That's fair but I think it's important for conservatives to realize how much they actually have in common with fascists also. The left doesn't vilify fascism as much as it does because they themselves are fascist. Antifa didn't start as a military wing of the communists because communism and fascism were the same thing (a conclusion right-wingers like to draw). There are significant differences.
One way to look at it is that Fascists understand natural law and attempt to use authoritarian means of the government to create a social structure that adheres to natural law. Communists on the other hand reject natural law and attempt to use authoritarian means to create an outcome that goes against natural law. Right-wingers of the type who consider themselves MAGA tend to be classical liberals or libertarians who generally speaking wish to create a society that follows natural law by having as little government as possible except to counter gross inequities (that often have a detrimental impact on society as a whole), thus the outcome will mimic natural law since little influence besides nature exists. Thus to an outsider, fascism and libertarians look similar in outcome, even if they are very different in liberty from government.
I don't know, at a certain point it seems like a fetish. Fascists didn't want to conform to natural law, as we do. They literally desired to create a "new man", totally loyal and obedient to the state, willing to do anything. Total domination and loyalty. They were fine with lieing to and manipulating their people to unite them. That's not natural.
However they had more traditional views on sexuality and family than the filthy communists. That's basically where it ends. They're collectivists without aspiring to holiness, hence it leads to the same place as the communists.
There are so many differences between us and the nazis, not the least of which is we are individualists, and they were diehard collectivists (demanding loyalty to the state over oneself or family)
Fascism is a form of collectivism. It is an alternative end goal opposite Communism but either can grow out of a Socialism base.
Giovanni Gentile based Fascism on his desire to implement his view of Marxism. Gentile was a Marxist.
Mussolini and Franklin Delano Roosevelt considered each other kindred spirits. JFK was a gigantic fan of Hitler and praised Nazism. It was only after the Holocaust came to light publicly that Leftist professors and intellectuals began the work of distancing themselves from Fascism.
This is why I hate this... If you talk to a fascist, the left has nothing in common with fascism. If you talk to a libertarian, the left and fascists are exactly the same.
It depends entirely on the perspective. I was trying to be balanced. The other guy is wrong about fascism but I wasn't going to get into it. Fascism is not collectivist. It's a well-balanced mixture of collectivism and individualism. The amount of control in a fascist State was actually much less than people realize but of course Nazi Germany and Italy during the war exhibited a lot more control, because even America and more liberal societies do in times of war.
Anyway, we could discuss it all night but to say the left and fascism have nothing in common is wrong from the perspective of a libertarian. Remember, libertarians only care about freedom from government and a fascist State is one that does exude much more government influence on people than modern America. Modern China for example is much closer to fascism than it is communism or the left and we can see how much control its government has compared to here.
I agree with your conclusion though. I personally have more in common with fascism than the left and here I am in MAGA territory.
The core of Fascism is collectivism. This was central to both Mussolini and Hitler. It only allows for a select few cronies to benefit under the state and they are controlled by the state. The Communist wants the factories to be run by the worker. The Fascist wants to let his friend who already knows how to run it do the work but not have a say in the direction of the work.
Fascism cuts both ways though. For example, most people here think that big tech should not be able to censor people, and want the government to step in and make it illegal. That's technically fascism; it's definitely not libertarianism. Of course they do all these mental gymnastics to try and justify it ("muh public square!") but it's fascism none the less. So, I say, we embrace fascism, and just make sure we're the ones that benefit from it.
Making and enforcing just laws isn't fascist. Big tech shapes the worldview of billions of people, it's unjust to let them lie and manipulate billions under the guys of "fact-checking.
Its not libertarianism either. Libertarianism is the billionaire and big corporations wet dream, but does nothing to maintain a healthy and strong nation.
What you and I desire is just conservatism. Willing to make and enforce wise and just laws for the benefit of the fabric of our people; in the face of a society and culture hellbent on degenerating and destroying itself. We're far right in the sense that we've lost so damn much ground in the last 40 years that now we're paying for the military to self mutilate, the arbiters of narrative are kool-aid haired degenerates that hate our country, and the our wealthy elite have more interest Chinese cash than helping their fellow citizens.
Fascism is as far from 1776 as 1776 was from bowing to a far away tyrant.
