Law and order police don't restrict tax paying citizens from entering their state’s legislature. It would protect them and their freedom of speech as they voiced their issues. Instead they protect the corrupt politicians.
The police are the enforcers of unconstitutional orders/mandates/laws. You want to keep sucking them off, go for it, but leave me out of it. Until officers are arresting officers on the street when they violate the rights of citizens and the neighboring departments quit hiring the officers fired from their last departments, then I might have a better outlook on police. Until then, they can fuck off and so can anyone that calls me an anarchist for not wanting them around.
The intent of the founders was to have a small, limited government with elected positions. To have a militia ready to act when needed, not a professional, full-time standing army on the streets of every town.
But you are still wrong about the “Wild West” bullshit. That is what politicians have been saying for years about allowing concealed carry, then open carry. That people will just draw their guns and start shooting. It was bullshit back before the luby’s shooting, it is bullshit today. The average person doesn’t ever want to have to shoot someone else. They just want to be able to protect themselves and their loved ones if the need arises. Anyone that spouts the ‘wild west’ nonsense is simply full of shit. The ‘wild west’ wasn’t even that wild. It was over exaggerated to sell movies and books. There were some large shootouts, there was the danger of being attack by natives and some criminals, but it wasn’t what the movies showed. People were just drawing their guns and shooting at every provocation. There are more guns being carried today, lawfully, than there were people in the ‘wild west.’ People aren’t being regularly shot in the street over minor altercations. The number of licensed carriers is at an all time high, where is the blood in the streets? It’s in places with huge police departments enforcing unconstitutional gun laws. Baltimore, chicago, Atlanta, nyc, DC, Detroit, etc......not in smaller towns with much less restrictive gun laws and much less “law enforcement” presence.
There were undoubtedly many details that weren’t recorded, but there are also likely just as many, if not more that were recorded incorrectly. And while there is a framework that keeps some from committing crimes, the are far more people that just don’t have the inclination to commit criminal acts in the first place. That would include shooting someone else over a disagreement. But there is also the old adage that an armed society is a polite society. When others may be armed, most will refrain from escalating a situation to a physical/violent level. If we as a society had better command of our emotions, better self discipline, arguments or irritations would rarely rise to the level of violence.
Once again, I never said anything about getting rid of all. There are elected law enforcement agencies at the local level that are much more accountable to the people. There are elected constables and sheriffs. You can’t seem to under that. Police are accountable only to the mayor/city council. The police chief/commissioner is appointed and will follow the will of the one that appoints them, whether or not that will is in line with the constitution. You are the one having trouble comprehending that. While some sheriffs are suspect, most people that don’t like the police are fine with the sheriffs for that reason. Accountability. Police are generally the agencies that gobble up all the federal funding they can get. They are generally he ones that overuse swat teams, to justify their budgets. They escalate things on purpose to justify arrests. They are the ones letting rioters burn down buildings while directing citizens straight at the agitators. Citizens they have kept from being able to protect themselves by enforcing unconstitutional gun laws. How fucking hard is it to understand that police departments are not the same thing as sheriff’s offices?
voat.co announced it's shuttering it's website on 12/25
I think it's causing a migration of the good folks, as well as the cockroaches.
I'm also sure that the shills that were being paid to post at voat should probably be reassigned to a new site (here, or the .win communities in general).
Anarchy is no solution, and we as a people are not disciplined enough to self police in many places (because of all the leftists).
Once we have cleaned house and have dealt with the total infiltration of communism in the Republic, then perhaps wide spread self policing would work. Until then it would add to the chaos already coming.
That being said, one of many reasons we are moving in a few weeks is our police force was co-opted by the left a few years ago. veteran cops were forced to retire early or chose to retire, and have been replaced by leftist antifa type thugs. Who now have authority and a badge to back them up. I refuse to tolerate that. So we are moving someplace sane, where the police force is decent.
BTW, historically, much of what people perceive of the wild west is inaccurate. While people carried guns just about everywhere, they didn't use them often. And they did generally have law enforcement officers.
