We were enslaved by sociopathic bankers in 1913. At that time, they were funding the Bolshevik insurgency in Russia, and Germany as well.
The initial German communist revolution was stunted, and after nearly 15 years of trying, they were ultimately defeated by Hitler and the Nazis, who actually saved the European continent from being swept over by the Bolsheviks. (The high command then went on to infiltrate the US State Department via Project Paperclip after the war, forming the CIA and unleashing global instability for the next 70+ years. So don’t make the mistake of purporting that I am glorifying the German National Socialist movement.)
TLDR: we are ruled over by the children and grandchildren of both the Nazis and the Bolsheviks, who both serve banker class that first formed the Federal Reserve in 1913. Their goal is to turn us into a nation of debt slaves.
He was a marxist, numbnuts. A vegetarian plannedparenthood type. There was nothing in europe to save. You're probably right about the rest. No offense.
Taxing property is the most unethical form of taxation that has ever existed.
Tell that to any normie though and they will tell you " but but but it pays for skooolzz"
So the ends justify the means I say, then explain that there are plenty of ways to pay for government schooling.
But on the bright side, if you don't pay and they do seize your house, you get a free prison cell with free food. So you'll end up in the new world order either way. 🤡
Just look at what they are doing to the farmers in the Netherlands. Forcing them to sell their real assets for their freshly printed money that loses value daily. Just wait until people make a run on the banks for their money only to find out the bank doesn't have it all or won't give it all to you depending on the amount.
Was thinking about a similar thing yesterday. Most people (the majority?) own nothing. If someone has a mortgage, they don't own their house, the bank does. If someone has car payments, they don't own their car. The bank does. If someone has a ton of credit card debt, they don't own the things they "bought" with that fancy card. The bank does. Gee....I'm seeing a pattern here.
I'm the closest I can get to "owning" my house. Paid in full and no mortgage, but you're right. Still paying property taxes for life. What a fucked up system that we're all slaves to. Slavery never truly went away, it just transformed.
Actually, you could really own a car and not pay for license, registration or gas taxes. But you couldn't legally drive it on public roads. Which does really cut into the usefulness of the vehicle.
That's how they tricked everyone into believing you must have those things, but the law only invokes the Commerce Clause for such authority to license.
Actually, you could likely use a motor vehicle for commerce, yet not have it licensed or registered. If you own a large farm, or ranch, you could in theory purchase a pickup truck, and have it trailered to your property. You could use that pickup for all sorts of farming uses, and as long as it stays on private property, it should need a license plate or registration.
Well, I got some good news for you guys: the more land you buy, the less tax you can pay on it to a certain degree.
I was looking at a 200+ acre property with 3,000 in property taxes. You could cut down SIX trees per year and pay that off but that's not really my point. My point is that's more than it costs to have 0.5 acres and a house just in the town over.
So what I'm here to tell you is the US .gov just wants to incentivize you to buy MORE LAND. Y'all feeling what uncle sam is putting out for you? Can you feel the thunder?
maybe here is a good place to throw in what is going on in the stock market. people have found out that "brokers" do at least two things you certainly didn't expect:
they keep "your" stock in the market's name. When you buy a stock on Wall Street, they keep the stock under the self-regulating name of "Cede and Co," and you are simply a "beneficiary." If the SHTF you will probably not be included in the sale of it. Sure for now you can "sell" it and they will take your beneficiary status off, but that's probably because you are selling at a loss or a small gain that they can absorb.
several brokers allegedly don't even buy stock for you. (and I use the word "allegedly" to be honest but 99% sure it will be true.) They just keep the number on the books and plan to pay you out the difference between your buy and sell price. So they don't even register you as a beneficiary. Companies like eToro are caught up in this. what it means is you pay the money and never get anything except an IOU from your broker. On bankruptcy, we'll see how that plays out!
wallstreetbets already found out how that works with their stock stunt. You get shafted because you don't actually own it. They had to use a different, more expensive and much slower system, to actually register the stocks in their name.
It’s sort of like when I hear investment gurus refer to different investment packages as, “products”. No, they’re not. It’s a service, not a tangible good. We outsourced most of our product manufacturing overseas over the course of the past few decades. Without a strong manufacturing base, we cannot maintain superpower status, A combination of greed and and lack of patriotism are at the heart of our nation’s decline
Services can be legitimate value adds. Restaurants are services. They don't produce new food, they cook and serve existing food. But it's a legitimate thing that added value.
Financialization isn't even a service. It's better considered to be repackaging. It's like going to Costco, buying a bulk pack of candy bars, and reselling them individually. Nothing has been created, and no utility has been added.
“The grain” has shifted from a “product”’s original definition. I’m just bringing it back to its original meaning. The reason? Because money is just representative of services, and, most importantly, goods (products). You can have all the money in the world, but without hard assets (goods), it’s basically worthless. Imagine a financial collapse that brought us back to a traditional barter system of trade. What would you rather have? Food, water, clothing, and shelter, or a digital printout of your bank account? Ultimately, our national defense depends on our ability to produce tangible products. Our entire existence as a nation depends on it.
Then just use the word "goods" which we all agree only refers to physical items. "Products" can be goods or services. Both, by the way, have intrinsic value, so I still don't understand the point of the distinction you're trying to make, let alone how the word "product" has any effect on any of this Judaism.
Nah. “Product” is just a term used to make people feel like they created something other than punching keys or pushing paper. A book is a product. The writing is not.
This is where your argument becomes outright nonsense. This is wrong. Ignoring the issue of quality, it takes time and effort to create writing and convey information.
That's not how it works at all. Learn "Prisoners Dilemma"
Once Usury is introduced into an economic system, it is in every single individuals interest to get loans to gain property rights over things of real value. Those who don't LOSE money. So the rational move is for every individual to take loans.
However here is the catch, when everyone takes out a loan, then EVERY single individual in society is worse off than they were before usury was introduced. Hence the prisoners dilemma: The best action for the individual, hurts everyone if applied for everyone.
The people who invented Christianity had to shit in a hole in the ground. You're free to go live like that any time you please. Just leave the rest of us alone with our indoor plumbing.
That's not why interest rates are going up. Interest rates are going up because they printed so much fucking money in order to keep interest rates down that it started showing up as price inflation. So now they put the brakes on the printing hoping to stop the inflation. But there's no stopping it. The rates required to stop this inflation would be so high that it would make all debts unpayable, including government debts. This is the endgame.
The printing of the fiat is what causes the 'unreasonable' interest rate which defines usury. By devaluing the fiat, it essentially raises the interest rate. No co-incidence on who's doing it to boot.
Loaning out money that was printed out of thin air is usurious no matter what interest rate is applied. It has an infinite increase compared to the zero cost of origination.
So how was it that the prime rate mortgage crisis and loan fiasco that happened in 2008 effected me too, even though I had never had a loan in my life at that time?
This is not true. Printing money causes inflation and the devaluing of the fiat currency. The only way to reign in inflation is to RAISE interest rates.
Fun story: one of the biggest land owners in the us made his fortune selling off-brand cigarettes (he had or started pretty much every brand besides big tobacco like marlboro, many you can still see off-brand in gas stations today). He used all that money to buy land and he eventually cashed out to live out the rest of his life camping and woodsing about like a millionaire hermit of sorts.
Banks has always been a fraud, tho not nearly as bad back then as today.
Another factor to consider is that houses back then had less regulations and bureaucracy and could therefore first of all be built much cheaper and faster. Secondly when bidding on a house, the other bidders would only be able to big with money they actually have, instead of a promise of maximal loan amount like today.
Compare houses and their actual realistic value vs their market value which is the winning bid, houses are way overpriced today because of loans with no backing.
Am not a finance wiz, but from the beginning it struck me that if Bitcoin threatened the monopoly bankers, it would be eliminated. Never had the gut to invest.
That’s why the inventor used an alias and remained anonymous - bankers will start literal wars to protect their monopoly.
Bitcoin, to my knowledge, is the first time they’ve faced a threat they cannot defend against in the normal ways. It’s the first viable competitor/alternative to their system of control.
When you sit back and think about it, it’s truly a beautiful thing
It cannot be seized. No central control means no one to strong arm into handing over your money
it cannot be censored. You can transact with anyone anywhere in the world. Can’t be cancelled.
it can be carried with you anywhere in the world in your head. Try escaping with your gold bars and cash. Not so easy!
I think these things will become more important as governments continue with their efforts to control every aspect of our lives.
There is very much the risk that it could be eliminated but it has survived all threats, perceived and real, thus far.
History is littered with stories of people overcoming opponents that seem impossible to defeat. 1776 comes to mind.
One of the great things about Bitcoin is how divisible it is so if you’re so inclined you can get just a little bit of exposure to it, instead of having to bet the house on it
Might disagree that crypto can't be seized, censored, regulated. Powers that be can pass any law, ignore any law, sniff every packet, punish or cancel any participant at their whim.
Secondly, every Bitcoin transaction uses the amount of energy consumed by a small family in a month. Extremely slow and costly, taxes itself.
So far, govt. has tolerated crypto, as far as they can treat it as a taxable investment. You pay tax on Bitcoin you don't even spend, assuming you report it as required by law.
