Wind turbines also kill birds and destroy their natural flight path. Dams disrupt the natural flow of water.
I'm all for using alternative energy in a smart and logical manner, but that doesn't mean they should be a replacement to fossil fuels. They should all compliment eachother. Not be the end-all be-all replacement.
Wind turbines also kill billions of insects each day and play a huge part in mass insect death. They also emit infrasound, which can make animals and humans in the area very sick. Not to mention that huge solar parks in the desert completely destroy the flora and fauna living there.... the list of environmental destruction by the far-left is endless.
The worst thing about it is that they just don't care, because they are on a warpath of self-destruction and will do anything to achieve their goal.
Don't forget about all the bats being killed. And these are just the more easily identifiable problems.
The biggest problem we face in the regards of the environment is energy storage, our batteries are just crap, functionally an environmentally. Until we figure this out I strongly believe that we should slowly transition to nuclear energy for our power needs that don't require energy storage (like electric vehicles), so that all the infrastructure and culture can keep up. As of now getting rid of fossil fuels is debatable if it would actually have overall positive effects.
Thorium nuclear power plants seem very promising as an alternative to regular nuclear power and a lot of people seem to not know about it. This should serve us well and give us enough time until we figure out better and not so finite sources of energy.
If you think about it, it's just making a huge blender. I think the solution is to put a kind of scoop behind and a bowl then chip it off to all those foreign restaurants lefties worship and believe represent "value creation".
Nuclear waste comes from the ground. We dig it up, use it, then we bury it again. Starts and ends as toxic rocks. What's the problem with that? Don't want the bottom of a mineshaft to get irradiated?
It's a very small amount relative to the storage needed, and we have facilities built to house hundreds of years worth of volatile storage already built in Yucca Mountain repository.
That is why I'm hopeful about thorium. Have you checked it out?
Even then when it's done right radioactive waste management impacts the environment much less than wind turbines and especially hydropower among others.
If I remember the waste resulting from old and run down solar panels is on par or worse than nuclear waste. Then there's mining for nickel and some other component for batteries that is extremely damaging to the environment.
Nuclear waste actually isn't bad. Its just been turned into a boogey man because its not understood by the general population. Lobbyist groups and over regulation have hurt nuclear badly to the point that its extremely difficult to get a new nuclear plant approved. Nuclear reprocessing plants essentially eliminate nuclear waste to a fraction of what it was and allow the materials to be used longer or refined into other products that can be reused or safely disposed of.
Solar on the other hand produces extensive waste products that are not easily recycled and the panels themselves are currently non recyclable. The cost of grid upkeep for solar is also much higher than other forms of energy generation.
The anti-nuclear power groups (were they also funded by the Soviets like the anti-nuclear weapons protestors or was it coal & oil buying the smear?), along with the 3 Mile Island "disaster" and films like "The China Syndrome" really did a number to brainwash people. It's cleaner, safe, a stable source of electricity, and the disposal issues are massively blown out of proportion, even more so with reprocessing now.
Huh, the media pushed a false narrative about that too, who would have thought?
Problem is people never get taught the history of communism or progressivism in general, which is intentional since people are taught by progressives and communist sympathizers. They don’t want to teach about their historical failures.
With regard to environment, everyone should learn about the environmental destruction in the Soviet Union. But of course they don’t.
offshore wind and the impact to fishing and marine mammals are another issue. biden's commerce sec raimondo is from RI, where they pushed the first offshore wind farm in the country. It was only made possible by surcharges on everyone's bill to subsidize it, and the electric utility was forced by state mandate to buy the power generated at a higher than market rate.
Yup and I've heard that a better use of funds would be to simply plant trees. There is no need to force the hand of the free market. The market is already shifting to lower-carbon fuel sources. The biggest reduction in CO2 actually came from natural gas becoming cheaper than coal power. If you took the money that was invested into solar panels and instead diverted it to tree planting then the carbon offset would have been even larger.
I wish more "think tanks" and "problem solvers" thought like this.
Instead of "People are greedy. We need to force them to stop being greedy because greedy people do bad things."
Think "People are greedy, and the outcome of their actions is XYZ. We need to find ways to leverage that greed to make the outcome of actions ABC. And ABC is a trade-off from XYZ; we should look at both and see which is a better outcome for all stakeholders involved."
Yup, exactly. The left comes from an authoritarian point of view - "we know best, shut up and do what we say". That's why they're so quick to call opposing view points racist, bigot, conspiracy theorist etc.