And ultimately there has to be, paradoxically, less law. Much of the shit the government regulates, mandates and prohibits should not be handled by the feds in the first place, and much also doesn't belong in the state level.
It is nobody's business if someone wants to exclude paying customers from their business for any reason, for instance. In a free market, that should be their choice. Likewise, you should be able to hire and fire people as you wish.
the move will happen in a few weeks now actually, but we scoped the area out carefully and spent a few months there this summer on a fact finding mission while working. Made friends and contacts, lined up housing, etc..
In a free market, if you want to restrict your customers to purple haired furries, that is your right. It is also a great way to go out of business. As it stands now, the cancel culture is able to use regulatory and legislative jihad to put businesses OUT of business. Which they couldn't do if those laws and regulations were not in place as they are now.
When the founders said "freedom of association" that included commerce. For everyone.
But this ties in to why we must clean house and remove leftism from our culture and institutions of all kinds. Because we are now overrun with idiots who are able to force other people to comply with their personal delusions, cater to their personal illusion of grievances/oppression and other nonsense.
Hubby and I have travelled in Cali now and then working for people. beautiful state other than the leftists of course. I would love to see it as it was when I was a kid. I remember when Cali was indeed the Golden State. It was so nice way back in the day--other than the then small areas that were full of leftists. prosperous small businesses of all kinds, nice people. Sad to see what it is now.
Stossel is quite right. The theories he discusses frequently embody a lot of conservative principles. "Morality", self reliance, personal responsibility, discipline, critical thinking. Purposeful altruism and purposeful philanthropy are also a part of it.
Our founders envisioned a small federal government that would deal with the nuts and bolts of being a country--money, international trade, making war as needed (they were not fans of standing armies for good reason), post offices and such.
The states on the other hand would have the bulk of the power and function as sort of social and economic laboratories. So if a state came up with successful ideas, it would grow and other states could model those ideas in ways best suited to their circumstances. If a state went down the road to failure, they would be the only ones to suffer from their bad choices--because people would vote with their feet and leave.
Leftism is a toxic ideology, especially in its communist form. It removes the typical moral restraints our founders believed in. It also kills ambition and productivity, personal responsibility, self reliance, discipline and critical thinking. When everything is about "feelings"--you "feel" you are a different gender or species, you "feel" "the rich" (or anyone else) is stealing from you, etc., then logic tends not to be present.
Chaos, in and of itself, is an intrinsic part of life in any complex system. That's a math thing, a physics thing. A universal thing. But chaos isn't a bad thing necessarily at all. because all complex systems go through periods of chaos, and then settle into a higher or lower state of elegance if you will (in the mathematical sense). Chaos winnows out the unproductive and things that don't work,. If it happens to people capable of critical thinking, and discipline and other useful traits. You see chaos, you take steps to move through chaos intact, and you learn. And you settle to a new level. Unfortunately these days we are settling to lower levels rather than higher ones. Societal devolution sucks.
For the undisciplined however, (and leftists), it's not a good thing. They simply lack the mental and emotional framework to deal with the real world in a lot of ways. And so we end up devolving instead of evolving.
Well that IS astonishing and disturbing. I think the reason I haven't seen all this is because I often don't read past the headers.
These people are rebellious and set in their ideology using reasoning that is seated in anger and pain. They foment that anger disguised as slogans that sound profound.
They have been around since Cain killed Abel. I choose not to give them the attention they crave, but I respect those who try and lead them out of the dark.
Just an FYI, I am no anarchist. Just because WE THE PEOPLE enforce the laws doesn't mean you have anarchy.
There is nothing special about a police officer compared to you or I. The fact we give police officers a status to enforce laws that is above any other regular person is in fact classist, feudal in nature, authoritarian and goes against the constitution. The founding fathers didn't put the 2A in so that you could rely on the government to enforce the constitution. Law and order must be enforced by all citizens.
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke
A disengaged public who've given up their responsibility of enforcing law and order to other citizens is precisely the kind of situation that allows for tyrants and evil people to run rampant by letting the corrupt within our system rot away at our institutions.