Good take, completely agree. I get tired of the words, just want people to understand how much they have in common with the fascists
That's fair but I think it's important for conservatives to realize how much they actually have in common with fascists also. The left doesn't vilify fascism as much as it does because they themselves are fascist. Antifa didn't start as a military wing of the communists because communism and fascism were the same thing (a conclusion right-wingers like to draw). There are significant differences.
One way to look at it is that Fascists understand natural law and attempt to use authoritarian means of the government to create a social structure that adheres to natural law. Communists on the other hand reject natural law and attempt to use authoritarian means to create an outcome that goes against natural law. Right-wingers of the type who consider themselves MAGA tend to be classical liberals or libertarians who generally speaking wish to create a society that follows natural law by having as little government as possible except to counter gross inequities (that often have a detrimental impact on society as a whole), thus the outcome will mimic natural law since little influence besides nature exists. Thus to an outsider, fascism and libertarians look similar in outcome, even if they are very different in liberty from government.
I don't know, at a certain point it seems like a fetish. Fascists didn't want to conform to natural law, as we do. They literally desired to create a "new man", totally loyal and obedient to the state, willing to do anything. Total domination and loyalty. They were fine with lieing to and manipulating their people to unite them. That's not natural.
However they had more traditional views on sexuality and family than the filthy communists. That's basically where it ends. They're collectivists without aspiring to holiness, hence it leads to the same place as the communists.
There are so many differences between us and the nazis, not the least of which is we are individualists, and they were diehard collectivists (demanding loyalty to the state over oneself or family)
Fascism is a form of collectivism. It is an alternative end goal opposite Communism but either can grow out of a Socialism base.
Giovanni Gentile based Fascism on his desire to implement his view of Marxism. Gentile was a Marxist.
Mussolini and Franklin Delano Roosevelt considered each other kindred spirits. JFK was a gigantic fan of Hitler and praised Nazism. It was only after the Holocaust came to light publicly that Leftist professors and intellectuals began the work of distancing themselves from Fascism.
This is why I hate this... If you talk to a fascist, the left has nothing in common with fascism. If you talk to a libertarian, the left and fascists are exactly the same.
It depends entirely on the perspective. I was trying to be balanced. The other guy is wrong about fascism but I wasn't going to get into it. Fascism is not collectivist. It's a well-balanced mixture of collectivism and individualism. The amount of control in a fascist State was actually much less than people realize but of course Nazi Germany and Italy during the war exhibited a lot more control, because even America and more liberal societies do in times of war.
Anyway, we could discuss it all night but to say the left and fascism have nothing in common is wrong from the perspective of a libertarian. Remember, libertarians only care about freedom from government and a fascist State is one that does exude much more government influence on people than modern America. Modern China for example is much closer to fascism than it is communism or the left and we can see how much control its government has compared to here.
I agree with your conclusion though. I personally have more in common with fascism than the left and here I am in MAGA territory.
The core of Fascism is collectivism. This was central to both Mussolini and Hitler. It only allows for a select few cronies to benefit under the state and they are controlled by the state. The Communist wants the factories to be run by the worker. The Fascist wants to let his friend who already knows how to run it do the work but not have a say in the direction of the work.
Fascism cuts both ways though. For example, most people here think that big tech should not be able to censor people, and want the government to step in and make it illegal. That's technically fascism; it's definitely not libertarianism. Of course they do all these mental gymnastics to try and justify it ("muh public square!") but it's fascism none the less. So, I say, we embrace fascism, and just make sure we're the ones that benefit from it.
Making and enforcing just laws isn't fascist. Big tech shapes the worldview of billions of people, it's unjust to let them lie and manipulate billions under the guys of "fact-checking.
Its not libertarianism either. Libertarianism is the billionaire and big corporations wet dream, but does nothing to maintain a healthy and strong nation.
What you and I desire is just conservatism. Willing to make and enforce wise and just laws for the benefit of the fabric of our people; in the face of a society and culture hellbent on degenerating and destroying itself. We're far right in the sense that we've lost so damn much ground in the last 40 years that now we're paying for the military to self mutilate, the arbiters of narrative are kool-aid haired degenerates that hate our country, and the our wealthy elite have more interest Chinese cash than helping their fellow citizens.
Fascism is as far from 1776 as 1776 was from bowing to a far away tyrant.
kool-aid haired degenerates
Yeah I guess I thought this would be a passing fad but nooooope.