Well, I'll agree to your definition of redneck and add on to my definition of hillbilly: hillbillies are the ones that have come up from rural and poor backgrounds and never turned their backs on where they came from. Where I live, most are white but we do have some black and even Latino hillbillies. For the most part they're pretty good folks who just want to be left alone to do their thing, which usually involves living out in the country or finding a way to get back out there. They're the ones who truly love fishing and hunting and the like. Rednecks are, like you said, the ones who want that lifestyle you described -- I have always given them a bit of the side-eye because they aren't from the countryside or haven't been for a long time...and most of them around here will not help a brother or sister out (something the hillbillies always do). To be honest, "redneck" around here is synonymous with bigoted, try-hard jackass, all smiles and Jesus while they stab you in the back. That's the definition of them around here. Maybe the definition your black friend thought of too. Words can mean different things to different people -- hillbilly probably means something different for you.
And yes, what you described as white trash is exactly what we've got around here -- they may not live in tar shacks (some of the poorer hillbillies have those), but they're some of the nastiest pos I've ever encountered. You were right to lock your doors...they're vile, the same as the worst in bad parts of the cities. White folks need to be as scared of them as non-white -- they're snakes, and no, you never know which way they'll go if you're unlucky enough to be around them (one of the reasons most of us around here would like to be able to defend our property).
Edit: sometimes they're not all that poor either -- most are great at playing the system; real masters at it...they just don't have shit to their names/can't pay their bills, won't feed/clothe their kids because they toss their money at drugs, booze, a half dozen jalopies with expensive rims, getting their nails and hair done, and parties.
Second edit: I'll add this because I don't want to come off offensive: you mentioned southern things w/ regards to rednecks (as defined around here to separate them out from the hillbillies, dirt farmers, and other associated townsfolk) -- that's part of the problem around here; I've seen some of the good ol' boys from the country club (there's a tell) doing the "I just love havin' good biscuits and sweet tea...blah, blah, blah" -- the jackass works as an operations manager for one of the big agri businesses in the area (who treat their workers like shit) and was born/raised in Wisconsin! He shouldn't try and fool people, and it doesn't work on quite a few (and other than him having money, he and his wife have the same morals as the white trash...none, maybe negative)
No offense taken, at all. It seems like my definition of hillbilly and your definition of redneck has successfully been defined by what media tells us. I have always pictured hillbillies as toothless, shoeless, and with a wicked side. I should have known better, but I will say that over the last few years I had begun to question if that was really real, and wondered if they weren’t just country folks, like what I know to be rednecks. (Even if they (rednecks did move out of the country- they usually try to find their way back to the country, like you mentioned.)
I’ve known river rats whose professional lives seems to be stealing. Their motto seems to be “if you’re dumb enough to let it get stolen, you don’t deserve it”. Yet they will plan to steal your boat/4wheeler/ranger with precise planning and multiple people involved, meaning not much you can do to prevent the theft except guard it yourself 24/7. Physically- they’re not violent, except the few fistfights, but they are thieves. I would say they fall in with poor white trash, but there not really poor. Just trash.
I do know black rednecks, and country black people around my way is perfectly normal. Large gardens, horses, 4-wheelers, hunting, and country music. They don’t play well with the nonsense of other people acting immoral 24/7, or even a moment of time. I don’t think they believe it reflects on them as a group, as it shouldnt, but they are quick to prevent their kids from bringing any of the modern-day victim narrative into their homes and lives. (Sadly- they are targeted as much as anyone else by their own people wanting to chase the narrative that black people don’t have agency.)