Looks like govts are moving toward cashless currencies of their own: that way they can track, block, seize, extort at will. Absolutely won't tolerate competition. See China, People's Republic of.
Yes, it’s insane how much homes cost relative to how cheap they are to construct. There is artificial scarcity in the housing market throwing the price up.
None of this was a problem until the government started to get involved for your own good.
The car has had death by a million cuts. Take the tire stem. They were 0.90$ each. Then the government decided you needed tire pressure monitoring systems and now they retail $50-90 each sensor valve and there is a receiver and added computer bullshit in the car. It’s crammed with shit you don’t want amor need by government requirements
I don't want electric windows. Every car, it breaks. I don't need AC. I don't need GPS. I don't need an ECM. I don't need a TV/DVD. I don't need power & heated seats.
That's the real problem. When people could only afford to pay out of pocket and savings, that's what set the prices and made them fair. It doesn't matter if I buy a house or car with straight cash or a bank loan, because it's all the same to the seller, and with inflation you aren't really saving much if anything by saving large sums of money to buy things, because by the time you've saved that much money, inflation has already matched or surpassed interest rates on a loan. Now everyone is just forced to be debt slaves to have anything. People buying houses they can't really afford, because they can sell it before it's paid off and make up the difference, meanwhile the next person takes on that debt. We don't really have debt payoff in this country, but rather, debt handoff.
50% down payment. 5 year baloon loan, which meant you needed to refinance every 5 yrs and hopefully for less principal or payoff the balance.
When we purchased our first house, 20% down plus closing costs was an unbendable rule. This worked to keep a lid on prices. The 100% mortgage and the ability to finance closing helped to accelerate prices.
No it didn't. First of all, if you hold your own keys, crypto is a real asset. Secondly, crypto coming online can't cause this. The only thing that causes this is printing fiat like there's no tomorrow.
Your crypto is tied to the arrangement of the bits, not the actual electrons floating around in the computer. You can store that arrangement on a piece of paper or in a deck of playing cards. Your power going out is not a problem at all. Only the whole grid going offline would make crypto worthless - but if that happens you got bigger issues to worry about.
Do you really own your gold? What happens when the government comes and seizes it?
2A? What if you lose your nerve? Didn’t they already seize gold once in the past?
Seems easier to seize physical gold from one individual than something that’s decentralized and would require a cataclysmic collapse of the entire power grid round the world at the same time
The “turn off the lights” scenario would require the entire worlds power and internet to be cut at the same time and stay down.
If that happens the gold in your prison wallet will be worth only its value as something heavy you can throw at or hit someone with to protect yourself.
When the time comes, your gold will be theirs. One way or another.
Scenario 1: they come and take it in an aggressive all out blitz
if it’s held in any kind of bank or vault the company will give it up in the blink of an eye.
it’s in your house. Knock knock. “We’re here to collect your gold”. They’ll find it and take it.
it’s in your house but you decide to take a stand. You take a few out. But storm trooper #3443 shoots you. You’re dead. And they’ve got your gold anyway. Congratulations.
Scenario 2: they declare due to extraordinary circumstances they need your gold. But it’s ok. They’ll “pay” you for your confiscated gold with an IOU. LOL.
Happened before and can happen again.
You hold gold because the government has decided they’re happy for you to hold onto their shiny rocks, for now.
Bitcoin on the other hand… with just a little bit of sense has the following benefits….
There’s no central bank or company to go intimidate to get them to hand it over
You can transport Bitcoin anywhere, even through checkpoints. Any amount. In your head, not in your prison wallet.
They can search your house, your car or your grandmas underwear draw. If they don’t have your keys, they ain’t getting your Bitcoin.
Maybe they declare it illegal since they can’t confiscate it like your gold… Gee that’d be concerning IF it wasn’t decentralized and as a result impossible to stop. It cannot be censored. I can send money to you or someone on the other side of the globe regardless of what a little tyrant government might say. And when whoever it is on the other end receives it, they are protected by the exact same benefits. Brilliant really.
Crypto is a digital fungible asset. Blame the scummy bankers like Bankman who use rigged markets to dictate global exchange rates, just like they rig the European energy market, the oil market, metals and everything else with real value.
Fungible was the word I meant to use. Value is not in what you can touch, but what requires actual work to produce. You can touch your own shit, that doesn't make it valuable because you can easily produce unlimited amounts of it.
Compare that to crops, metals or Bitcoin which you cannot just shit out or mint out of thin air. It requires work, different types of work but yet still work. And work is valuable because you sell your time.
It all boils down to speculation. Take coal for instance, and let's assume the year is 1860. You have some money and want to invest to make a profit. Now with the rise of the railroad coal is probably gonna go up in value right. So what you do is to buy as much coal as possible and put it in storage, then once the prices goes up due to more demand a few years later you sell it at profit.
This is the real and least harmful type of speculation. Now since the federal reserve and computers fake coal was implemented. That is someone who claims to have a warehouse full of coal, which you can now buy shares of virtually without having to move the physical coal.
Audits are not that good and although the coal warehouse owner claims you can withdraw your physical coal at any time, most people won't and hence nobody really knows if all the virtual coal is backed by real coal. This is the first level of fuckery that did more damage to the markets than in the past. Because it's virtual assets not backed fully by real assets with no ability to verify.
Now in recent years, future markets have risen. This is when you speculate with loans backed by thin air, on assets that doesn't even exist. Let's take an example, the year is early 2020, Trump is still president and gas prices are low, you want to speculate on gas prices so you buy gas on the future market.
Now all you can afford with the money you have is 1000 gallons, but on the future market you can somehow take out a loan and buy 3000 gallons or why not 10 000
gallons. This means, after Biden is installed, and gas prices doubles, you're not only doubling your profit, but makes 6 or 20 times the profit you would have made on regular more honest speculation.
But since there isn't that much gas, the prices on the real asset has to go up to cover your profit. Same thing works in the other direction obviously. If Trump is re-elected and opens up the new pipeline, let's assume for simplicity the gas prices would have halved, that means if you own gas on the futures market you're now in debt.
And wit this in mind, now you know why they so desperately wouldn't let Trump be re-elected. At least one of the reasons.
Last one is apparently Klaus Schwabs website. No idea if they're of any use but it could be a start. Plenty of videos exist that explains the fraudulent banking system, they also often cover future markets and other kinds of fuckery.
They can’t because they are making things up. The reality is the quantity of dollars in the system have increased which has an effect of making prices go higher since everyone at the auction (store) has more nominal wealth.
They don't play these games because they're stupid. They play these games so that they can push the prices of real assets down in order to buy them all. It's a big game of musical chairs and if you don't already have your chair right now, you are royally fucked when the music stops.
Where I live, both new and used vehicles are just too expensive with the cost of used vehicles not matching what you get. It's insane, but because of this, I eventually broke down and decided to do an engine swap instead of getting a new or used vehicle. The engine came wit a 3-year and or 100k mile warranty, and while it's far from perfect, it's better than getting in bed with another monthly payment without knowing what the used vehicle's problems might be. Making matters worse all around is the ongoing parts supply for both new and used vehicles, the shortages being something too few seem to even acknowledge let alone show any worries about.
There's so many things wrong with our country right now that I guess we should all count our blessings that nobody has found a way to tax air yet... I'm sure that's coming, too. Fuck all of this.
Same boat. Had to change pretty much entire car. Frame, suspensions, brakes, powertrain. Only parts that are original are body panels, interior, and engine. Still can't buy a new or used car with the same capabilities for even the money invested (which was considerable). It's crazy out here.
It was completely rusted. I didn't do anything, well, except I didn't remove the frame from the car and paint it every 5 years like I probably should have but that would have cost me time and money I didn't have so I just drove it. So I got a brand new frame, couldn't put the brakes back and a few other miscellaneous parts so I had to change all that. Then the suspensions went first in front then in the back, control arms, struts, the whole caboose. Then an issue I had with the axle reared its ugly head and that whole thing had to go. Road salt, bad weather, I didn't spray the underside of the car all winter because the water would literally freeze from the hose 4 months out of the year. I take some responsibility, I guess, but mostly it was combination of road conditions and they kind of messed up the coating on the frame. I like the new frame so far, I think it's properly done but I won't know for sure for a while. I know it's not coated how I'd like but a man has to live within his budget. Batteries, alternator, AC system, belts, you name it along the way. But I still love it. Only thing I think isn't perfect on it is no HEPA filters and seats aren't as comfy as I'd like. Sensors, exhaust, lol gonna stop talking about it now, it's making me sad.
I know the feeling, man. I had my engine swapped in my 2006 Colorado and when I got her back, I had an oil pressure sensor leak, then the ABS module went out, and then I had a radiator hose leak. I brought her in to have the ABS replaced, but they couldn't find any new modules for it, so I just lived with it being faulty since the errors went away (I think the shop reconnected or cleaned something to make them stop). Everything else was fixed. And I just took her to another shop to get the frame coated, and that didn't go over so well because the people there only coated the outside of the frame starting at the back of the cab to the end (basically undercoating only 50% of it, which seems stupid to me). It all cost $700 to do and given the entire frame lacked any protection, I guess anything is better than nothing. And I'm still dealing with a first-of-the-day start up issue that I think is injector-related.
