So Italy announced people over 80 are in gods hands now lol. And they call Pence a bible thumper when theyre leaving their old to die. So these people paid into their universal healthcare scam just to get royally fucked right in front of the whole world, and these idiots are screaming about free healthcare still? Im sorry but the $11/hr my company paid for my healthcare the last 20 years is not and never will be up for grabs, not even once in America. This will always and forever be the land of free men where we dont do anything for theives but bury them under outhouses.
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Don't let the liberals hear the end of this. Bring it up every chance you get.
Then again, I've seen some pretty disturbing stuff when it comes to doctors operating on people that most likely won't recover because Medicare will keep that bed full for a couple of weeks.
Im on reddit talking shit now. Gave a great reply,
"So if youre young and hungry is it ok for you to kill an old person and take their food?"
Guessing the comments will stop after that and the downvote reeeeee wave will start. Thats the go to response for a while
Their utopia sounds great until someone asks about the details LOL
For a bunch of nimrods larping about "praxis" they sure seem to not know the fuck they're talking about.
They don't care, they like the idea of "Elderly Abortion", anything and everything abortion is excellent. Why would Libtards want to waste limited resources on grandma and grandpa unless they happen to be an old age elite (Bern and Joe), they will be protected and cared for.
If RBG was still alive, and loved in Italy, she’d be screwed
Oh I havent. I dont boycott things, Im on reddit talking shit every chance I get. Fuck them. I still redpill a few but Ill go to pure trash talking quick, they can suck TD and that dont stand for GEOTUS
This is very true. I lurked Reddit for a long time. Even back when Ron Paul was super popular on /r/politics. I never signed up. I just now started commenting here on TDW. It's pretty addictive.
They can suck /r/The_Dick
https://www.reddit.com/r/The_Dick/
Dude the lefty censorship has accelerated bigtime at Reddit since they went after T_D.
I like to go there to enjoy the cope and seethe coming from delusional bernouts.
Im a poker player so I just go on the poker sub now, the geopolitics sub isnt too bad either as I have an interest in that too
In England, they have already begun limiting healthcare for individuals who smoke or are considered overweight.
"For an indefinite amount of time, it plans to ban access to routine, or non-urgent, surgery under the National Health Service until patients "improve their health," the policy states, claiming that "exceptional clinical circumstances (will) be taken into account on a case-by-case basis."
The decision comes from the clinical commissioning group (known as a CCG) for the county of Hertfordshire, which has population of more than 1.1. million. The time frame for improving health is set at nine months for the obese in particular; those with a body mass index over 40 must reduce the number by 15% over that time period, and those with a BMI over 30 are given a target of 10%."
So much for Liberal Fat Acceptance!
Brit Pede here, I think it's right that there should be this limitation. If you can't look after yourself, why should the state?
I treat the NHS as a baseline care, but pay into private as I have done for most of my working life as the one time I have used it, I was seen, tested and diagnosed within a week in a clean hospital by a very senior doctor. At the end of the day, you get what you pay for.
Universal Healthcare is suppose to be the same care for everyone! So you pay twice, once for the Universal Healthcare and again for your own. That sounds like "class" healthcare. People with money get better care. I thought that was suppose to not happen in Universal Healthcare?
As far as the limitations for "certain people", that flies in the face of Universal Healthcare as well. So where does that end? I'll tell you, it doesn't. Soon handicapped, old, drug addicts, ......then just rich people again get healthcare no matter what they do wrong. And again, I thought Fat Acceptance was doing away with the second class citizen mode of operation? It's Libtards talking out of both sides of their mouth once again, no surprise there.
Not really when you consider how much taxpayers pay for other's healthcare in socialized systems. Getting nothing for a lot seems undesirable.
The state shouldn't look after you, and it certainly shouldn't tax you for looking after you if it refuses to. You should be able to to buy the health care or private health insurance of your choice, and providers should be free to compete for your business.