The only people who should be enforcing law & order is we the people and there is no difference between you, I or a police officer. The entire concept of a police force is anti-freedom and doesn't belong in this country. The police force should be entirely defunded and every citizen should be deputized. If in your mind that means anarchy then you clearly don't have enough faith in your fellow man so it's time to clean house and get rid of the corruption within our republic.
You sound like you're a good person. We aren't going to clash. I'm sorry to say but people can be good or evil. You can have different opinions but that doesn't make you evil. Different morals on the other hand, now that is a problem. You cannot simply decry that cold-blooded murder is good and then have me accept that. If you committed such a murder then you should be arrested and no amount of mental gymnastics is going to change that. Morality is objective not subjective. These people in Chaz and the problem in our society I speak of are the people who've altered morality by promoting subjectivity and who do not act in a virtuous or just manner.
You think a government is any more just than you or I? They are more corrupt.
I'm actually fully counting on the evil people in Chaz and committing riots to keep at it so they can be brought to justice by the good men in society.
If Chaz and co. turns into a mob that cannot be stopped then this country was already lost because clearly they already run the show.
Hmm, I like your response. I'm sure if we were discussing things in person instead of this mechanism we'd probably come to an agreement. ideas are difficult to communicate this way over these complex topics. I think we probably want the same things.
I want a society that has proper checks and balances in place on centralized authority and I believe decentralizing it is the right way to go about it. Hence putting the power of law and order in the hands of the people vs. letting a centralized government dictate who has authority and who doesn't If the government becomes compromised, you lose your check and balance as we're seeing now. The more decentralized, while yes, there is more risk involved and overall perhaps more chaos, once an equilibrium is found with such a system the checks and balances in place over corruption IMO are much stronger and it's harder for any centralized authority to use its centralized power to oppress people like tyrants and start enacting immoral law & order.
Law & order is good but if the people who have the power to enact law & order no longer enact it in a just manner then law & order is irrelevant because it is unjust. I would rather have anarchy and justice than order and injustice.
Law and order police don't restrict tax paying citizens from entering their state’s legislature. It would protect them and their freedom of speech as they voiced their issues. Instead they protect the corrupt politicians.
The police are the enforcers of unconstitutional orders/mandates/laws. You want to keep sucking them off, go for it, but leave me out of it. Until officers are arresting officers on the street when they violate the rights of citizens and the neighboring departments quit hiring the officers fired from their last departments, then I might have a better outlook on police. Until then, they can fuck off and so can anyone that calls me an anarchist for not wanting them around.
The intent of the founders was to have a small, limited government with elected positions. To have a militia ready to act when needed, not a professional, full-time standing army on the streets of every town.
Who said I wanted to get rid of all law enforcement? Oh, that’s right! You made that jump. Like an idiot without a parachute.
But you are still wrong about the “Wild West” bullshit. That is what politicians have been saying for years about allowing concealed carry, then open carry. That people will just draw their guns and start shooting. It was bullshit back before the luby’s shooting, it is bullshit today. The average person doesn’t ever want to have to shoot someone else. They just want to be able to protect themselves and their loved ones if the need arises. Anyone that spouts the ‘wild west’ nonsense is simply full of shit. The ‘wild west’ wasn’t even that wild. It was over exaggerated to sell movies and books. There were some large shootouts, there was the danger of being attack by natives and some criminals, but it wasn’t what the movies showed. People were just drawing their guns and shooting at every provocation. There are more guns being carried today, lawfully, than there were people in the ‘wild west.’ People aren’t being regularly shot in the street over minor altercations. The number of licensed carriers is at an all time high, where is the blood in the streets? It’s in places with huge police departments enforcing unconstitutional gun laws. Baltimore, chicago, Atlanta, nyc, DC, Detroit, etc......not in smaller towns with much less restrictive gun laws and much less “law enforcement” presence.
There were undoubtedly many details that weren’t recorded, but there are also likely just as many, if not more that were recorded incorrectly. And while there is a framework that keeps some from committing crimes, the are far more people that just don’t have the inclination to commit criminal acts in the first place. That would include shooting someone else over a disagreement. But there is also the old adage that an armed society is a polite society. When others may be armed, most will refrain from escalating a situation to a physical/violent level. If we as a society had better command of our emotions, better self discipline, arguments or irritations would rarely rise to the level of violence.