I know, and I hate saying this but it's going to get worse...
The big manufacturers are deliberately exercising things like incrementalism and planned obsolescence more and more to keep reducing the number of years they have to provide replacement parts for, especially as they keep trying to transition over into electrification and the fewer parts they have to stamp out or mold equates to reduced production costs at their plants. The outcome is PURE BAD for consumers who wish to hang on to their vehicles for longer than 10 years, which people will be doing more and more of given the plight our current economy is in, the power of the dollar, etc. Given so few real fabricators exist now who can produce replacement parts for vehicles, well, you do the math.
What I hope will happen is that smaller shops, DIY'ers, etc. will eventually pick up the slack and increase investments into an ever-increasing market for things like automotive electronics, replacement parts that should be reproducible in small shops or garages using things like at-home forges, bench mills, 3D printers, lathes, etc. I do think it's gradually heading in that direction, but it's a slow roll as many need to tool up to compensate, to say nothing about the current lack of skilled staff who can do things like CAD, fabricate, and actually install things like engine swaps or tranny rebuilds.
It's going to get a lot worse before it eventually gets better. Hopefully in another 15-20 years, we'll see things take a turn for the better.
BRICS countries already own most of the natural resources and it will only get worse with more countries joining. Even Wikipedia admits way down the page on the BRICS they are going to not only take over the West but destroy it by 2050.
The US is not going anywhere but the heyday is steadily ending. Fed will eventually get weaker and weaker with no printing press. D.C. will eventually collapse and the Capitol moved.
If the dollar collapses then the ones hurt the most, besides us starving, are the banks and we all know they won't let that happen. Signal WW3 just like last time.
The banks control both sides of this "global conflict".
The "companies" in the west might be hurt, but the people on top of those banks will simply get lucrative jobs in companies in the east with their buddies.
Do you think the elites outsourced all production to the east for fun? They hate us and want us destroyed and they own those production companies in the east too.
They're waging war against us from within our nations and we are letting them.
Fun fact about the great depression: half the population had no idea it was even happening. HALF. No idea. Kids got bullied in school for it by their peers.
You have to look to holodomor and other atrocities to see it to the point where everyone feels it. And even then, oof, so many people for whom life just goes on like normal.
Easy sleazy, don’t get attached to material shit. That stuff comes and goes. Shut up, pay the man, die. Leave empty handed with just Jesus our Lord and savior hopefully saving our souls. Kinda says this shit will happen right in the Bible. Thanks
Well yeah. That's how it works. How do you supposed to grow wealth in a country if there's a finite amount of cash? I don't exactly know how it works, but the banks borrow and lend with the hope to be paid back, but that money isn't even that real because it's borrowed too. Doesn't seem like a great system but it's what we have. The direction of history is controlled by the "bankers. "
hardly irrelevant. it kept the banks at a reasonable size because they had to choose whether to do institutional banking or private banking but not both. Now the banks control the whole economy, especially inflation and interest rates are parts.
Yet another victim of leftist propaganda. Tell me exactly which banks merged after the partial repeal of Glass-Steagall, or which banks started engaging in both commercial and investment. I'll wait while you go look it up.
BZZZT wrong answer. BoA was the ONLY bank to do this, and they were one of the least full of bad assets during 2008/2009.
So, do you wanna drop the Occupy Berniebro shit yet and learn some actual economics? Or are we gonna keep repeating the same nonsense that AOC and Elizabeth Warren believe caused 2008?
All of those banks now operate commercial banking and investment banking arms, which would have been illegal under Glass-Steagall.
Your attitude is a real turnoff. Read my profile and you will see I am no lib. But Glass-Steagall was excellent legislation dismantled by the Clintons.
All of those banks now operate commercial banking and investment banking arms, which would have been illegal under Glass-Steagall.
Oh you mean decades after the crisis that this repeal is claimed to have caused? In other words, the partial repeal of Glass-Steagall has done fuck-all to damage anyone or anything? So why do idiots still talk about it like it's relevant? Why exactly are you in favor of the government telling private companies what services they can offer to customers? That's called communism, and we don't do that shit here.
just now figuring this out.......LIQUIDITY is the most valuable asset. My house & cars are all debt free. They are not huge or fancy but I can roll with the punches.
More like you have to gobble up other peoples broken dreams, and while there's no shortage of that....eventually there will be when people stop dreaming altogether. There's only so many carcasses to pick over, and everything is perishable on a big enough timescale, even homes. So one generation might have a lot of carcasses to pick over, but what about the next. Eventually it all crumbles.
Most people in the current generation are just living off of what was built by the previous generation, i.e. parents property, life insurance policies, etc. They're not getting decent jobs until the old generation goes, and their principle reliance on getting funds for a house comes in the form of debt they can pay off with the payouts from the deaths of their relatives and inherited estates. A generation that can only elevate itself on the leftovers of the previous.
That's not opportunity, that's cannibalization, and that spells doom for the generations to come, because eventually there isn't going to be anything left for future generations to cannibalize from the previous, it's all going to be used up and unable to be replaced.
This is basically what's happening in every city in America right now. It's what happened in Detroit. People are just living in the crumbling remains of a once great civilization, using up the last bit of it. Sure, a bit gets replaced here and there, but not enough to keep up with the degradation. That only slows the process.
A huge chunk of America's homes are already beyond or nearing their usable life, and as they crumble and fall apart, sure people will still be trying to live in them, but that infrastructure will crumble over a very short period of time, at around the same time, over the span of a few decades, revealing the full problem. Tens of millions of homes suddenly just poofed out of existence as they fall apart or are required to be torn down. And the more people try to stretch the shelf lives of these homes, the bigger the problem will be. It only delays and magnifies the inevitable.
And at that point, sadly, people will probably be all for the own nothing and be happy while living in a closet box like a worker drone, because it will be all they have. So we'll see these massive housing projects that put people into these apartments, being constructed all across the country. They'll hail it as a great work for the benefit of the people, when it will just be people locked in boxes like good worker drones. No way of life, no culture. Their culture will be the states politics and policies. Very little individual power, which means very little collective power. Just a dystopia painted as a utopia.
Fractional reserving yourselves to death, eh banksters?
Ponzi schemes can only work if there's infinite growth. Since the boomers every subsequent generation has been smaller than the last. It's only a matter of time until it goes boom.
They’re digital beanie babies with perceived value based on market manipulation and backed by nothing. Before you reee about fiat, I’m no fan of that either, but at least it’s backed by property and work.
Not other crypto - they’re shitcoins and are the same as fiat. Made up.
But Bitcoin, because it requires the expenditure of energy and computing resources to mine, by extension it would at very minimum be backed by the energy spent to mine it
Snarkiness aside, I appreciate it’s a flexible currency by itself. I used to buy shit online with btc when it was in the single-digit range. (For fuck’s sake, I still have a wallet with couple of coins on an old drive somewhere in my house that I can’t find.) But it turned into a scammy investment with exchanges pissing away the backing. The lower the value drops, the more exchanges will vaporize along with people’s money. In the end btc will be worth what it was before.
That’s assuming that the person on the receiving end of the transaction converts the Bitcoin to fiat
One day people will figure out when we get where we’re going you won’t need to convert to fiat
But at the moment it’s so hard for people to break the mental model of measuring bitcoin against fake fiat money.
Centralized Exchanges are a scourge. They are the antithesis of what Bitcoin was designed for.
The point is to cut out the scummy middle man. These collapses are an upsetting reminder of that
Bitcoin price will continue to fluctuate, as does the price of (pretty much) everything in a real market. Eventually people won’t bother looking at the price of Bitcoin vs Fiat because one Bitcoin is one Bitcoin. The same way you don’t look at the price of USD currently.
The value of crypto is in the ability to instantly transfer it anywhere in the world without a 3rd party. If you can accept that Western Union has value, then crypto also has value.
I don't accept that Western Union has value, short of the value we collectively place on it.
"without a 3rd party"
Man, glad I own all that dark fiber from here to India so that no one at any point could possibly stop my 1's and 0's. If I can do a direct peer to peer crypto move on my local LAN or PAN, then that's great and I could see that helping. But none of your crypto works if the lights go out and with all of the talk of "energy shortages" why would you double down on something that requires energy to even know exists?
I'd rather trade in twigs and matches at that point - at least then my asset can keep me warm. Maybe my understanding of "asset" is wrong, but the way I live my life is, "if the thing can't help me exist in this life, in and of itself, then it has little to no value".
Sure, money has value right now because I still buy food in cash and pay for my house in cash. Maybe it shouldn't have value, and if that is the case, then I hope that time comes soon. BUT, it does at this very second, or at least when I paid my rent 3 days ago it did.
Crypto might have real use and value. It is very cool what it allows us to do, but I can't pour crypto into my gas tank to take my hypothetical sick kid to the hospital. So AT SOME POINT should the world decay far enough, crypto is a bad choice...as is cash....as are cars (if fuel runs out).
But to me, crypto isn't an asset any more than stocks, loans or the money in my bank account.
So there's no value in being able to transfer money over large distances instantly? Stop being retarded please.