I'm all for solar. If you want to be energy independent it's the way to go.
But the huge fields of it? Terrible use of space.
If you wanna be energy independent, learn to be a man and install the shit on the roof of your house, garage, and other buildings. It'll help your roofs last longer too. Buy as many batteries as you can. BOOM DONE.
tons of these methods impletmented wisely to augment the infrastructure and made in the usa are good ideas, BUT, cramming it down the publics theoat via mandate NOW! NOW! NOW! with no regard for sourcing or actual impact is just stupid. errrr....liberal. nobody on our side WANTS to fuck up the environment , but leave it to the left to mess up any advancement or legit improvement.
I had an assessment done this past summer for my house. In the end we opted to not go with it because the loan payments would be virtually the same as our current power bill, and the loan term was basically the same as the expected lifespan of the panels. Basically, there was no benefit other than potentially evening out the seasonal variations in energy costs. ... However, with POTATUS killing our energy independence, it might've been more cost effective in the long run.
When I was younger, and a little more idealistic, I worked for a Congresswoman. One of the events I had to drive her to was to announce a grant one of the local schools received to put in solar panels.
They got 500k for panels that would save the district 25k a year for the 20 year service life of the panels. In other words, there was absolutely no cost savings. That’s solar in a nutshell.
Exactly, the sales rep on my final call with them was trying to sell me on the moral benefits of solar. (I guess ignoring the future impact of the materials they're made from.) When I told him I couldn't see any ROI, he basically confirmed that was true.
Around here you can voluntarily double your power bill if you want and they promise to only send you green electrons. Then I guess you can brag to your friends about how you doubled your power bill to use “green energy”.
The Cincinnati Zoo put in panels over their parking lot. They get power and you get a cooler car on a hot summer day. I work for a company that supplies their seedlings for the gardens. They pump the exhaust heat from the primate enclosure into the greenhouse to heat it. The only downside is that the flowers smell like monkeys.
Yeah implementing tax breaks for homeowners who do these kinds of projects (assuming the power grid is capable of feeding excess back in the system, etc) would be a godsend. I know there are some already, but instead of giving money and contracts to China to destroy viable land for solar farms, why not keep it here?
spez: According to nerdwallet, the generous federal tax credit will be set to expire at end of this year. How much you bet Biden doesn't extend it for fear of losing out on valuable tax revenue to give to illegals?
With the tax breaks, the solar companies add it on to your bill like its free money for them. Had a company come out and do a quote, they came back with a 18k figure, but after tax breaks, it was to be like 10k. I looked up all the parts of the package, and it legit was less than $5k for the panels and everything. If they said $5k for install/engineering it would have came to a $2 grand and I would have went with it.
They never quote it like a contract job where each part is itemized. They give you an install figure and then work back to a pay back time frame of like 10 years and talk about free electricity in the mean time.
This is how most things that get a government subsidy work. Instead of decreasing costs, the company says I have x customers at this price already, this means I will have x customers + additional profit and raise their prices so after the subsidy is accounted for its back down to the price it was before.
They built it on bad ground and didnt install the backup generators above sea level or install them high enough. Were talking g basic engineering g here that was pushed aside.
They weren't changing out the stale diesel fuel with fresh either, so even the generators that weren't obliterated by the tsunami had trouble functioning.
Solar farms are garbage. Many places classify them as 'farm use' or 'open space' so they get tax breaks, but they clear cut the land and grade it flat. There are all sorts of water run off issues for anyone that lives near one. Roof top solar is fine, and if you are leasing out highway meadians for solar thats one thing, but they level forests and convert farm land to these industrial scale solar projects.
Solar over packing lots would be great, you give people shade and you are making use of an area that’s already water impermeable. Same with roofs as you mentioned.
Wind farms are by far the most land intensive form of energy. Also one of the weakest. They kill birds and the rotating blades makes bats lungs explode from the drop in pressure while the massive network of roads required destroys wildlife habitats.
Wind power is the biggest joke in electrical generation. Its the power production model we used before electricity. Its dark ages era technology and older. Wind power is a huge step backwards. It may have a few niche applications but by and large its absolutely not viable for most modern applications.
Depressing AF. Massive solar panel farm in my old hometown. Nobody lives there. Whoever dumped money into this shit in a 5sqmi town are criminally insane. Just the manpower to clean the panels and the maintenance in a very inhospitable climate (super hot,humid, constant heavy rains) won't be able to produce enough electricity to cover the costs. It will always be in the red. Never make any money and taxpayers will be stuck with broken windows all over the fucking place.
