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Pierre_Delectoes 50 points ago +50 / -0

That's not quite right. Its more "We wrote this bill, support it and we'll donate to your campaign. Don't support it and we'll donate to your opponent."

Even reps who might not want to take lobbying money are made to do it if they want to remain in office. What we need are not just limits on lobbying, but campaign SPENDING limits.

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lucifer_fit_deus 19 points ago +19 / -0

It may surprise many on this site that a system whereby government officials are elected is precisely what the ancient Athenians used the term “oligarchy” for and was considered by them to be undemocratic because it allowed positions to be bought.

Besides the fact that the rulers are corrupted by back door promises in exchange for campaign financing, the system engenders a select class of elites and their cronies as the only potential rulers who, without term limits, cannot be easily removed. In other words, political systems with elections lead to a “rule by a few”. Most people today think oligarchy refers to “rule by a few”, but there are not many that know it originally referred exactly to any electoral system.

The ancient Athenians, the creators of democracy, had a very different idea of what democracy was than the modern definition. It was NOT voting as a selection method for your government.

I will leave you to your own research if you want to find out more.

In any event, it can be argued that corruption is inherent to the system of electing people to government, whether you call that system democracy, representative democracy or a republic.

Today those systems are regarded as democracy throughout the world, even though it was considered to be undemocratic by the very creators of the original democracy.

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white_rabbit 1 point ago +1 / -0

Why do we even need "representatives" in the modern day and age? Every single American should be able to vote for every bill. The technical limitations are solved. The "representatives" don't even write, hell even read the bills they sign. So what is their purpose anyway?

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zedrexvsyrex 1 point ago +1 / -0

They actually are the only ones able to write spending bills.

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ProdigalPlaneswalker 6 points ago +6 / -0

Don't support it and we'll donate to your opponent.

Term limits would have fixed that.

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white_rabbit 1 point ago +1 / -0

Guess who votes on term limits? Yup.