Man, glad I own all that dark fiber from here to India so that no one at any point could possibly stop my 1's and 0's.
Not relevant who owns the physical fiber.
But none of your crypto works if the lights go out and with all of the talk of "energy shortages" why would you double down on something that requires energy to even know exists?
Again, if the entire grid goes offline, you have bigger problems than "how will I buy stuff?"
Maybe my understanding of "asset" is wrong, but the way I live my life is, "if the thing can't help me exist in this life, in and of itself, then it has little to no value".
You are literally chatting on the internet, so stop pretending it has no value to you.
Crypto might have real use and value. It is very cool what it allows us to do, but I can't pour crypto into my gas tank to take my hypothetical sick kid to the hospital. So AT SOME POINT should the world decay far enough, crypto is a bad choice...as is cash....as are cars (if fuel runs out).
You can't do those things with gold or silver either.
So there's no value in being able to transfer money over large distances instantly? Stop being retarded please.
I'm not being retarded, I'm having an honest conversation. Yes it has a purpose, but have you looked at the world lately? We aren't fixing this shit show without things getting bad, like so bad your cell phone doesn't work because you have no way of charging it. Just ask the EU how their electrical grid is working.
Not relevant who owns the physical fiber.
With a comment like that, my theory is that you don't understand man in the middle attacks nor that it is incredibly easy to take down the internet in many parts of the world with a few well placed hunters with 12 bird shot.
Again, if the entire grid goes offline, you have bigger problems than "how will I buy stuff?"
Almost certainly, but not necessarily. Humanity has lived without the "grid" for the majority of our existence.
You are literally chatting on the internet, so stop pretending it has no value to you.
Who said it doesn't have value to me? Also, who said this conversation even has value to me?! I'm not saying it doesn't, I'm just saying you're making a lot of assumptions that are based on no actual facts about me.(Which begs the question, why are you making this personal? Like by calling me a retard?)
You can't do those things with gold or silver either.
No, but gold and silver can be handed to a guy who might have a spare 5 gal jerry can if the grid power is down. That hospital might then use the gold or silver I'm about to give them to buy the gas for THEIR generators. Don't confuse my point about gold or silver to be that there isn't a case where they are useless. I'm sure Adam and Even didn't need to trade gold or silver back and forth before having Able and Cain.
It seems as though you're making the assumption of crypto that all the underlying structures that allow it's operation will stay operational as they currently exist. You might not be wrong, but it is easy to imagine a world where you are. I'm also doing the same with literal physical items, but the required world to imagine is far, far more difficult to bring into existence.
But, that's a long way of getting to my point of, presumably you are a crypto user. You lost me when you attacked me personally instead of some retarded idea I may have had (and I have had more retarded ideas than good ones, I promise you that. Doesn't make me a retard). So you successfully didn't compel someone to join into the very situation that would help you.
From the outside it seems like you are actually against crypto by your own actions, because why would you want to turn people off to it if it is so helpful for you?
I'm not being retarded, I'm having an honest conversation. Yes it has a purpose, but have you looked at the world lately?
People will be more able to generate electricity after these governments crash.
With a comment like that, my theory is that you don't understand man in the middle attacks nor that it is incredibly easy to take down the internet in many parts of the world with a few well placed hunters with 12 bird shot.
You're the one who doesn't understand MITM attacks if you think you can MITM crypto. TX are encrypted on the client side, and no key exchange ever takes place. You can't MITM it.
No, but gold and silver can be handed to a guy who might have a spare 5 gal jerry can if the grid power is down.
And crypto can be handed to a guy 2000 miles away who might be able to store your files when the grid is up and you need those files off your physical devices because they implicate Hillary Clinton. Crypto can be smuggled across borders if you need to flee your tyrannical government and grids are up elsewhere.
It seems as though you're making the assumption of crypto that all the underlying structures that allow it's operation will stay operational as they currently exist.
No, you're assuming that they'll all disappear or somehow be in a state where crypto can't operate. There's no reason to assume any of that. The cables exist. The satellites exist. People will figure out how to use them without government. There will likely be more electricity generation without government.
From the outside it seems like you are actually against crypto by your own actions, because why would you want to turn people off to it if it is so helpful for you?
You are nobody to me. I give zero shits if you refuse to educate yourself. But when you say stupid nonsense on a public forum, I'm going to correct it.
And most people don’t own the real assets they do hold outright. Insane amount of debt on the books
Pay taxes on things you paid taxes on with money that's been taxed
We were enslaved by sociopathic bankers in 1913. At that time, they were funding the Bolshevik insurgency in Russia, and Germany as well.
The initial German communist revolution was stunted, and after nearly 15 years of trying, they were ultimately defeated by Hitler and the Nazis, who actually saved the European continent from being swept over by the Bolsheviks. (The high command then went on to infiltrate the US State Department via Project Paperclip after the war, forming the CIA and unleashing global instability for the next 70+ years. So don’t make the mistake of purporting that I am glorifying the German National Socialist movement.)
TLDR: we are ruled over by the children and grandchildren of both the Nazis and the Bolsheviks, who both serve banker class that first formed the Federal Reserve in 1913. Their goal is to turn us into a nation of debt slaves.
This guy gets it
Also removing the gold standard and the too-big-to-fail mantra of 08 didn't help either.
Yup. I tell folks: we didn't win WWII. We had a merger.
He was a marxist, numbnuts. A vegetarian plannedparenthood type. There was nothing in europe to save. You're probably right about the rest. No offense.
B...b....but he had "Socialist" in the party name so it must mean he loved Marxism!!!!
Into the garbage you go with all the socialists and collectivists. I understand the distinction just fine, fyi. You're all garbage.
Cool. You're a reductionist-- which is a sign of laziness and/or ineptitude. Go look that one up and get back to me.
We freed the blacks so they quietly put the chains on everyone not at the top.
Massa be up in DC laughin’ and laughin’
Like lottery jackpots?
Taxing property is the most unethical form of taxation that has ever existed. Tell that to any normie though and they will tell you " but but but it pays for skooolzz" So the ends justify the means I say, then explain that there are plenty of ways to pay for government schooling.
You're 100% correct, but you'll even get retards on this site defending the property tax. "How would we fund muh X and Y???"
Literally any other way. Perpetual rent to the fucking gubmint is one of the biggest piles of bullshit in existence. We're all still serfs.
Ha serfs had 10% tax. All in i probably pay 50%.
Property tax absolutely destroys the rate of return on an asset. When you see the impact over the long run it is an astronomical difference.
I had people on this site downvote me into oblivion and attack me for saying social security needs to be abolished
Lots of people love to be dominated by the government
This 👆
But on the bright side, if you don't pay and they do seize your house, you get a free prison cell with free food. So you'll end up in the new world order either way. 🤡
The prison cells will probably be bigger than the pods that Klaus Schwab wants us to live in
Could not agree more.
Everything should be funded with a consumption (sales) tax. No more hiding taxes by withholding or in mortgage payments.
You pay taxes for the schools so the teachers can brainwash your children. Sounds like a great idea..
Just look at what they are doing to the farmers in the Netherlands. Forcing them to sell their real assets for their freshly printed money that loses value daily. Just wait until people make a run on the banks for their money only to find out the bank doesn't have it all or won't give it all to you depending on the amount.
This is why they are currently working on rolling out CBDCs, a digital currency won't have to worry about bank runs
Was thinking about a similar thing yesterday. Most people (the majority?) own nothing. If someone has a mortgage, they don't own their house, the bank does. If someone has car payments, they don't own their car. The bank does. If someone has a ton of credit card debt, they don't own the things they "bought" with that fancy card. The bank does. Gee....I'm seeing a pattern here.
I'm the closest I can get to "owning" my house. Paid in full and no mortgage, but you're right. Still paying property taxes for life. What a fucked up system that we're all slaves to. Slavery never truly went away, it just transformed.
Gotta pay registration, license and gasoline taxes on your car too.
Don't really own that.
Actually, you could really own a car and not pay for license, registration or gas taxes. But you couldn't legally drive it on public roads. Which does really cut into the usefulness of the vehicle.
You can, just not for any purpose of commerce.
That's how they tricked everyone into believing you must have those things, but the law only invokes the Commerce Clause for such authority to license.
Actually, you could likely use a motor vehicle for commerce, yet not have it licensed or registered. If you own a large farm, or ranch, you could in theory purchase a pickup truck, and have it trailered to your property. You could use that pickup for all sorts of farming uses, and as long as it stays on private property, it should need a license plate or registration.
It's a sad reality, I thought that this only happened in the third world country that I left more than 10 years ago.
Well, I got some good news for you guys: the more land you buy, the less tax you can pay on it to a certain degree.
I was looking at a 200+ acre property with 3,000 in property taxes. You could cut down SIX trees per year and pay that off but that's not really my point. My point is that's more than it costs to have 0.5 acres and a house just in the town over.
So what I'm here to tell you is the US .gov just wants to incentivize you to buy MORE LAND. Y'all feeling what uncle sam is putting out for you? Can you feel the thunder?
Still, all taxation is theft.
Depends on your state/county. AG lands in Oregon have to produce $85k a year to qualify for the AG tax rate.
