According to the Md examiner, normally in any other case Floyd would have died with that level of drugs. But in this case it was the cops who killed him.
-The med examiner admited that he had certified Fentonyl ODs with 3-4 times less than what Floyd had.-
I guess the cops can stop carrying narcan now, because a knee to the back can cure a fatal drug overdose, but then that same knee turns around and kills you.
They measured it from blood. Route doesn't matter then. It takes more to get that blood concentration from oral, then smoke, then injection. If I drink a 5th of vodka or stick a 1/2 5th up my ass, still same blood concentration.
My point was bioavailibility of various routes of ingestion don't matter since you are measuring it in blood. Opiates and alcohol do in fact both cause physical dependence because the body compensates for the foreign manipulation of receptors. Even so, that tolerance has bounds. The likely time for an addict to od is AFTER detox. Because they use the amount they used before and their body has already decompensated for that.
Since he ODed the month before and was hospitalized, it would be germane to know ng/dl then. Even so, even a heroin addict using for years can OD if he takes too much heroin or takes a mixture that has fentanyl for which he has acclimatized to.
9ng/ml is 3x therapeutic dose. Even so, Kirby may have acclimatized to not dying from it. No intelligent being could argue in good faith that it, along with the metabolites of fentanyl, and the meth didn't significantly threaten his life. If he was clean would the officers on his back have killed him. I seriously doubt that. If he had those levels and was not arrested, would he have lived, maybe. At least his gf "mumma", may have had an opportunity to get him into medical care without the physical exertion and time delays introduced by the interaction with the cops. Most likely, if he had narcan injected while he was still alive, he would have survived the encounter.
If we treated addicts like they have a terrible disease instead of criminally, that may have prevented his death as well. To heap all the blame on Chauvin is narrow minded and willfully ignorant of the facts. There were a chain of events that culminated with the trigger point of the LEO enforcement. There are many links in that death chain that were entirely Kirby's doing, as well as our failure as a society to reduce harm and prevent the onslaught of cheap CCP fentanyl pumped into this country. To China this is payback when the Western Governments did the same to them with opium.
Also wouldn’t tolerance play a role here? Someone who’s been addicted to an opioid for a long time can take a dose that would absolutely cause your average person to OD. A hotshot for person A might not be enough to get person B well.
I wouldn't hold my breath. In a normal world I think any conviction here would stand a high chance of being overturned. But as we have seen over the last 4 years courts are increasingly not relying on the law, they are making political and social decisions that fit with their worldview inspite of any legal argument to the contrary
The defense has their turn probably starting next week. So we shall see.
In my honest opinion though, manslaughter is a reasonable conviction. I don’t think Chauvin set out to kill him. And Floyd had a lot of other ways to die that day. Even the restraint was fine by itself. But refusing to check a pulse, and refusing to move once they couldn’t find one - that’s inexcusable really. Crosses the line into negligence which resulted in a death.
According to the Md examiner, normally in any other case Floyd would have died with that level of drugs. But in this case it was the cops who killed him.
-The med examiner admited that he had certified Fentonyl ODs with 3-4 times less than what Floyd had.-
I guess the cops can stop carrying narcan now, because a knee to the back can cure a fatal drug overdose, but then that same knee turns around and kills you.
Most Fentanyl overdoses are from snorting or injecting.
The low bioavailability when taken orally makes it tough to say what's a lethal dose. But the burden of proof is supposed to be on the State
They measured it from blood. Route doesn't matter then. It takes more to get that blood concentration from oral, then smoke, then injection. If I drink a 5th of vodka or stick a 1/2 5th up my ass, still same blood concentration.
Opioids are different. They cause overdoses because of their interaction with the Opioid receptors. It doesn't poison you like alcohol
That is how Narcan works. By preventing the Opioid receptors from activating, you can't overdose.
That is why tolerance matters for Opioid overdoses. With alcohol, you become tolerant to the effects, but the lethal amount does not change
My point was bioavailibility of various routes of ingestion don't matter since you are measuring it in blood. Opiates and alcohol do in fact both cause physical dependence because the body compensates for the foreign manipulation of receptors. Even so, that tolerance has bounds. The likely time for an addict to od is AFTER detox. Because they use the amount they used before and their body has already decompensated for that.
Since he ODed the month before and was hospitalized, it would be germane to know ng/dl then. Even so, even a heroin addict using for years can OD if he takes too much heroin or takes a mixture that has fentanyl for which he has acclimatized to.
9ng/ml is 3x therapeutic dose. Even so, Kirby may have acclimatized to not dying from it. No intelligent being could argue in good faith that it, along with the metabolites of fentanyl, and the meth didn't significantly threaten his life. If he was clean would the officers on his back have killed him. I seriously doubt that. If he had those levels and was not arrested, would he have lived, maybe. At least his gf "mumma", may have had an opportunity to get him into medical care without the physical exertion and time delays introduced by the interaction with the cops. Most likely, if he had narcan injected while he was still alive, he would have survived the encounter.
If we treated addicts like they have a terrible disease instead of criminally, that may have prevented his death as well. To heap all the blame on Chauvin is narrow minded and willfully ignorant of the facts. There were a chain of events that culminated with the trigger point of the LEO enforcement. There are many links in that death chain that were entirely Kirby's doing, as well as our failure as a society to reduce harm and prevent the onslaught of cheap CCP fentanyl pumped into this country. To China this is payback when the Western Governments did the same to them with opium.
Also wouldn’t tolerance play a role here? Someone who’s been addicted to an opioid for a long time can take a dose that would absolutely cause your average person to OD. A hotshot for person A might not be enough to get person B well.
"The surgery was a success, but the patient died."
Will Chauvin win his appeal then? This trial is such a farce
I wouldn't hold my breath. In a normal world I think any conviction here would stand a high chance of being overturned. But as we have seen over the last 4 years courts are increasingly not relying on the law, they are making political and social decisions that fit with their worldview inspite of any legal argument to the contrary
The defense has their turn probably starting next week. So we shall see.
In my honest opinion though, manslaughter is a reasonable conviction. I don’t think Chauvin set out to kill him. And Floyd had a lot of other ways to die that day. Even the restraint was fine by itself. But refusing to check a pulse, and refusing to move once they couldn’t find one - that’s inexcusable really. Crosses the line into negligence which resulted in a death.