struck down as unconstitutional, as it is at the state level, and in state legislatures that are decided the manners of voting for each state.
I agree with u/E-dantes - let's bring back the gallows.
Third, motion to bring back gallows is approved. I love a democracy!
Hang the traitors and treasonists high!
Well AG Barr said to prosecute. So we'll see.
Thought he only said investigate as of now.
He actually only authorized investigations. Feds move slow most of the time so I wouldn’t expect much right away.
It will go nowhere with a Dem majority in the House.
So it really is just useless posturing.
But actually arresting, charging and jailing people by the dozens would have more of a chilling effect than introducing legislation that will never pass.
SHOULD HAVE DONE THIS IN 2000 AFTER BUSH V GORE
YOU FUCKING TAX VACUUMS
Hey! The horse is out of the barn! Shut the door!
About 200 years late. The one thing the founders didn't account for was "Americans" losing a core principle of morality and honesty, despite difference of opinion.
Can't stop human nature.
How to introduce effective laws if the Dems ignore them? They did in this election cycle, at least by plugging devices into the internet that should not have been.
It will never get past the Democrat controlled house. Fuck Paul Ryan in the ass with a phone pole BTW.
If Donald wins, the momentum will be carried through to the 2022 elections. With such fraud exposed the house will be taken and the law passed for 2024 election! Seems plausible at least.
ban software systems and use mechanical ballot counters.
magic black boxes are cancer to a democracy.
There are ways of building software which makes voting far MORE reliable, and auditable. You can also manually count votes to double check the numbers and ensure you're within a margin of error, so I'm not saying don't manually count.
Imagine you suspect electronic fraud, or suspect votes were flipped. Software that was built correctly would treat EVERY ballot as a record, like a bank transaction. Any total number of votes is built from a query and a count of records.
At any time, you could check the time a ballot was cast, what was selected, the location, the machine, and much more. If someone just fed in a large number of ballots, or 100% of ballots were for one candidate, you could audit the records and find it easily. You could check for abnormalities, like a batch where nobody selected anything but the presidential candidate.
Clearly, the vendors were are currently using outsourced building the software to low-wage 3rd world countries, which is why it's such a dumpster fire. However, if we can write banking software, there's no reason we can't write reliable voting software. (I'm saying this from the perspective as a Sr Software Engineer).
I'm a software engineer for a fortune 20 company. A counting machine is easy, and just as easy to add fraud into it.
You're fooling yourself if you think the issue is the developers. This isn't happening by chance. Flip a coin a million times, right now it comes up Biden every time.
It would be a disaster to build voting software as a counting-machine, and yet that appears to be how all voting software is built. That is unless your goal is to make it impossible to audit and enable fraud.
The difference is there are ways of writing a voting system that can be audited, and if you do it in a way where each ballot is a record, suddenly the fraud becomes more (not impossible but) auditable and traceable.
For example, you could take 2% (or even 0.5%) of the ballots in a district, and check them against the database-record for that ballot. If you find a single mismatch, and verify that it was counted incorrectly or doesn't exist, you have enough evidence to initiate an investigation, and most likely throw out the entire automated count.
I'm obviously only describing a small slice of such a system, or how you could audit it (I'm not building such a system at the moment, nor care to write a book on the topic. I'm aware there are many other edge cases to explore, like it creating fake records where no ballot exists, etc, but there are various ways you could test that.
If you used a standard database, like postgresql to store records, you could always run manual queries on the database to verify (for example) the software maybe accurately stored all the votes, but decided to fake the count.
If I wasn't working on another anti-censorship software-project full time (which is arguably many times more complex), I think there could be a business opportunity here and it's arguably not a difficult problem. Just if anyone here is considering doing it, please don't build another counting machine.
It's still a counting machine. My post was not a list of requirements for it. Sorry you got that impression.
Unless it calls for immediate executions and multiple life terms per conviction I don't care
Its called VOTER REFORM! A strongly worded letter isn't going to cut it. There are drastic changes that need to be made to prevent this from happening again. Democratic strongholds will squeal, threaten and refuse to cooperate. This must be a state wide mandatory change.
Start by cleaning up the voter rolls!
Voter ID
Stretching Gretchen will block it
Are politicians gonna pol, and try to fix something without the input of data analysts like that MIT dude ?
They need to get a bill passed and signed by Trump before (if) Biden gets in, or they never win another majority.
AFTER the criminals go to jail... Absolutely
Trying to organize a campaign to rig a federal election should be a death sentence.