Research is increasingly showing that obesity is due to issues with gut bacteria, which either turns incoming calories into available energy or shunts them into fat storage. Mice fed and exercised identically can be fat or thin based on their gut bacteria. Our gut bacteria have been altered by something in the food supply or environment that changed radically since the mid-1980s when millions of people went from effortlessly normal weight to obese. 95% of dieters following mainstream medical advice, eat less and move more, regain the weight and then some. It turns out that's a recipe for shutting down your metabolism and priming your body to hang onto every incoming calorie.
Blaming people who struggle with obesity when the top experts in the field admit that they don't fully understand the mechanisms behind it is absurd, and denying them health care they have been forced to pay for is disgusting.
You won’t convince the NPCs. They have already been programmed that this outbreak makes the case for socialized medicine and they are already spreading that shit all over social media. No facts will ever dissuade them.
That's okay. A lot of people on the internet are not NPCs yet. Those who aren't already programmed are usually silent lurkers. They can still be red-pilled and, those should be the target of our shit-posts and memes. And, our shit-posts and memes DO redpill people!
Agreed.
Imaginary full coverage is just marketing at this point.
Its ok because once thats clear I enjoy cussing at them. 20 years in construction gets you a lot of good insults. Still wouldnt piss in a commies mouth if his throat was on fire
I've seen examples of things like trying to diagnose an 85 year old woman with diabetes and giving her insulin, where diabetes isn't going to be a problem, while insulin increases fall risks by a lot - because medicaid pays $x dollars more per day for a patient with diabetes.
They also do constant dementia checks on residents in nursing homes, to the point where the residents are pissed and have memorized all the answers before the questions are asked, because the home is waiting for the DAY they score below a certain point on the test so they can charge more.
Italy's treatment of the aged in health care has always been crummy. I have relatives in Italy and I hear stories. Patients who undergo surgery can be opened up, surgeon looks inside, declares nothing can be done, and closes them back up without even trying anything.
Socialized medicine sucks!
Ask literally any healthcare professional in the states how shitty Medicare works. And don't even mention Medicaid, most of them don't even accept it.
And that's with a hybrid system where it's mostly just old people on it.
The left has an answer for every single case that comes up. Including the fallbacks of "that's a one-off," "you're lying" and "well at least they get any access to care."
It's like they're infatuated with the notion of absolving xemselves of any responsibility because the imaginary magical cock of the federal government will fix all of their problems using other people's money.
Like that doesn't happen here. And sometimes it is true.
I’ve been on vacation to Mexico three different times now and for whatever reason there is always a lot of people from Canada, maybe because it’s the time of year I go? Doesn’t really matter but when your on a resort for a week, with the same people, you get to talking to them and every day the conversations get more in depth. Every Canadian eventually always says their health system is horrible and they always have multiple story’s as to why it’s horrible.
I had to get rescue medication as part of a clinical study. I went in 2 weeks ago to "qualify" with the sponsor, essentially give samples. I was told to come in the next week 7 days to get the meds. 2 hrs before my infusion I was told the hospital let the meds expire without coordinating with the sponsor to get new meds. They fly in new meds, takes 4 days. I get an appointment 10 days after the scheduled infusion, 4 hrs before my appointment they cancel because of "staffing shortage, sick nurses", wanted me to reschedule. I went ahead and walked into the hospital clinic because I want to see if anything can be done because I have an autoimmune disease tearing me to ribbons. They get ALL KINDS OF PISSED OFF AT ME, like YOU CAN'T BE DOING THIS YOU STEPPED ON A LOT OF TOES. I had 4 different people give me a lecture like I'm a school boy and not a man.
I eventually got pissed off, and said "I valued my life more than your convenience at your job."
CANADA IS COMPLETELY AND TOTALLY FUCKED,
IFWHEN THE VIRUS SPREADS.That first part is normal with a clinical trial. They need to enroll you in the study, see if you are disqualified for any random condition, and only then can the hospital/doctor even be sent the drugs.
Everything you experienced after that point is incompetence.
One correction, they had the meds on "hold" to give me when I needed it, I told my coordinator I was having problems DEC 1ST, they had 3 months to make sure the drug was ready.