I was telling that friend of mine about a new restaurant I had been to. They asked me if there were any black people there. I had to think really hard, bc it just wasn’t something I noticed. She and I go out to eat all the time, and she told me she would never take me anywhere where I was the only white person, for safety reasons. Her implication was that I should never take her anywhere where she is the only black person. And I was a little taken aback by that. First of all, she just told me more about what black people think about white people than she thinks she did, and secondly, does she really believe that? I didn’t want to discount her feelings, so I just said okay. But that was another redpill moment when you realize just what media does to black (all) people. Even in the rural south, there is nowhere a black person can go and feel like they will ganged up on physically. I’ve lived here all my life. I know how white people think. I know people others would consider racist. I know people I consider racist (by today’s very broad definition), as in they openly attempt to keep a distance even when safety is not a factor- it’s just their preference. But would any of them ever hurt, cause a scene or harm, or embarrassment to a black person? No. Would they even get up and leave an establishment if one walked in? No? Would they give dirty looks? No. Would they stop patronizing the place? No. The only racism from whites to blacks that’s left these days is in passing. It’s an inner thought that says “these are not my people”, and don’t tell me who I can and cannot associate with. (Again/ a very broad definition)
And that’s way better than the (many times) angry, vile, & sometimes physical racism white and Asian people receive from black people. That truth may hurt- but it’s still the truth. Mexicans don’t seem to suffer it as much, bc they don’t take it, but they have that luxury being a minority of their own (in this country).
But, I mean, if it’s a toothless white trash person operating a food joint out of a tar shack- then yea, maybe I’d tell her not to go there😬
Like I said: different areas may have different definitions. I was just sharing what the local interpretation is. I realize it may be different where you're from; just like your definition of hillbilly is different from my own (I have a pretty nice set of chompers, although the bit about being shoeless isn't far off -- taking your shoes off was sort of a common thing after school or barn chores; I'm very accustomed to walking around barefooted; and I can be a sinner -- and can be wicked if I need to be: fighting fair is for suckers).
And there are definitely places I wouldn't take any black person (and vice versa, I know of plenty of places they won't take me -- and not because they're being snobby) -- it isn't as bad as it used to be, but there are still a few places where you might possibly get away with going to and coming out ok if you were white (although, don't wear clothes that might make you stick out, don't be a single female), but you shouldn't go near if you're not white. The not white folks from around here know them and steer clear; most white folks who don't want any trouble stay away for that matter as well.
Well, I'll agree to your definition of redneck and add on to my definition of hillbilly: hillbillies are the ones that have come up from rural and poor backgrounds and never turned their backs on where they came from. Where I live, most are white but we do have some black and even Latino hillbillies. For the most part they're pretty good folks who just want to be left alone to do their thing, which usually involves living out in the country or finding a way to get back out there. They're the ones who truly love fishing and hunting and the like. Rednecks are, like you said, the ones who want that lifestyle you described -- I have always given them a bit of the side-eye because they aren't from the countryside or haven't been for a long time...and most of them around here will not help a brother or sister out (something the hillbillies always do). To be honest, "redneck" around here is synonymous with bigoted, try-hard jackass, all smiles and Jesus while they stab you in the back. That's the definition of them around here. Maybe the definition your black friend thought of too. Words can mean different things to different people -- hillbilly probably means something different for you.
And yes, what you described as white trash is exactly what we've got around here -- they may not live in tar shacks (some of the poorer hillbillies have those), but they're some of the nastiest pos I've ever encountered. You were right to lock your doors...they're vile, the same as the worst in bad parts of the cities. White folks need to be as scared of them as non-white -- they're snakes, and no, you never know which way they'll go if you're unlucky enough to be around them (one of the reasons most of us around here would like to be able to defend our property).
Edit: sometimes they're not all that poor either -- most are great at playing the system; real masters at it...they just don't have shit to their names/can't pay their bills, won't feed/clothe their kids because they toss their money at drugs, booze, a half dozen jalopies with expensive rims, getting their nails and hair done, and parties.