Truth.
maybe here is a good place to throw in what is going on in the stock market. people have found out that "brokers" do at least two things you certainly didn't expect:
they keep "your" stock in the market's name. When you buy a stock on Wall Street, they keep the stock under the self-regulating name of "Cede and Co," and you are simply a "beneficiary." If the SHTF you will probably not be included in the sale of it. Sure for now you can "sell" it and they will take your beneficiary status off, but that's probably because you are selling at a loss or a small gain that they can absorb.
several brokers allegedly don't even buy stock for you. (and I use the word "allegedly" to be honest but 99% sure it will be true.) They just keep the number on the books and plan to pay you out the difference between your buy and sell price. So they don't even register you as a beneficiary. Companies like eToro are caught up in this. what it means is you pay the money and never get anything except an IOU from your broker. On bankruptcy, we'll see how that plays out!
wallstreetbets already found out how that works with their stock stunt. You get shafted because you don't actually own it. They had to use a different, more expensive and much slower system, to actually register the stocks in their name.
I did a complete cash out of everything the day biden seized control and cashed out everything to be 100% debt free
Debt is not awful with rampant inflation.
Billions and billions.
And billions and billions
well millions of billions. 😁
"You will own nothing." Happiness is optional.
It’s the Star Trek economic fantasy. We no longer work for material gain, we work to better ourselves.
So the guy who unclogs Picards shitter on the Enterprise is doing it to better himself?
k…..
Lol
Imagine Worf’s shitter
Backed up with Gak
Hope he wears a brown outfit, probably doesn't get a fancy badge/communicator either.
Yea. The brownshirts (shits). You never see them on the show though.
MAID is here for you.
It’s sort of like when I hear investment gurus refer to different investment packages as, “products”. No, they’re not. It’s a service, not a tangible good. We outsourced most of our product manufacturing overseas over the course of the past few decades. Without a strong manufacturing base, we cannot maintain superpower status, A combination of greed and and lack of patriotism are at the heart of our nation’s decline
Also lack of morals.
Services are considered "products," too.
You'll commonly hear first class service on an airline referred to as a "product" offering, too.
Just because a corporate entity calls something a “product” doesn’t mean it’s actually a “product”
Services can be legitimate value adds. Restaurants are services. They don't produce new food, they cook and serve existing food. But it's a legitimate thing that added value.
Financialization isn't even a service. It's better considered to be repackaging. It's like going to Costco, buying a bulk pack of candy bars, and reselling them individually. Nothing has been created, and no utility has been added.
What exactly is the point you're trying to make with this whole "services aren't products" rant, anyway?
You're going against the grain of how the word is commonly used, and for what purpose?
“The grain” has shifted from a “product”’s original definition. I’m just bringing it back to its original meaning. The reason? Because money is just representative of services, and, most importantly, goods (products). You can have all the money in the world, but without hard assets (goods), it’s basically worthless. Imagine a financial collapse that brought us back to a traditional barter system of trade. What would you rather have? Food, water, clothing, and shelter, or a digital printout of your bank account? Ultimately, our national defense depends on our ability to produce tangible products. Our entire existence as a nation depends on it.
Then just use the word "goods" which we all agree only refers to physical items. "Products" can be goods or services. Both, by the way, have intrinsic value, so I still don't understand the point of the distinction you're trying to make, let alone how the word "product" has any effect on any of this Judaism.
Nah. “Product” is just a term used to make people feel like they created something other than punching keys or pushing paper. A book is a product. The writing is not.
If I pay someone to write for 8 hours, even just for the sake of me wanting to watch them write for 8 hours, then the writing is a product.
Labor is a product.
This is where your argument becomes outright nonsense. This is wrong. Ignoring the issue of quality, it takes time and effort to create writing and convey information.
Because the Left corrupts language to suit their agenda and here you are, defending that agenda.
The K Street/DC - Wall Street Axis has sold out Main Street to China for the last 3 decades.
Trump was working to fix this, and all the horseshit thrown at him during his Administration, and the Steal of 2020, were the result.
Yup. The WEF doesn’t line their, “model” of a country (China) being questioned
Ironically it was Trump and gay union libs that warned against this.
While mitch McConnell and chamber or commerce paved the way for deindustrilzation.
True. Divided and conquered, per usual
Bodies stacked like wood on the pyre.
And we take it all back.
You will stack bodies to earn your food rations slave.
I’m not going to play chutes and atrocities with everyone else.
It's called Usury.
There's a reason why there's been a battle against it for millennia. It's evil and wrong and counter to every man's liberty and property.
Ooh! I know where this is going!
boop!
Obvious is obvious! Thank you 'pede.
It's CALLED SHEEP . Most people ARE SHEEP !
Has nothing to do with "usury." It's printing fiat aka counterfeiting.
It’s really printing fiat and usury
"Usury" is just some made up anti-capitalist faggotry. If you don't want a loan, don't get a loan.
That's not how it works at all. Learn "Prisoners Dilemma"
Once Usury is introduced into an economic system, it is in every single individuals interest to get loans to gain property rights over things of real value. Those who don't LOSE money. So the rational move is for every individual to take loans.
However here is the catch, when everyone takes out a loan, then EVERY single individual in society is worse off than they were before usury was introduced. Hence the prisoners dilemma: The best action for the individual, hurts everyone if applied for everyone.
No, it literally is. You're a leftist. Go back to reddit.
Usury is banned in christianity for a reason
The people who invented Christianity had to shit in a hole in the ground. You're free to go live like that any time you please. Just leave the rest of us alone with our indoor plumbing.
I can understand that position, especially under a moral capitalist system like intended.
But today gov prints fake money, gov steals fake money, gov gives fake money to banks at no risk, banks make money from the rest of us.
And now they are driving up interest rates due to the above scam.
That's not why interest rates are going up. Interest rates are going up because they printed so much fucking money in order to keep interest rates down that it started showing up as price inflation. So now they put the brakes on the printing hoping to stop the inflation. But there's no stopping it. The rates required to stop this inflation would be so high that it would make all debts unpayable, including government debts. This is the endgame.
The printing of the fiat is what causes the 'unreasonable' interest rate which defines usury. By devaluing the fiat, it essentially raises the interest rate. No co-incidence on who's doing it to boot.
You have no idea what you are talking about. Printing fiat causes interest rates to fall.
Loaning out money that was printed out of thin air is usurious no matter what interest rate is applied. It has an infinite increase compared to the zero cost of origination.
Correct. This is why the Constitution requires asset backed money by gold or silver.
Again, if you don't want a loan, don't take a loan. Loans are not the issue.
So how was it that the prime rate mortgage crisis and loan fiasco that happened in 2008 effected me too, even though I had never had a loan in my life at that time?
The USA has been on fiat currency since 1913. A better question is why DIDN'T people before then have these kinds of problems?
This is not true. Printing money causes inflation and the devaluing of the fiat currency. The only way to reign in inflation is to RAISE interest rates.
Yes it is. It's literally how they do it. Please just stfu, you're embarrassing yourself.
Just, go to bed already...
Ok moslem
I ain't been saving up bottle caps and kool-aid points for nothing.
I have 10 jambajuice punchcards, each one punch away from a free juice. I’m ready.
I laughed at this one
Marlboro Miles will clothe my family
Fun story: one of the biggest land owners in the us made his fortune selling off-brand cigarettes (he had or started pretty much every brand besides big tobacco like marlboro, many you can still see off-brand in gas stations today). He used all that money to buy land and he eventually cashed out to live out the rest of his life camping and woodsing about like a millionaire hermit of sorts.
Those bottle caps are worthless.
…
GIVE ME THOSE BOTTLECAPS!!
Get with the times people, Zyn points are where its at
I'm confused about 1925. Did loans and mortgages not exist at all then?
Yes but back then you can pretty much guarantee any loan was always backed by something legitimate
Probably wasn't a lot of money being loaned out back then without it being completely secure
Banks has always been a fraud, tho not nearly as bad back then as today.
Another factor to consider is that houses back then had less regulations and bureaucracy and could therefore first of all be built much cheaper and faster. Secondly when bidding on a house, the other bidders would only be able to big with money they actually have, instead of a promise of maximal loan amount like today.
Compare houses and their actual realistic value vs their market value which is the winning bid, houses are way overpriced today because of loans with no backing.
Banks could only loan $10 for every dollar of capital back then
Yes, fractional reserve banking is another way they print massive amounts of money from thin air.
Reserve ratio is supposedly 4.5% now, but they game that to nearly 0% (or less) with complex investment vehicles.
In addition, with derivatives and foreign exchange swaps, there is an estimated $65 trillion in "off books" dollar debit worldwide.
‘Huge, Missing and Growing:’ $65 Trillion in Dollar Debt Sparks Concern
Financial system is unsustainable Ponzi scheme and they know it.
I remember the first time a learned about it
It was actually what convinced me I liked Bitcoin
Am not a finance wiz, but from the beginning it struck me that if Bitcoin threatened the monopoly bankers, it would be eliminated. Never had the gut to invest.
That’s why the inventor used an alias and remained anonymous - bankers will start literal wars to protect their monopoly.