They pick these small towns as its easy for them to manipulate the governments there. I've seen small towns put in regulations that solar doesn't fit with the towns development plans, and the solar companies try to sue the shit out of the town to get their way. A small town probably doesn't have the resources to fight that. They are looking for easy areas to buy the government, or bully either way.
They have been building it for years. Still not operational. It's just a land fill of glass paid for by one of the poorest states in the country. Pathetic. People need to go to jail. Massive fraud.
I hadn't thought about the bullying small town government angle. Where I'm from these solar panels companies are buying up farm land all around me and starting to build. Guess who's selling? Conservative farmers selling out for a buck. They lock you in to a payment plan deal for 30 years and with inflation they'll be paying you pennies in a few years. This has been burning me up lately.
My grandmother in law sold my father in laws inheritance (The farm) to a solar panel company and is locked in to a flat rate for 30 years. She saw the dollar signs and threw away a lifetime of promises.
Yup and per usual the libs will say, "we will just recycle the panels!!!"....forgetting that the same thing was said about electronics in the early 1990s and we can all see how great an idea of electronics recycling works.
See what I don't get about government solar panel plans is that they spend million on one giant field of them instead of breaking them down and just putting them on the tax payers roofs. Would be less harmful to the environment and it would immediately show electric bills to go way down. Instead they make a oven of solar panels that literally cook birds in midair
DNC is lobbied by "renewable" companies, and the RNC is lobbied by Big Oil. Nobody lobbies for nuclear power because there's no money in solving the problem.
It sounds like a good idea until you realize they increase the house price by 20k to pay for the solar panels on the roof....Do take note of the #1 gripe that Californians usually have: housing too expensive.
These environmentalists are the definition of useful idiots. They really think the likes of Biden and Buffet don’t want the pipeline because of any environmental impact.
If you still think that logical argument and debate will win the day against the left, I have a bridge to sell you too. The left wants their agenda pushed forward by any means necessary, including violence, and total destruction. Until you realize this fact, you are just pissing in the wind politically and will never accomplish anything of permanence.
Bro, you can talk to them, if you use the right language.
Sometimes they don't understand English.
So you can use the special language that they always understand. If you don't speak it yet, you can learn it.
The language is called „Lead“, also known as „Pb“.
Fuck that. It's called rhetoric. You back rhetoric up with facts. Not everyone will listen, but I'd rather grind my whole life for a 1 k/d than get stuck playing single player
Solar panels still have a long way to go on efficiency as well. It always makes me sick when people use science as a political weapon for personal gain by lying or exaggerating the truth, yet those losers don't understand the social consequences of instantaneously stopping usage of fossil fuels.
Even when it's not used as fuel, we still need oil as a raw material for a bunch of necessary products (including medicine). So we would still need to transport it, and get a benefit from doing so through a pipeline. There is no environmental aspect to this question.
libs live in magical fairy land where green energy is 100% environmentally friendly... i mean its in the name GREEN... ENERGY! It's GREEN! It can't be bad! Oil is BLACK! It must be bad! I associate the color green with positive things like mother earth! Black is icky and evil!
It is Lever Logic. Use lies to propagate Commie ideals, Lies as a Lever to subvert Freedom.
Any situation to attack the Constitution or Belief in God and Justice.
I observed a Family member using this technique on two other members. We never went back after that.
Well we haven't done anything Constitutional since this country started and the Kalergi Plan is being used to pack the USA with new citizens that have no idea what The US Constitution is or how to apply the Bill of Rights.
To build the solar panels they had to cut down all these old trees called Joshua trees that can live to 1000 years old. I highly recommend the "Planet of the Humans" documentary if you can track it down. Produced by Michael Moore of all people. But highly redpilling indeed.
Man, this is just insane. I've been flying a lot in the new Microsoft Flight Simulator. Was flying around California the past few days. There are massive pieces of land dedicated to wind turbines and solar farms, and they look completely out of place. You have these beautiful mountains and landscapes, and then these valleys absolutely destroyed by solar & wind turbines. I started doing a little research, and it appears there'll be 500k acres of solar panels just from farmers who are converting their farms into solar because California's water policies prevent them from being able to irrigate their crops properly. They'll cut anywhere from 25% to 50% of their total agriculture from the state. The irony of "saving the planet" by covering a million acres of beautiful landscape into unsightly solar & wind is just insane to me. And they're only covering around of 14% of their energy needs with this bullshit.