It is just total incompetence, I just almost laughed out loud as they were telling me off, because I've been on placebo (probably) for 4+ months, having my immune system tear me a new one.
And they wanted to scold me like I'm a child, after messing up my appointment twice.
Yeah no, I am a Man; all the "nursing" it required was for a nurse to start an IV, run vitals every 30, and d/c, maybe some charting on the back end, which they were scheduled to do anyways; the paperwork could've been done later or by nightshift, but I needed the meds to function and not go GOD DAMN CRAZY, shitting 15 times a day for 4 months.
You work for me insert meme here!
Impossible! The Canada subs are saying they need to close the border to Americans because we'll try to steal their superior healthcare. /s
Reminds me of that tech news comment begging China to give some of their testing kits to the USA because we're a "third-world health system."
These are the same people who call rednecks and people who live out in the boonies "out of touch."
They literally think no one in the U.S. has health care just because they're losers and can't afford to take care of themselves and think everyone else must be too.
Socialized anything had zero flexibility, and that is why it always fails when it is needed most. It necessarily runs bare bones at all times because otherwise it would bankrupt itself.
The moment a spike in anything changes the system quickly collapses under the slightest pressure. It always happens.
It runs bare bones because any surplus is siphoned off by scum like the Biden Family. The reason why socialism will never work is because Leftists are thieves by nature.
It is amazing that people who think we cannot afford to pay for doctors, hospitals, and medication somehow think that we can afford to pay for doctors, hospitals, medication and a government bureaucracy to administer it.
-Thomas Sowell
It has no flexibility, which might be ok but not if the system also disallows alternates. I've heard that in Italy private care isn't allowed--is that true? Not at all? The UK has always had a parallel system. And no non-gov. health insurance is what the liberals are all promising, which would be the really bad part of gov. health care. I have Medicare, it's all right, I have part D which is a scam imo but now there is the alternative of GoodPrice RX which is as good, if I had more problems I could get supplemental insurance.
People over 80 are the ones that should receive treatment. Younger people should be deprioritized as corona wont kill them.
I've always had the impression that they want people to not live as long so the system doesn't get overburdened. Letting old people die faster is probably part of the plan.
Yes. Socialism works best when you liquidate the older and wiser people who know it is a godless system that doesn't work.
You see flashes of this mentality here with Bernie Retards joking how they hope the coronavirus kills boomers.
The young socialist has been brainwashed to think the old are just bigots trying to prevent Utopia.
You gets it. Same in China
They have commercials they use to try to convince the elderly to end their lives. They started years ago. Look up video: Agenda 21, "I Have Lived a Good Life". Agenda 21 was adopted by California years ago. That is why Covid-19 could easily have been developed to weed out the elderly population, the campaign is not working to convince the elderly to end their own lives.
Think of how little your DMV has to do, and how unbelievably shitty it is.
The main problem with government jobs is that there is NO ACCOUNTABILITY. This includes teachers. You can't get fired.
We only got accountability in the VA because of Trump. Why was this an uphill battle? Think of how insane that is, that public servants are allowed to unionize and say, "you can't fire us for being incompetent."
Pro tip: go to DMV at 4:45 pm and see how fast they can go. They have to let you in until 5pm, at least unless thats changed in the last 6 months. FYI they go fast af
But at five do they just say too bad...you have to leave or do they have to stay there until they serve every customer?
Was just at a dmv till 30 minutes after close because they were staying to serve everyone currently inside and they had locked the doors. I'm assuming they account for the time and just list closing hours and pay employees to work for another hour
No they have to finish all customers
My closest DMV is run by a private corporation and never has a long line and the people there are helpful and fast.
Lucky you. MN has hours long wait times.
Socialized medicine kills! Only lazy sheep want gov run healthcare!
And unfortunately our country is overrun by such sheep.
I find it mind blowing that Bernie keeps spewing socialized medicine and he would be freaking dead if he lived in a country with socialized medicine. He had a heart attack, was transported, diagnosed and went into immediate surgery and had three stints placed in less than than 24 hours. That never would have happened in any of those.countries due to his age alone.