Bitcoin, to my knowledge, is the first time they’ve faced a threat they cannot defend against in the normal ways. It’s the first viable competitor/alternative to their system of control.
When you sit back and think about it, it’s truly a beautiful thing
It cannot be seized. No central control means no one to strong arm into handing over your money
it cannot be censored. You can transact with anyone anywhere in the world. Can’t be cancelled.
it can be carried with you anywhere in the world in your head. Try escaping with your gold bars and cash. Not so easy!
I think these things will become more important as governments continue with their efforts to control every aspect of our lives.
There is very much the risk that it could be eliminated but it has survived all threats, perceived and real, thus far.
History is littered with stories of people overcoming opponents that seem impossible to defeat. 1776 comes to mind.
One of the great things about Bitcoin is how divisible it is so if you’re so inclined you can get just a little bit of exposure to it, instead of having to bet the house on it
Might disagree that crypto can't be seized, censored, regulated. Powers that be can pass any law, ignore any law, sniff every packet, punish or cancel any participant at their whim.
Secondly, every Bitcoin transaction uses the amount of energy consumed by a small family in a month. Extremely slow and costly, taxes itself.
So far, govt. has tolerated crypto, as far as they can treat it as a taxable investment. You pay tax on Bitcoin you don't even spend, assuming you report it as required by law.
Looks like govts are moving toward cashless currencies of their own: that way they can track, block, seize, extort at will. Absolutely won't tolerate competition. See China, People's Republic of.
Most people paid cash for their assets, like houses and cars until very recently.
Yes, it’s insane how much homes cost relative to how cheap they are to construct. There is artificial scarcity in the housing market throwing the price up.
None of this was a problem until the government started to get involved for your own good.
The car has had death by a million cuts. Take the tire stem. They were 0.90$ each. Then the government decided you needed tire pressure monitoring systems and now they retail $50-90 each sensor valve and there is a receiver and added computer bullshit in the car. It’s crammed with shit you don’t want amor need by government requirements
Someone lobbied government and earns a lot of money on those censor valves hehe
Yes.
Every piece of required equipment benefits from the same corruption.
I don't want electric windows. Every car, it breaks. I don't need AC. I don't need GPS. I don't need an ECM. I don't need a TV/DVD. I don't need power & heated seats.
That's the real problem. When people could only afford to pay out of pocket and savings, that's what set the prices and made them fair. It doesn't matter if I buy a house or car with straight cash or a bank loan, because it's all the same to the seller, and with inflation you aren't really saving much if anything by saving large sums of money to buy things, because by the time you've saved that much money, inflation has already matched or surpassed interest rates on a loan. Now everyone is just forced to be debt slaves to have anything. People buying houses they can't really afford, because they can sell it before it's paid off and make up the difference, meanwhile the next person takes on that debt. We don't really have debt payoff in this country, but rather, debt handoff.
50% down payment. 5 year baloon loan, which meant you needed to refinance every 5 yrs and hopefully for less principal or payoff the balance.
When we purchased our first house, 20% down plus closing costs was an unbendable rule. This worked to keep a lid on prices. The 100% mortgage and the ability to finance closing helped to accelerate prices.
You can own more than you owe. In 1912, before the fed, it wouldn't surprise me if the graph was 200% or more.
You could always get a loan since one cave man had more than another.
Crypto alone caused an absolutely fucking massive amount of that since the 2008 crash....
No it didn't. First of all, if you hold your own keys, crypto is a real asset. Secondly, crypto coming online can't cause this. The only thing that causes this is printing fiat like there's no tomorrow.
Do you really own bits on a computer? What happens when your power goes out?
Your crypto is tied to the arrangement of the bits, not the actual electrons floating around in the computer. You can store that arrangement on a piece of paper or in a deck of playing cards. Your power going out is not a problem at all. Only the whole grid going offline would make crypto worthless - but if that happens you got bigger issues to worry about.
Lol cryptos and their non-tangible products. Fiat of fiats.
That's not an argument. Your PDW account is non-tangible. If you think it has no value, give me your password.
Do you really own your gold? What happens when the government comes and seizes it?
2A? What if you lose your nerve? Didn’t they already seize gold once in the past?
Seems easier to seize physical gold from one individual than something that’s decentralized and would require a cataclysmic collapse of the entire power grid round the world at the same time
Lol I'll holding my gold far better than any crypto Kool-aider will... and have.
Lol seize my gold? Crypto- 'let's just turn off the lights" lahahaha
The “turn off the lights” scenario would require the entire worlds power and internet to be cut at the same time and stay down.
If that happens the gold in your prison wallet will be worth only its value as something heavy you can throw at or hit someone with to protect yourself.
When the time comes, your gold will be theirs. One way or another.
Scenario 1: they come and take it in an aggressive all out blitz
if it’s held in any kind of bank or vault the company will give it up in the blink of an eye.
it’s in your house. Knock knock. “We’re here to collect your gold”. They’ll find it and take it.
it’s in your house but you decide to take a stand. You take a few out. But storm trooper #3443 shoots you. You’re dead. And they’ve got your gold anyway. Congratulations.
Scenario 2: they declare due to extraordinary circumstances they need your gold. But it’s ok. They’ll “pay” you for your confiscated gold with an IOU. LOL.
You hold gold because the government has decided they’re happy for you to hold onto their shiny rocks, for now.
Bitcoin on the other hand… with just a little bit of sense has the following benefits….
There’s no central bank or company to go intimidate to get them to hand it over
You can transport Bitcoin anywhere, even through checkpoints. Any amount. In your head, not in your prison wallet.
They can search your house, your car or your grandmas underwear draw. If they don’t have your keys, they ain’t getting your Bitcoin.
Maybe they declare it illegal since they can’t confiscate it like your gold… Gee that’d be concerning IF it wasn’t decentralized and as a result impossible to stop. It cannot be censored. I can send money to you or someone on the other side of the globe regardless of what a little tyrant government might say. And when whoever it is on the other end receives it, they are protected by the exact same benefits. Brilliant really.
Moron comparing Gold to crypto. Gold is a real asset.
The only gold you hold is because the government has yet to decide to take it off you.
The government thanks you for holding onto their gold for them though.
What does crypto have to do with this?
Crypto is a digital fungible asset. Blame the scummy bankers like Bankman who use rigged markets to dictate global exchange rates, just like they rig the European energy market, the oil market, metals and everything else with real value.
Exclusively-"Digital" and yet also a "tangible asset"
That's a good one, gonna have to write the one down
Fungible was the word I meant to use. Value is not in what you can touch, but what requires actual work to produce. You can touch your own shit, that doesn't make it valuable because you can easily produce unlimited amounts of it.
Compare that to crops, metals or Bitcoin which you cannot just shit out or mint out of thin air. It requires work, different types of work but yet still work. And work is valuable because you sell your time.
How did Bankman rig the markets?
The financial economy consumes about $11k a year per household. Speculation is why houses are unaffordable. Speculation is why food is expensive.
Why has a 6-pack of Bud tripled in price over the last 20 years but wine hasn't.? Futures markets.
Can you explain that last paragraph?
It all boils down to speculation. Take coal for instance, and let's assume the year is 1860. You have some money and want to invest to make a profit. Now with the rise of the railroad coal is probably gonna go up in value right. So what you do is to buy as much coal as possible and put it in storage, then once the prices goes up due to more demand a few years later you sell it at profit.
This is the real and least harmful type of speculation. Now since the federal reserve and computers fake coal was implemented. That is someone who claims to have a warehouse full of coal, which you can now buy shares of virtually without having to move the physical coal.
Audits are not that good and although the coal warehouse owner claims you can withdraw your physical coal at any time, most people won't and hence nobody really knows if all the virtual coal is backed by real coal. This is the first level of fuckery that did more damage to the markets than in the past. Because it's virtual assets not backed fully by real assets with no ability to verify.
Now in recent years, future markets have risen. This is when you speculate with loans backed by thin air, on assets that doesn't even exist. Let's take an example, the year is early 2020, Trump is still president and gas prices are low, you want to speculate on gas prices so you buy gas on the future market.
Now all you can afford with the money you have is 1000 gallons, but on the future market you can somehow take out a loan and buy 3000 gallons or why not 10 000 gallons. This means, after Biden is installed, and gas prices doubles, you're not only doubling your profit, but makes 6 or 20 times the profit you would have made on regular more honest speculation.
But since there isn't that much gas, the prices on the real asset has to go up to cover your profit. Same thing works in the other direction obviously. If Trump is re-elected and opens up the new pipeline, let's assume for simplicity the gas prices would have halved, that means if you own gas on the futures market you're now in debt.
And wit this in mind, now you know why they so desperately wouldn't let Trump be re-elected. At least one of the reasons.
I’ll have to read more about this. Is there a place? Thanks for the great explanation.
Found these in a search:
Last one is apparently Klaus Schwabs website. No idea if they're of any use but it could be a start. Plenty of videos exist that explains the fraudulent banking system, they also often cover future markets and other kinds of fuckery.
He did a fairly good job, but as someone pretty involved in that area, I might be able to help explain it as well.