Ask them how much dirty oil was needed to build just one of those panels let alone the whole farm? Probably more oil than goes thru the entire XL pipeline in 3 months
Think about it. They have to dig up, and move entire cities worth of dirt to get the rare earth elements used in these things. That costs oil
This is the "hidden, sunken cost of leftist ignorance"
Does the left prefer frying birds with solar panels more than slicing them apart with fans? Do we know yet? I'm still waiting on them to get back with me.
As the windmills are bird Cuisinarts, the solar panels are bird fryers. Birds land on those thinking it's water and the massive heat burns them, often killing them.
Killing the pipeline will not kill the need for oil. It will simply mean we'll have to continue using Warren Buffets trains to transport it, at a much higher cost and greater environmental risk. Killing the pipeline is all bad with no good.
Do they actually say that? How can an underground pipeline destroy a habitat? It won't leak anything to the surrounding area. Plants will grow above it, and animals will walk above it. I don't know the only animals that could be slightly affected would be moles or something.
I learned this playing Sim City 2000 when I was a teenager. It's not rocket science. But the left can't consider more than a single variable at a time.
A lot of good farmland has been lost to these damn things in our state. While I can't fault farmers for making what I assume is life-changing amounts of cash for selling their land, seeing farmland disappearing especially while facing food shortages pisses me off to no end. Plus, the solar companies here all seem to be deeply connected with a certain political party so the whole widespread conversion of farmlands to solar farms just smells like dirty kickbacks to me. Plus many if not all of them don't connect to the local grid and the service technicians aren't locals, so the locals see no benefit and just get to sit helpless by and watch their rural landscapes ruined, runoff problems, and reductions in farm jobs.
they are supposed to put em on roofs, have a battery backup, and supplement a residence running off the grid, to reduce grid push out, and ideally, cause some grid push in. Its insane to think they can replace coal and fossil fuels, when they are made by the dirtiest black coal and powered by the grid. Unless you are off grid with your own source, or your power requirements are minimal, you would still do not want to rely on single source and single supplemental energy. Geez.
God bless ya pedes.
God, these solar panels companies are buying up farm land all around me and starting to build. Guess who's selling? Conservative farmers selling out for a buck. They lock you in to a payment plan deal for 30 years and with inflation they'll be paying you pennies in a few years. This has been burning me up lately.
Wind turbines also kill birds and destroy their natural flight path. Dams disrupt the natural flow of water.
I'm all for using alternative energy in a smart and logical manner, but that doesn't mean they should be a replacement to fossil fuels. They should all compliment eachother. Not be the end-all be-all replacement.
Wind turbines also kill billions of insects each day and play a huge part in mass insect death. They also emit infrasound, which can make animals and humans in the area very sick. Not to mention that huge solar parks in the desert completely destroy the flora and fauna living there.... the list of environmental destruction by the far-left is endless.
The worst thing about it is that they just don't care, because they are on a warpath of self-destruction and will do anything to achieve their goal.
Don't forget about all the bats being killed. And these are just the more easily identifiable problems. The biggest problem we face in the regards of the environment is energy storage, our batteries are just crap, functionally an environmentally. Until we figure this out I strongly believe that we should slowly transition to nuclear energy for our power needs that don't require energy storage (like electric vehicles), so that all the infrastructure and culture can keep up. As of now getting rid of fossil fuels is debatable if it would actually have overall positive effects.
Thorium nuclear power plants seem very promising as an alternative to regular nuclear power and a lot of people seem to not know about it. This should serve us well and give us enough time until we figure out better and not so finite sources of energy.
Energy storage? Uh-oh, you've had too much to think today. Off to the camp you go!
If you think about it, it's just making a huge blender. I think the solution is to put a kind of scoop behind and a bowl then chip it off to all those foreign restaurants lefties worship and believe represent "value creation".
Spot on. We're still waiting for that breakthrough in fuel cell tech that makes this stuff more practical.
Nuclear waste comes from the ground. We dig it up, use it, then we bury it again. Starts and ends as toxic rocks. What's the problem with that? Don't want the bottom of a mineshaft to get irradiated?
The solution to pollution is dilution.
It's a very small amount relative to the storage needed, and we have facilities built to house hundreds of years worth of volatile storage already built in Yucca Mountain repository.
That is why I'm hopeful about thorium. Have you checked it out? Even then when it's done right radioactive waste management impacts the environment much less than wind turbines and especially hydropower among others.
If I remember the waste resulting from old and run down solar panels is on par or worse than nuclear waste. Then there's mining for nickel and some other component for batteries that is extremely damaging to the environment.