They've paid into it for 62 years of their lives only to end up like in Logan's Run.
The horror of what’s going on in Italy right now is unimaginable. The fucked part is it’s still getting worse. Their death rate so far is nearly equal to their recovery rate. We definitely want to avoid that.
The numbers are still relatively low, but this thing is just getting started.
The rest of Europe is in no better than Italy! Look at Germany, France, Austria, Spain, Britain, Sweden, Norway! Their governments and healthcare systems are failing badly!
Worst part? Private healthcare in Europe is very small since all the money goes to state run healthcare
Italy's problem is that they have socialized healthcare. People are making the mistake of comparing America to shit holes and countries with sub par health care. America doesn't have near the population density as these other places either.
Not to be cruel, but Italy's issues are from voting in leadership that put them in this situation and they got what they chose. America may well be next to make the same dire mistake.
Death panels!
Who would have thought taking the profit motive out of making doctors and nurses would lead to less pay and less people (smart people at that) wanting to be nurses. Also the systems are completely underfunded.
But it's free wh would you NOT?! LOLjust kidding fuck commies
Sigh. I have a co-worker who, before this whole Corona thing started, was CONSTNATLY talking about how America is the worst place and she can't wait to move to Europe because their Healthcare is (magically) both free AND better. She's sure of that, because John Oliver told her. She will never look in depth at how much better we're doing here, thanks entirely to the President saying "Borders closed, can't come in. Private Market, kick this disease's ass. I'll pick up any pieces that are too big for you, if it comes to that." Europe could be left with 5 surivivors, and she'll read the survey that says "100% of European Corona Survivors thank Socialized Healthcare for their recovery," and fawn all over them again.
Exactly. You can show these idiots conclusive proof of something and they will continue to believe the exact opposite. The brainwashing and demoralization has been thorough and complete.
Yuri was right. God... how I wish he was wrong.
edit: typo
They have to go there. Back in the 70s I went abroad--at that time full of anti war sentiment and a liberal (although it wasn't as bad then). After a few months I came back with an 180 change of heart.
It is free and great as long as you're healthy. So a regular person who sees the doctor for the occasional sickness, once a year checkup, pregnancies, etc thinks it is great. It is once you actually get sick or more-than-short-term injured that it becomes a problem.
(Like, if you break your arm, you'll get treated fine. If you develop bad knees, and basic stuff doesn't work, now you're in the healthcare rationing queue)
I had a Canadian friend, an elderly lady. She broke her wrist. They didn't look at her for three months.
Fuck socialized medicine. I don't care if it makes 5,000 20 year olds immortal every day. A friend of mine was told "Go home and be in pain for three months, doing everything with one arm, you're too old to matter." That's all that matters. Were I God, Canada would have burned the day I heard that.
Yes, it's sad that if you don't have the means to take care of yourself in America you don't get taken care of (unless you reach out and find people willing to help you, which we have plenty of, we're the most generous damn nation in the history of Mankind.) But at least it's REAL. That's the way the world actually works, and the world is cruel. Any place where a human being has the power to decide who lives, who dies, who gets well, and who suffers, that is an artificial cruelty. That is a mandate to cause men to sin against each other in an appearance of false mercy that, by virtue of the costs of the very administration that gives the impression of false mercy, is less capable to fund the mercy they purport to offer.
How much money did those old folks pay into the system that's now turning their backs on them?
I wonder how much money they dumped into this socialist utopia only for the system to refuse them, jesus.
Everyone always misses this detail
At first I thought seeing 30+ year olds advocate for "open borders" as pathetic. Understandable if you're an edgy 15 year old who thinks he's an anarchist.
Now it's just plain dangerous.
Even if they mess up they don’t get fired because they are the government. So it tends to lead to more mess ups. In private you mess up you lose money and your job.
Look at the VA.
There has never been a program that was run well by government and there never will be. For anyone to think it will magically happen after decades of failure is foolish and stupid. Do we really want Libtards like Pelosi, Shitf, Sanders, Scummer, Waters, Nadsler.....running 1/3 of the economy and something as important as health care?