For Agriculture and Energy: https://www.cmegroup.com/
For metals: https://www.lme.com/en/
Holy shipballs
Bud is made from rice and corn, commodities traded in futures markets. There is no futures market for grapes, just farmer co-ops
They can’t because they are making things up. The reality is the quantity of dollars in the system have increased which has an effect of making prices go higher since everyone at the auction (store) has more nominal wealth.
I thought Bud went up because NASCAR became a marketing funds black hole. I never saw a Carlo Rossi car in the field.
I worked for a company that sponsored a NASCAR team. It cost $100 million a year.
We would have reached a better audience sponsoring a Tour de France cycling team for a tenth of that
"Speculation" has nothing to do with it. You sound like a Bernie Bro.
They don't play these games because they're stupid. They play these games so that they can push the prices of real assets down in order to buy them all. It's a big game of musical chairs and if you don't already have your chair right now, you are royally fucked when the music stops.
Where I live, both new and used vehicles are just too expensive with the cost of used vehicles not matching what you get. It's insane, but because of this, I eventually broke down and decided to do an engine swap instead of getting a new or used vehicle. The engine came wit a 3-year and or 100k mile warranty, and while it's far from perfect, it's better than getting in bed with another monthly payment without knowing what the used vehicle's problems might be. Making matters worse all around is the ongoing parts supply for both new and used vehicles, the shortages being something too few seem to even acknowledge let alone show any worries about.
There's so many things wrong with our country right now that I guess we should all count our blessings that nobody has found a way to tax air yet... I'm sure that's coming, too. Fuck all of this.
Same boat. Had to change pretty much entire car. Frame, suspensions, brakes, powertrain. Only parts that are original are body panels, interior, and engine. Still can't buy a new or used car with the same capabilities for even the money invested (which was considerable). It's crazy out here.
You mentioned the frame... Out of curiosity, what all did you do to yours?
It was completely rusted. I didn't do anything, well, except I didn't remove the frame from the car and paint it every 5 years like I probably should have but that would have cost me time and money I didn't have so I just drove it. So I got a brand new frame, couldn't put the brakes back and a few other miscellaneous parts so I had to change all that. Then the suspensions went first in front then in the back, control arms, struts, the whole caboose. Then an issue I had with the axle reared its ugly head and that whole thing had to go. Road salt, bad weather, I didn't spray the underside of the car all winter because the water would literally freeze from the hose 4 months out of the year. I take some responsibility, I guess, but mostly it was combination of road conditions and they kind of messed up the coating on the frame. I like the new frame so far, I think it's properly done but I won't know for sure for a while. I know it's not coated how I'd like but a man has to live within his budget. Batteries, alternator, AC system, belts, you name it along the way. But I still love it. Only thing I think isn't perfect on it is no HEPA filters and seats aren't as comfy as I'd like. Sensors, exhaust, lol gonna stop talking about it now, it's making me sad.
I know the feeling, man. I had my engine swapped in my 2006 Colorado and when I got her back, I had an oil pressure sensor leak, then the ABS module went out, and then I had a radiator hose leak. I brought her in to have the ABS replaced, but they couldn't find any new modules for it, so I just lived with it being faulty since the errors went away (I think the shop reconnected or cleaned something to make them stop). Everything else was fixed. And I just took her to another shop to get the frame coated, and that didn't go over so well because the people there only coated the outside of the frame starting at the back of the cab to the end (basically undercoating only 50% of it, which seems stupid to me). It all cost $700 to do and given the entire frame lacked any protection, I guess anything is better than nothing. And I'm still dealing with a first-of-the-day start up issue that I think is injector-related.
So you're not alone in these struggles. Ha.
Had to get a new battery. $195
Wtf.
I know, and I hate saying this but it's going to get worse...
The big manufacturers are deliberately exercising things like incrementalism and planned obsolescence more and more to keep reducing the number of years they have to provide replacement parts for, especially as they keep trying to transition over into electrification and the fewer parts they have to stamp out or mold equates to reduced production costs at their plants. The outcome is PURE BAD for consumers who wish to hang on to their vehicles for longer than 10 years, which people will be doing more and more of given the plight our current economy is in, the power of the dollar, etc. Given so few real fabricators exist now who can produce replacement parts for vehicles, well, you do the math.
What I hope will happen is that smaller shops, DIY'ers, etc. will eventually pick up the slack and increase investments into an ever-increasing market for things like automotive electronics, replacement parts that should be reproducible in small shops or garages using things like at-home forges, bench mills, 3D printers, lathes, etc. I do think it's gradually heading in that direction, but it's a slow roll as many need to tool up to compensate, to say nothing about the current lack of skilled staff who can do things like CAD, fabricate, and actually install things like engine swaps or tranny rebuilds.
It's going to get a lot worse before it eventually gets better. Hopefully in another 15-20 years, we'll see things take a turn for the better.
BRICS countries already own most of the natural resources and it will only get worse with more countries joining. Even Wikipedia admits way down the page on the BRICS they are going to not only take over the West but destroy it by 2050.
The US is not going anywhere but the heyday is steadily ending. Fed will eventually get weaker and weaker with no printing press. D.C. will eventually collapse and the Capitol moved.
If the dollar collapses then the ones hurt the most, besides us starving, are the banks and we all know they won't let that happen. Signal WW3 just like last time.
They don't have much of a choice. The BRICS are putting an end to the global hegemony enforced by the MIC.
The cartel at the Federal Reserve has bought up over a trillion dollars worth of gold in the last 2 months to undermine BRICS.
So I put that knowledge to use. I dumped some money into a gold mining stock that has gone up 40% in the last 2 weeks.
Nobody can tell me this shit is a "conspiracy theory" when it's making me thousands of dollars.
Seems all reserve banks everywhere are buying up gold. So much for it being a " barbarous relic".
The west will implement CBDCs to establish a neo-feudalistic system. Those at the top will remain wealthy, while everyone else becomes slaves.
The banks control both sides of this "global conflict".
The "companies" in the west might be hurt, but the people on top of those banks will simply get lucrative jobs in companies in the east with their buddies.
Do you think the elites outsourced all production to the east for fun? They hate us and want us destroyed and they own those production companies in the east too.
They're waging war against us from within our nations and we are letting them.
That's why they say money is the root of all evil.
I mean, Satan is the tippy top of this control scheme, BUT in the literal physical sense...."banks" are the top.
Is this predicting that financial assets will go down, or houses and cars will go up, or both?
Also, stocks are considered financial assets, correct?
Depends what company the stock represents.
AKA, theft.
I don't think Americans have any idea what's coming for us. Think Great Depression. Then think what worse could look like
Fun fact about the great depression: half the population had no idea it was even happening. HALF. No idea. Kids got bullied in school for it by their peers.
You have to look to holodomor and other atrocities to see it to the point where everyone feels it. And even then, oof, so many people for whom life just goes on like normal.
But for the plebes, it's hell.
Ukraine's man made famine.
Yeah.
BURN IT ALL DOWN
Easy sleazy, don’t get attached to material shit. That stuff comes and goes. Shut up, pay the man, die. Leave empty handed with just Jesus our Lord and savior hopefully saving our souls. Kinda says this shit will happen right in the Bible. Thanks
Well yeah. That's how it works. How do you supposed to grow wealth in a country if there's a finite amount of cash? I don't exactly know how it works, but the banks borrow and lend with the hope to be paid back, but that money isn't even that real because it's borrowed too. Doesn't seem like a great system but it's what we have. The direction of history is controlled by the "bankers. "
Actually, when you take out a mortgage, the money is created right then and there, not borrowed.
It’s what we have now, not how our system was designed. Fed and IRS (and much more) should not exist
Be me when the house of cards fall. I have no debt and I have my own food supply and I even have several freshwater springs on my land.
Most cars are not assets, they're liabilities.
The amount of Unfunded liabilities the US holds (176 trillion) quite literally makes the USA insolvent.
Banks create money in fractional banking system through debt. Without debt, new money cant be introduced into the system. Its on purpose .
This 👆👆
What goes up must come down and vicey versy.
Wish Glas-Steagall was listed too
Why? It's irrelevant.
hardly irrelevant. it kept the banks at a reasonable size because they had to choose whether to do institutional banking or private banking but not both. Now the banks control the whole economy, especially inflation and interest rates are parts.
Yet another victim of leftist propaganda. Tell me exactly which banks merged after the partial repeal of Glass-Steagall, or which banks started engaging in both commercial and investment. I'll wait while you go look it up.
JP Morgan Chase, Bank of America, Goldman Sachs and many more.
BZZZT wrong answer. BoA was the ONLY bank to do this, and they were one of the least full of bad assets during 2008/2009.
So, do you wanna drop the Occupy Berniebro shit yet and learn some actual economics? Or are we gonna keep repeating the same nonsense that AOC and Elizabeth Warren believe caused 2008?
All of those banks now operate commercial banking and investment banking arms, which would have been illegal under Glass-Steagall.
Your attitude is a real turnoff. Read my profile and you will see I am no lib. But Glass-Steagall was excellent legislation dismantled by the Clintons.
P.S Go fuck yourself.
I like you both. Don't fight. It makes me sad.