Nuclear waste actually isn't bad. Its just been turned into a boogey man because its not understood by the general population. Lobbyist groups and over regulation have hurt nuclear badly to the point that its extremely difficult to get a new nuclear plant approved. Nuclear reprocessing plants essentially eliminate nuclear waste to a fraction of what it was and allow the materials to be used longer or refined into other products that can be reused or safely disposed of.
Solar on the other hand produces extensive waste products that are not easily recycled and the panels themselves are currently non recyclable. The cost of grid upkeep for solar is also much higher than other forms of energy generation.
The anti-nuclear power groups (were they also funded by the Soviets like the anti-nuclear weapons protestors or was it coal & oil buying the smear?), along with the 3 Mile Island "disaster" and films like "The China Syndrome" really did a number to brainwash people. It's cleaner, safe, a stable source of electricity, and the disposal issues are massively blown out of proportion, even more so with reprocessing now.
Huh, the media pushed a false narrative about that too, who would have thought?
Yeah I know nuclear isn't the boogeyman most make it out to be, I'm just trying to recall an article I read a couple years ago.
Cadmium, I think
Lithium. They're using lithium ion batteries now. Lithium mining is nasty unless you leach it into brine.
Problem is people never get taught the history of communism or progressivism in general, which is intentional since people are taught by progressives and communist sympathizers. They don’t want to teach about their historical failures.
With regard to environment, everyone should learn about the environmental destruction in the Soviet Union. But of course they don’t.
And don't forget about when the EPA severely polluted a river.
There was a mirror array in the southwest that instantly "charcoaled" birds in flight if they took the wrong track...
https://inhabitat.com/the-worlds-largest-solar-plant-is-frying-birds-should-we-worry/
I want to see the impact on water fall around wind turbine locations. Mountain ranges change airflow, what about turbines?
offshore wind and the impact to fishing and marine mammals are another issue. biden's commerce sec raimondo is from RI, where they pushed the first offshore wind farm in the country. It was only made possible by surcharges on everyone's bill to subsidize it, and the electric utility was forced by state mandate to buy the power generated at a higher than market rate.
I haven’t even thought about offshore fishing. I am concerned our windmills in the Midwest are going to kill waterfall in the breadbasket
Interesting
Your logical argument was noted and ignored by the left.
and then censored so nobody can be exposed to the truth....
Yup and I've heard that a better use of funds would be to simply plant trees. There is no need to force the hand of the free market. The market is already shifting to lower-carbon fuel sources. The biggest reduction in CO2 actually came from natural gas becoming cheaper than coal power. If you took the money that was invested into solar panels and instead diverted it to tree planting then the carbon offset would have been even larger.
I wish more "think tanks" and "problem solvers" thought like this.
Instead of "People are greedy. We need to force them to stop being greedy because greedy people do bad things."
Think "People are greedy, and the outcome of their actions is XYZ. We need to find ways to leverage that greed to make the outcome of actions ABC. And ABC is a trade-off from XYZ; we should look at both and see which is a better outcome for all stakeholders involved."
Yup, exactly. The left comes from an authoritarian point of view - "we know best, shut up and do what we say". That's why they're so quick to call opposing view points racist, bigot, conspiracy theorist etc.
That’s way too rational and way too focused on actual results vs ideological fantasy. Obviously you need to be shadowbanned.
You mean like "common sense energy reform"?
I'm all for solar. If you want to be energy independent it's the way to go.
But the huge fields of it? Terrible use of space.
If you wanna be energy independent, learn to be a man and install the shit on the roof of your house, garage, and other buildings. It'll help your roofs last longer too. Buy as many batteries as you can. BOOM DONE.
tons of these methods impletmented wisely to augment the infrastructure and made in the usa are good ideas, BUT, cramming it down the publics theoat via mandate NOW! NOW! NOW! with no regard for sourcing or actual impact is just stupid. errrr....liberal. nobody on our side WANTS to fuck up the environment , but leave it to the left to mess up any advancement or legit improvement.
I had an assessment done this past summer for my house. In the end we opted to not go with it because the loan payments would be virtually the same as our current power bill, and the loan term was basically the same as the expected lifespan of the panels. Basically, there was no benefit other than potentially evening out the seasonal variations in energy costs. ... However, with POTATUS killing our energy independence, it might've been more cost effective in the long run.
When I was younger, and a little more idealistic, I worked for a Congresswoman. One of the events I had to drive her to was to announce a grant one of the local schools received to put in solar panels.