Once again, I never said anything about getting rid of all. There are elected law enforcement agencies at the local level that are much more accountable to the people. There are elected constables and sheriffs. You can’t seem to under that. Police are accountable only to the mayor/city council. The police chief/commissioner is appointed and will follow the will of the one that appoints them, whether or not that will is in line with the constitution. You are the one having trouble comprehending that. While some sheriffs are suspect, most people that don’t like the police are fine with the sheriffs for that reason. Accountability. Police are generally the agencies that gobble up all the federal funding they can get. They are generally he ones that overuse swat teams, to justify their budgets. They escalate things on purpose to justify arrests. They are the ones letting rioters burn down buildings while directing citizens straight at the agitators. Citizens they have kept from being able to protect themselves by enforcing unconstitutional gun laws. How fucking hard is it to understand that police departments are not the same thing as sheriff’s offices?
voat.co announced it's shuttering it's website on 12/25
I think it's causing a migration of the good folks, as well as the cockroaches.
I'm also sure that the shills that were being paid to post at voat should probably be reassigned to a new site (here, or the .win communities in general).
Oh, lovely. Good folks are fine, but last thing we need is the cockroaches.
Anarchy is no solution, and we as a people are not disciplined enough to self police in many places (because of all the leftists).
Once we have cleaned house and have dealt with the total infiltration of communism in the Republic, then perhaps wide spread self policing would work. Until then it would add to the chaos already coming.
That being said, one of many reasons we are moving in a few weeks is our police force was co-opted by the left a few years ago. veteran cops were forced to retire early or chose to retire, and have been replaced by leftist antifa type thugs. Who now have authority and a badge to back them up. I refuse to tolerate that. So we are moving someplace sane, where the police force is decent.
BTW, historically, much of what people perceive of the wild west is inaccurate. While people carried guns just about everywhere, they didn't use them often. And they did generally have law enforcement officers.
And ultimately there has to be, paradoxically, less law. Much of the shit the government regulates, mandates and prohibits should not be handled by the feds in the first place, and much also doesn't belong in the state level.
It is nobody's business if someone wants to exclude paying customers from their business for any reason, for instance. In a free market, that should be their choice. Likewise, you should be able to hire and fire people as you wish.
the move will happen in a few weeks now actually, but we scoped the area out carefully and spent a few months there this summer on a fact finding mission while working. Made friends and contacts, lined up housing, etc..
In a free market, if you want to restrict your customers to purple haired furries, that is your right. It is also a great way to go out of business. As it stands now, the cancel culture is able to use regulatory and legislative jihad to put businesses OUT of business. Which they couldn't do if those laws and regulations were not in place as they are now.
When the founders said "freedom of association" that included commerce. For everyone.
But this ties in to why we must clean house and remove leftism from our culture and institutions of all kinds. Because we are now overrun with idiots who are able to force other people to comply with their personal delusions, cater to their personal illusion of grievances/oppression and other nonsense.
Hubby and I have travelled in Cali now and then working for people. beautiful state other than the leftists of course. I would love to see it as it was when I was a kid. I remember when Cali was indeed the Golden State. It was so nice way back in the day--other than the then small areas that were full of leftists. prosperous small businesses of all kinds, nice people. Sad to see what it is now.
Stossel is quite right. The theories he discusses frequently embody a lot of conservative principles. "Morality", self reliance, personal responsibility, discipline, critical thinking. Purposeful altruism and purposeful philanthropy are also a part of it.
Our founders envisioned a small federal government that would deal with the nuts and bolts of being a country--money, international trade, making war as needed (they were not fans of standing armies for good reason), post offices and such.
The states on the other hand would have the bulk of the power and function as sort of social and economic laboratories. So if a state came up with successful ideas, it would grow and other states could model those ideas in ways best suited to their circumstances. If a state went down the road to failure, they would be the only ones to suffer from their bad choices--because people would vote with their feet and leave.