Oh you mean decades after the crisis that this repeal is claimed to have caused? In other words, the partial repeal of Glass-Steagall has done fuck-all to damage anyone or anything? So why do idiots still talk about it like it's relevant? Why exactly are you in favor of the government telling private companies what services they can offer to customers? That's called communism, and we don't do that shit here.
Hmmm, our financial system is a house of cards, well anyway.
just now figuring this out.......LIQUIDITY is the most valuable asset. My house & cars are all debt free. They are not huge or fancy but I can roll with the punches.
Watch how bad this is not dooming ere just being straight I remember 08 this will be alot worse pedes
Alot of people only chance for a house is their parents dying
My kids have 2 or 3 houses each. It can be done, you just have to sacrifice at first.
More like you have to gobble up other peoples broken dreams, and while there's no shortage of that....eventually there will be when people stop dreaming altogether. There's only so many carcasses to pick over, and everything is perishable on a big enough timescale, even homes. So one generation might have a lot of carcasses to pick over, but what about the next. Eventually it all crumbles.
Most people in the current generation are just living off of what was built by the previous generation, i.e. parents property, life insurance policies, etc. They're not getting decent jobs until the old generation goes, and their principle reliance on getting funds for a house comes in the form of debt they can pay off with the payouts from the deaths of their relatives and inherited estates. A generation that can only elevate itself on the leftovers of the previous.
That's not opportunity, that's cannibalization, and that spells doom for the generations to come, because eventually there isn't going to be anything left for future generations to cannibalize from the previous, it's all going to be used up and unable to be replaced.
This is basically what's happening in every city in America right now. It's what happened in Detroit. People are just living in the crumbling remains of a once great civilization, using up the last bit of it. Sure, a bit gets replaced here and there, but not enough to keep up with the degradation. That only slows the process. A huge chunk of America's homes are already beyond or nearing their usable life, and as they crumble and fall apart, sure people will still be trying to live in them, but that infrastructure will crumble over a very short period of time, at around the same time, over the span of a few decades, revealing the full problem. Tens of millions of homes suddenly just poofed out of existence as they fall apart or are required to be torn down. And the more people try to stretch the shelf lives of these homes, the bigger the problem will be. It only delays and magnifies the inevitable.
And at that point, sadly, people will probably be all for the own nothing and be happy while living in a closet box like a worker drone, because it will be all they have. So we'll see these massive housing projects that put people into these apartments, being constructed all across the country. They'll hail it as a great work for the benefit of the people, when it will just be people locked in boxes like good worker drones. No way of life, no culture. Their culture will be the states politics and policies. Very little individual power, which means very little collective power. Just a dystopia painted as a utopia.
Now I want a drink
Wasn't this the point of going to a 'service' based economy and gutting the entire manufacturing sector?
Fractional reserving yourselves to death, eh banksters?
Ponzi schemes can only work if there's infinite growth. Since the boomers every subsequent generation has been smaller than the last. It's only a matter of time until it goes boom.
In before the crypto nuts start claiming that hash results are real assets.
What's not real about it?
They’re digital beanie babies with perceived value based on market manipulation and backed by nothing. Before you reee about fiat, I’m no fan of that either, but at least it’s backed by property and work.
I would argue Bitcoin is backed by energy/work
Not other crypto - they’re shitcoins and are the same as fiat. Made up.
But Bitcoin, because it requires the expenditure of energy and computing resources to mine, by extension it would at very minimum be backed by the energy spent to mine it
Can I trade a fraction of a Bitcoin back to energy?
Arbitrary but sure! You could sell your Bitcoin (or a fraction of it) in exchange for energy.
Bitcoin is not a power company, so you’d have to go through an intermediary to get your energy.
So, backed by fiat currency. Gotcha.
Snarkiness aside, I appreciate it’s a flexible currency by itself. I used to buy shit online with btc when it was in the single-digit range. (For fuck’s sake, I still have a wallet with couple of coins on an old drive somewhere in my house that I can’t find.) But it turned into a scammy investment with exchanges pissing away the backing. The lower the value drops, the more exchanges will vaporize along with people’s money. In the end btc will be worth what it was before.
That’s assuming that the person on the receiving end of the transaction converts the Bitcoin to fiat
One day people will figure out when we get where we’re going you won’t need to convert to fiat
But at the moment it’s so hard for people to break the mental model of measuring bitcoin against fake fiat money.
Centralized Exchanges are a scourge. They are the antithesis of what Bitcoin was designed for.
The point is to cut out the scummy middle man. These collapses are an upsetting reminder of that
Bitcoin price will continue to fluctuate, as does the price of (pretty much) everything in a real market. Eventually people won’t bother looking at the price of Bitcoin vs Fiat because one Bitcoin is one Bitcoin. The same way you don’t look at the price of USD currently.
The value of crypto is in the ability to instantly transfer it anywhere in the world without a 3rd party. If you can accept that Western Union has value, then crypto also has value.
I don't accept that Western Union has value, short of the value we collectively place on it.
"without a 3rd party"
Man, glad I own all that dark fiber from here to India so that no one at any point could possibly stop my 1's and 0's. If I can do a direct peer to peer crypto move on my local LAN or PAN, then that's great and I could see that helping. But none of your crypto works if the lights go out and with all of the talk of "energy shortages" why would you double down on something that requires energy to even know exists?
I'd rather trade in twigs and matches at that point - at least then my asset can keep me warm. Maybe my understanding of "asset" is wrong, but the way I live my life is, "if the thing can't help me exist in this life, in and of itself, then it has little to no value".
Sure, money has value right now because I still buy food in cash and pay for my house in cash. Maybe it shouldn't have value, and if that is the case, then I hope that time comes soon. BUT, it does at this very second, or at least when I paid my rent 3 days ago it did.
Crypto might have real use and value. It is very cool what it allows us to do, but I can't pour crypto into my gas tank to take my hypothetical sick kid to the hospital. So AT SOME POINT should the world decay far enough, crypto is a bad choice...as is cash....as are cars (if fuel runs out).
But to me, crypto isn't an asset any more than stocks, loans or the money in my bank account.
So there's no value in being able to transfer money over large distances instantly? Stop being retarded please.
Not relevant who owns the physical fiber.
Again, if the entire grid goes offline, you have bigger problems than "how will I buy stuff?"
You are literally chatting on the internet, so stop pretending it has no value to you.
You can't do those things with gold or silver either.
I'm not being retarded, I'm having an honest conversation. Yes it has a purpose, but have you looked at the world lately? We aren't fixing this shit show without things getting bad, like so bad your cell phone doesn't work because you have no way of charging it. Just ask the EU how their electrical grid is working.
With a comment like that, my theory is that you don't understand man in the middle attacks nor that it is incredibly easy to take down the internet in many parts of the world with a few well placed hunters with 12 bird shot.
Almost certainly, but not necessarily. Humanity has lived without the "grid" for the majority of our existence.
Who said it doesn't have value to me? Also, who said this conversation even has value to me?! I'm not saying it doesn't, I'm just saying you're making a lot of assumptions that are based on no actual facts about me.(Which begs the question, why are you making this personal? Like by calling me a retard?)
No, but gold and silver can be handed to a guy who might have a spare 5 gal jerry can if the grid power is down. That hospital might then use the gold or silver I'm about to give them to buy the gas for THEIR generators. Don't confuse my point about gold or silver to be that there isn't a case where they are useless. I'm sure Adam and Even didn't need to trade gold or silver back and forth before having Able and Cain.
It seems as though you're making the assumption of crypto that all the underlying structures that allow it's operation will stay operational as they currently exist. You might not be wrong, but it is easy to imagine a world where you are. I'm also doing the same with literal physical items, but the required world to imagine is far, far more difficult to bring into existence.
But, that's a long way of getting to my point of, presumably you are a crypto user. You lost me when you attacked me personally instead of some retarded idea I may have had (and I have had more retarded ideas than good ones, I promise you that. Doesn't make me a retard). So you successfully didn't compel someone to join into the very situation that would help you.
From the outside it seems like you are actually against crypto by your own actions, because why would you want to turn people off to it if it is so helpful for you?
People will be more able to generate electricity after these governments crash.
You're the one who doesn't understand MITM attacks if you think you can MITM crypto. TX are encrypted on the client side, and no key exchange ever takes place. You can't MITM it.
And crypto can be handed to a guy 2000 miles away who might be able to store your files when the grid is up and you need those files off your physical devices because they implicate Hillary Clinton. Crypto can be smuggled across borders if you need to flee your tyrannical government and grids are up elsewhere.
No, you're assuming that they'll all disappear or somehow be in a state where crypto can't operate. There's no reason to assume any of that. The cables exist. The satellites exist. People will figure out how to use them without government. There will likely be more electricity generation without government.
You are nobody to me. I give zero shits if you refuse to educate yourself. But when you say stupid nonsense on a public forum, I'm going to correct it.
This chart looks meaningless at proving anything
It mostly demonstrates "mark to market" valuation. Most of the value lost was in the market. And don't forget derivatives.
We're playing monopoly and the banker is giving their friends all the money and properties while everything goes to shit.
Our economy is fucked. More advantageous to be a worthless kiss ass than someone who does fuck all in this world since the smarm fucks took over.
Basically, Atlas Shrugged