They got 500k for panels that would save the district 25k a year for the 20 year service life of the panels. In other words, there was absolutely no cost savings. That’s solar in a nutshell.
Exactly, the sales rep on my final call with them was trying to sell me on the moral benefits of solar. (I guess ignoring the future impact of the materials they're made from.) When I told him I couldn't see any ROI, he basically confirmed that was true.
Around here you can voluntarily double your power bill if you want and they promise to only send you green electrons. Then I guess you can brag to your friends about how you doubled your power bill to use “green energy”.
The Cincinnati Zoo put in panels over their parking lot. They get power and you get a cooler car on a hot summer day. I work for a company that supplies their seedlings for the gardens. They pump the exhaust heat from the primate enclosure into the greenhouse to heat it. The only downside is that the flowers smell like monkeys.
I read your boom as the batteries exploding.
I wouldn't mind if they covered parking lots with them. Some shade on the car in summer would be nice.
But covering up grasslands? Insane.
Followup question: How many trees were cut down to make room for that field of solar panels?
Oh, those trees don't matter. But don't you dare rip one leaf off anything in the Amazon!
Yeah implementing tax breaks for homeowners who do these kinds of projects (assuming the power grid is capable of feeding excess back in the system, etc) would be a godsend. I know there are some already, but instead of giving money and contracts to China to destroy viable land for solar farms, why not keep it here?
spez: According to nerdwallet, the generous federal tax credit will be set to expire at end of this year. How much you bet Biden doesn't extend it for fear of losing out on valuable tax revenue to give to illegals?
With the tax breaks, the solar companies add it on to your bill like its free money for them. Had a company come out and do a quote, they came back with a 18k figure, but after tax breaks, it was to be like 10k. I looked up all the parts of the package, and it legit was less than $5k for the panels and everything. If they said $5k for install/engineering it would have came to a $2 grand and I would have went with it. They never quote it like a contract job where each part is itemized. They give you an install figure and then work back to a pay back time frame of like 10 years and talk about free electricity in the mean time.
This is how most things that get a government subsidy work. Instead of decreasing costs, the company says I have x customers at this price already, this means I will have x customers + additional profit and raise their prices so after the subsidy is accounted for its back down to the price it was before.
Nuclear power has entered the chat.
But you're scary because some poorly run nuclear plant in a communist shithole exploded almost 4 decades ago.
They built it on bad ground and didnt install the backup generators above sea level or install them high enough. Were talking g basic engineering g here that was pushed aside.
And even then, struck by a massive earthquake and tsunami, the result wasn’t that bad.
If you consider all the deaths from fossil fuel burning, pollution causing cancers, birth defects, lung diseases etc, nuclear is way safer
They weren't changing out the stale diesel fuel with fresh either, so even the generators that weren't obliterated by the tsunami had trouble functioning.
“Guys, all you have to do is unshackle me.. then you can witness the power of UNLIMITED POTENTIAL.”
I think you mean.... UNLIIIIIIMITED POWEEEEEER!!!!
GO NUKE OR GO FOOK!
Solar farms are garbage. Many places classify them as 'farm use' or 'open space' so they get tax breaks, but they clear cut the land and grade it flat. There are all sorts of water run off issues for anyone that lives near one. Roof top solar is fine, and if you are leasing out highway meadians for solar thats one thing, but they level forests and convert farm land to these industrial scale solar projects.
Solar over packing lots would be great, you give people shade and you are making use of an area that’s already water impermeable. Same with roofs as you mentioned.
This ^ Alternative energy sources are a good thing when they're SENSIBLY implemented - which is never the case with government mandate!
Solar roads!
Wind farms are by far the most land intensive form of energy. Also one of the weakest. They kill birds and the rotating blades makes bats lungs explode from the drop in pressure while the massive network of roads required destroys wildlife habitats.
Wind power is the biggest joke in electrical generation. Its the power production model we used before electricity. Its dark ages era technology and older. Wind power is a huge step backwards. It may have a few niche applications but by and large its absolutely not viable for most modern applications.
Depressing AF. Massive solar panel farm in my old hometown. Nobody lives there. Whoever dumped money into this shit in a 5sqmi town are criminally insane. Just the manpower to clean the panels and the maintenance in a very inhospitable climate (super hot,humid, constant heavy rains) won't be able to produce enough electricity to cover the costs. It will always be in the red. Never make any money and taxpayers will be stuck with broken windows all over the fucking place.