Leftism is a toxic ideology, especially in its communist form. It removes the typical moral restraints our founders believed in. It also kills ambition and productivity, personal responsibility, self reliance, discipline and critical thinking. When everything is about "feelings"--you "feel" you are a different gender or species, you "feel" "the rich" (or anyone else) is stealing from you, etc., then logic tends not to be present.
Chaos, in and of itself, is an intrinsic part of life in any complex system. That's a math thing, a physics thing. A universal thing. But chaos isn't a bad thing necessarily at all. because all complex systems go through periods of chaos, and then settle into a higher or lower state of elegance if you will (in the mathematical sense). Chaos winnows out the unproductive and things that don't work,. If it happens to people capable of critical thinking, and discipline and other useful traits. You see chaos, you take steps to move through chaos intact, and you learn. And you settle to a new level. Unfortunately these days we are settling to lower levels rather than higher ones. Societal devolution sucks.
For the undisciplined however, (and leftists), it's not a good thing. They simply lack the mental and emotional framework to deal with the real world in a lot of ways. And so we end up devolving instead of evolving.
We are the pheasants on revolt.. Go figure
Wow I haven't seen them yet tonight. They seem to come in groups 😕
Well that IS astonishing and disturbing. I think the reason I haven't seen all this is because I often don't read past the headers.
These people are rebellious and set in their ideology using reasoning that is seated in anger and pain. They foment that anger disguised as slogans that sound profound.
They have been around since Cain killed Abel. I choose not to give them the attention they crave, but I respect those who try and lead them out of the dark.
Just an FYI, I am no anarchist. Just because WE THE PEOPLE enforce the laws doesn't mean you have anarchy.
There is nothing special about a police officer compared to you or I. The fact we give police officers a status to enforce laws that is above any other regular person is in fact classist, feudal in nature, authoritarian and goes against the constitution. The founding fathers didn't put the 2A in so that you could rely on the government to enforce the constitution. Law and order must be enforced by all citizens.
A disengaged public who've given up their responsibility of enforcing law and order to other citizens is precisely the kind of situation that allows for tyrants and evil people to run rampant by letting the corrupt within our system rot away at our institutions.
The only people who should be enforcing law & order is we the people and there is no difference between you, I or a police officer. The entire concept of a police force is anti-freedom and doesn't belong in this country. The police force should be entirely defunded and every citizen should be deputized. If in your mind that means anarchy then you clearly don't have enough faith in your fellow man so it's time to clean house and get rid of the corruption within our republic.
You sound like you're a good person. We aren't going to clash. I'm sorry to say but people can be good or evil. You can have different opinions but that doesn't make you evil. Different morals on the other hand, now that is a problem. You cannot simply decry that cold-blooded murder is good and then have me accept that. If you committed such a murder then you should be arrested and no amount of mental gymnastics is going to change that. Morality is objective not subjective. These people in Chaz and the problem in our society I speak of are the people who've altered morality by promoting subjectivity and who do not act in a virtuous or just manner.
You think a government is any more just than you or I? They are more corrupt.
I'm actually fully counting on the evil people in Chaz and committing riots to keep at it so they can be brought to justice by the good men in society.
If Chaz and co. turns into a mob that cannot be stopped then this country was already lost because clearly they already run the show.
Hmm, I like your response. I'm sure if we were discussing things in person instead of this mechanism we'd probably come to an agreement. ideas are difficult to communicate this way over these complex topics. I think we probably want the same things.
I want a society that has proper checks and balances in place on centralized authority and I believe decentralizing it is the right way to go about it. Hence putting the power of law and order in the hands of the people vs. letting a centralized government dictate who has authority and who doesn't If the government becomes compromised, you lose your check and balance as we're seeing now. The more decentralized, while yes, there is more risk involved and overall perhaps more chaos, once an equilibrium is found with such a system the checks and balances in place over corruption IMO are much stronger and it's harder for any centralized authority to use its centralized power to oppress people like tyrants and start enacting immoral law & order.
Law & order is good but if the people who have the power to enact law & order no longer enact it in a just manner then law & order is irrelevant because it is unjust. I would rather have anarchy and justice than order and injustice.