Second edit: I'll add this because I don't want to come off offensive: you mentioned southern things w/ regards to rednecks (as defined around here to separate them out from the hillbillies, dirt farmers, and other associated townsfolk) -- that's part of the problem around here; I've seen some of the good ol' boys from the country club (there's a tell) doing the "I just love havin' good biscuits and sweet tea...blah, blah, blah" -- the jackass works as an operations manager for one of the big agri businesses in the area (who treat their workers like shit) and was born/raised in Wisconsin! He shouldn't try and fool people, and it doesn't work on quite a few (and other than him having money, he and his wife have the same morals as the white trash...none, maybe negative)
No offense taken, at all. It seems like my definition of hillbilly and your definition of redneck has successfully been defined by what media tells us. I have always pictured hillbillies as toothless, shoeless, and with a wicked side. I should have known better, but I will say that over the last few years I had begun to question if that was really real, and wondered if they weren’t just country folks, like what I know to be rednecks. (Even if they (rednecks did move out of the country- they usually try to find their way back to the country, like you mentioned.)
I’ve known river rats whose professional lives seems to be stealing. Their motto seems to be “if you’re dumb enough to let it get stolen, you don’t deserve it”. Yet they will plan to steal your boat/4wheeler/ranger with precise planning and multiple people involved, meaning not much you can do to prevent the theft except guard it yourself 24/7. Physically- they’re not violent, except the few fistfights, but they are thieves. I would say they fall in with poor white trash, but there not really poor. Just trash.
I do know black rednecks, and country black people around my way is perfectly normal. Large gardens, horses, 4-wheelers, hunting, and country music. They don’t play well with the nonsense of other people acting immoral 24/7, or even a moment of time. I don’t think they believe it reflects on them as a group, as it shouldnt, but they are quick to prevent their kids from bringing any of the modern-day victim narrative into their homes and lives. (Sadly- they are targeted as much as anyone else by their own people wanting to chase the narrative that black people don’t have agency.)
I was telling that friend of mine about a new restaurant I had been to. They asked me if there were any black people there. I had to think really hard, bc it just wasn’t something I noticed. She and I go out to eat all the time, and she told me she would never take me anywhere where I was the only white person, for safety reasons. Her implication was that I should never take her anywhere where she is the only black person. And I was a little taken aback by that. First of all, she just told me more about what black people think about white people than she thinks she did, and secondly, does she really believe that? I didn’t want to discount her feelings, so I just said okay. But that was another redpill moment when you realize just what media does to black (all) people. Even in the rural south, there is nowhere a black person can go and feel like they will ganged up on physically. I’ve lived here all my life. I know how white people think. I know people others would consider racist. I know people I consider racist (by today’s very broad definition), as in they openly attempt to keep a distance even when safety is not a factor- it’s just their preference. But would any of them ever hurt, cause a scene or harm, or embarrassment to a black person? No. Would they even get up and leave an establishment if one walked in? No? Would they give dirty looks? No. Would they stop patronizing the place? No. The only racism from whites to blacks that’s left these days is in passing. It’s an inner thought that says “these are not my people”, and don’t tell me who I can and cannot associate with. (Again/ a very broad definition)
And that’s way better than the (many times) angry, vile, & sometimes physical racism white and Asian people receive from black people. That truth may hurt- but it’s still the truth. Mexicans don’t seem to suffer it as much, bc they don’t take it, but they have that luxury being a minority of their own (in this country).
But, I mean, if it’s a toothless white trash person operating a food joint out of a tar shack- then yea, maybe I’d tell her not to go there😬
Like I said: different areas may have different definitions. I was just sharing what the local interpretation is. I realize it may be different where you're from; just like your definition of hillbilly is different from my own (I have a pretty nice set of chompers, although the bit about being shoeless isn't far off -- taking your shoes off was sort of a common thing after school or barn chores; I'm very accustomed to walking around barefooted; and I can be a sinner -- and can be wicked if I need to be: fighting fair is for suckers).
And there are definitely places I wouldn't take any black person (and vice versa, I know of plenty of places they won't take me -- and not because they're being snobby) -- it isn't as bad as it used to be, but there are still a few places where you might possibly get away with going to and coming out ok if you were white (although, don't wear clothes that might make you stick out, don't be a single female), but you shouldn't go near if you're not white. The not white folks from around here know them and steer clear; most white folks who don't want any trouble stay away for that matter as well.