They pick these small towns as its easy for them to manipulate the governments there. I've seen small towns put in regulations that solar doesn't fit with the towns development plans, and the solar companies try to sue the shit out of the town to get their way. A small town probably doesn't have the resources to fight that. They are looking for easy areas to buy the government, or bully either way.
They have been building it for years. Still not operational. It's just a land fill of glass paid for by one of the poorest states in the country. Pathetic. People need to go to jail. Massive fraud.
I hadn't thought about the bullying small town government angle. Where I'm from these solar panels companies are buying up farm land all around me and starting to build. Guess who's selling? Conservative farmers selling out for a buck. They lock you in to a payment plan deal for 30 years and with inflation they'll be paying you pennies in a few years. This has been burning me up lately.
My grandmother in law sold my father in laws inheritance (The farm) to a solar panel company and is locked in to a flat rate for 30 years. She saw the dollar signs and threw away a lifetime of promises.
Be me > Buy house
_ 1 month later, wind farm rep visits
_ Listen as scumbag attempts to have me sign over my house and land... "Wind Rights" 😂😂
_ Realize real estate agents lied through omission. Christian my ass....
_ Today... surrounded by whoosh whoosh machines. Can't sleep.
Fuck progress....
The great irony is that all those solar panels couldn't even be manufactured without oil.
They also have to be transported from china...
Aren't they built from rare earth metals that mostly China controls?
That is true.
It's funny how they never mention the chemical byproduct of manufacturing panels, nor what raw materials needs to be dug up.
You forgot the piles of dead birds littering a field of wind turbines.
And the waste from used solar panels after 20 years is incredibly toxic. Meanwhile, plant life breathes CO2.
Yup and per usual the libs will say, "we will just recycle the panels!!!"....forgetting that the same thing was said about electronics in the early 1990s and we can all see how great an idea of electronics recycling works.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mleQVO1Vd1I
See what I don't get about government solar panel plans is that they spend million on one giant field of them instead of breaking them down and just putting them on the tax payers roofs. Would be less harmful to the environment and it would immediately show electric bills to go way down. Instead they make a oven of solar panels that literally cook birds in midair
DNC is lobbied by "renewable" companies, and the RNC is lobbied by Big Oil. Nobody lobbies for nuclear power because there's no money in solving the problem.
Just like Hawaii, if they already don't, they are going to tax you for having panels.
It sounds like a good idea until you realize they increase the house price by 20k to pay for the solar panels on the roof....Do take note of the #1 gripe that Californians usually have: housing too expensive.
It's like that on issue after issue with these left wing commies. Lies to create alternate realities to use them for power grabs.
All I see is: "How to microwave birds alive midflight."
These environmentalists are the definition of useful idiots. They really think the likes of Biden and Buffet don’t want the pipeline because of any environmental impact.
If you still think that logical argument and debate will win the day against the left, I have a bridge to sell you too. The left wants their agenda pushed forward by any means necessary, including violence, and total destruction. Until you realize this fact, you are just pissing in the wind politically and will never accomplish anything of permanence.
Bro, you can talk to them, if you use the right language.
Sometimes they don't understand English.
So you can use the special language that they always understand. If you don't speak it yet, you can learn it.
The language is called „Lead“, also known as „Pb“.
Fuck that. It's called rhetoric. You back rhetoric up with facts. Not everyone will listen, but I'd rather grind my whole life for a 1 k/d than get stuck playing single player
Solar panels still have a long way to go on efficiency as well. It always makes me sick when people use science as a political weapon for personal gain by lying or exaggerating the truth, yet those losers don't understand the social consequences of instantaneously stopping usage of fossil fuels.
Not to mention most of those arrays produce toxic by products
Lol you should see the windmill farms in Palm Springs, completely takes over miles and miles of hills
Also solar has a shelf life. They have toxic chem's in them that go straight in the ground bc you cant recycle them. Face slap
Even when it's not used as fuel, we still need oil as a raw material for a bunch of necessary products (including medicine). So we would still need to transport it, and get a benefit from doing so through a pipeline. There is no environmental aspect to this question.
libs live in magical fairy land where green energy is 100% environmentally friendly... i mean its in the name GREEN... ENERGY! It's GREEN! It can't be bad! Oil is BLACK! It must be bad! I associate the color green with positive things like mother earth! Black is icky and evil!
https://www.quora.com/How-much-oil-is-used-in-the-production-of-solar-panels
It is Lever Logic. Use lies to propagate Commie ideals, Lies as a Lever to subvert Freedom.
Any situation to attack the Constitution or Belief in God and Justice.
I observed a Family member using this technique on two other members. We never went back after that.
Well we haven't done anything Constitutional since this country started and the Kalergi Plan is being used to pack the USA with new citizens that have no idea what The US Constitution is or how to apply the Bill of Rights.
And soon a bunch of them will be owned by.....CHY-NA
To build the solar panels they had to cut down all these old trees called Joshua trees that can live to 1000 years old. I highly recommend the "Planet of the Humans" documentary if you can track it down. Produced by Michael Moore of all people. But highly redpilling indeed.
They don’t understand logic. They only listen to what the tv tells them.
The University of MN Law School covered much of their green space with solar panels. Lol
Man, this is just insane. I've been flying a lot in the new Microsoft Flight Simulator. Was flying around California the past few days. There are massive pieces of land dedicated to wind turbines and solar farms, and they look completely out of place. You have these beautiful mountains and landscapes, and then these valleys absolutely destroyed by solar & wind turbines. I started doing a little research, and it appears there'll be 500k acres of solar panels just from farmers who are converting their farms into solar because California's water policies prevent them from being able to irrigate their crops properly. They'll cut anywhere from 25% to 50% of their total agriculture from the state. The irony of "saving the planet" by covering a million acres of beautiful landscape into unsightly solar & wind is just insane to me. And they're only covering around of 14% of their energy needs with this bullshit.
Ask them how much dirty oil was needed to build just one of those panels let alone the whole farm? Probably more oil than goes thru the entire XL pipeline in 3 months
Think about it. They have to dig up, and move entire cities worth of dirt to get the rare earth elements used in these things. That costs oil
This is the "hidden, sunken cost of leftist ignorance"
Does the left prefer frying birds with solar panels more than slicing them apart with fans? Do we know yet? I'm still waiting on them to get back with me.
As the windmills are bird Cuisinarts, the solar panels are bird fryers. Birds land on those thinking it's water and the massive heat burns them, often killing them.
They're also burying un-recyclable wind turbine blades! https://returntonow.net/2020/10/26/wind-turbine-blades-are-piling-up-in-landfills/
Killing the pipeline will not kill the need for oil. It will simply mean we'll have to continue using Warren Buffets trains to transport it, at a much higher cost and greater environmental risk. Killing the pipeline is all bad with no good.
WTF.... look I like solar power as well as the next guy but... why don't we put them on top of buildings or in old parking lots?
communist have no sense
Do they actually say that? How can an underground pipeline destroy a habitat? It won't leak anything to the surrounding area. Plants will grow above it, and animals will walk above it. I don't know the only animals that could be slightly affected would be moles or something.
We know the answer to that is “no”.
I learned this playing Sim City 2000 when I was a teenager. It's not rocket science. But the left can't consider more than a single variable at a time.
If you covered every square inch of the Earth in solar panels and assumed it was the equator you still could not meet our daily energy needs.
Also, the average solar panel never pays itself off after its 20 year run. They are a net loss of energy.
Magical thinking.
Now let’s talk about “biomass” “green energy”....
A lot of good farmland has been lost to these damn things in our state. While I can't fault farmers for making what I assume is life-changing amounts of cash for selling their land, seeing farmland disappearing especially while facing food shortages pisses me off to no end. Plus, the solar companies here all seem to be deeply connected with a certain political party so the whole widespread conversion of farmlands to solar farms just smells like dirty kickbacks to me. Plus many if not all of them don't connect to the local grid and the service technicians aren't locals, so the locals see no benefit and just get to sit helpless by and watch their rural landscapes ruined, runoff problems, and reductions in farm jobs.
they are supposed to put em on roofs, have a battery backup, and supplement a residence running off the grid, to reduce grid push out, and ideally, cause some grid push in. Its insane to think they can replace coal and fossil fuels, when they are made by the dirtiest black coal and powered by the grid. Unless you are off grid with your own source, or your power requirements are minimal, you would still do not want to rely on single source and single supplemental energy. Geez. God bless ya pedes.
paving the road to Hell
God, these solar panels companies are buying up farm land all around me and starting to build. Guess who's selling? Conservative farmers selling out for a buck. They lock you in to a payment plan deal for 30 years and with inflation they'll be paying you pennies in a few years. This has been burning me up lately.
All that land wasted for unreliable, intermittent, unscalable forms of electricity production that still need backup power.....lol
Wouldn't you think these solar panels to be contributing to the global warming that is happening?
They do get very, very hot. Especially ones in the desert states.