I'm quite surprised they didn't declare the age limit at 75.
Give them time.
And when the shit gets real, like now, our government helps us.
Get fucked and suck America's big fat red white and blue balls, world
Private sector here is still so small because it can't compete with big government, especially here in the south. Private sector is for doctors making house calls, writing prescriptions without the wait,v etc, not full on ICU care. It's almost as if the government wants the old to die off soon, for them this disease is a blessing, that's hundreds of thousands of pensioners they don't have to pay anymore.
The NPCs are all over social media advocating for socialized medicine.
Italy is having anesthesiologists decide who lives and who dies because they don't have enough beds for everyone and there are no private options.
The Italian doctor who fell treating hundreds of victims gets tossed out into the hallway to die to make room for a younger illegal and illiterate 34 year old economic migrant from Africa who has a better chance of survival.
No surprise at all. What people fail to understand, and to a greater extent, what are leftist controlled schools failed to teach is rationing will occur no matter who is in charge. The question is whether you want the government in control of the rationing or yourself via your ability to educate yourself, get a better job then purchase your own health care.
The ONLY thing I want to truly depend on government for is defending us from foreign invasion. Otherwise, let Americans figure out things on our own. If they want to call the Wuhan virus an attack then fine, I can understand the current measures but since so many big companies and politicians are being paid by said adversary that is not going to happen.
One of Italy's problems: their socialized healthcare system has reduced their critical care resources, in comparison to their population. The number of ICU beds / population is significantly lower than other Western countries.
Tried to Google and duckduckgo the Italy announcement you're referring to and found nothing. Can you share me a link on them hinting that 80 yo's would be untreated or deprioritized.?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/03/14/italians-80-will-left-die-country-overwhelmed-coronavirus/amp/
The document, produced by the civil protection deparment of the Piedmont region, one of those hardest hit, says: "The criteria for access to intensive therapy in cases of emergency must include age of less than 80 or a score on the Charlson comorbidity Index [which indicates how many other medical conditions the patient has] of less than 5."
Scary shit to know that a bunch of Libtard Bureaucrats and Pro Deathers are the ones who will decide who lives and who dies.
Trump is going to take this hyped-up crisis and...
Just wreck the Chinese Pharma industry.... just wreck it.
Demonstrate how single payer is going to lead to 80-year old Italians being left to die...
Oh there is a really good change as temps get into the 80s that the virus stops spreading and he’s going to be at around 1-2% of the H1N1 deaths that Obama/Biden had in 2009.
That with the economy roaring back in Q3 and Q4.
Game over for the Democrats.
One thing I would love to see, health insurance not tied to employment. Have insurance companies compete for consumers to make a decision and not the hr dept picking a insurance co. I’ve seen so many people want to change jobs but can’t due to health insurance.
This is a thing actually. It’s not really well known, but many trade organizations offer a group discount on insurance. When I was a designer I got insurance through AIGA.
What I think is hilarious and sad is that these idiots don't even realize that if it wasn't for the private sector and free markets is they actually would be Nazis right now because we wouldn't have won WWII
For the idiots screaming for the government to control the system of health Care thinking it'll be better, just look at the VA and how ineptly its been run, look at the amount of fraud in Medicare and then ask if having the government control your health is a good idea.
They want to kill their elderly to fix their failing pension system
Hey watch it pal.
The Prime Minister will soon flash his "fun socks" and prance around at a pride parade to show coronavirus and capitalism not to mess with Canada.
Quit spreading fake news, friend.
Any source on this?
amen
80 yo WITH NUTHIN TO LOSE. HEALTH CARE TURNS GERIATRICS INTO TERRORIST.
Isn't that what they would have us to believe about Arab men's motivations to be terrorist. That we disenfranchised them. Shit if I'm 80 and sick I'n Italy im taking liberals with me. Gods hands might not be so kind.
Why wouldn't the 80 year old be given priority over a 30 year old who could ward off the virus with their own immune system?
"Universal healthcare" means one thing, and one thing only. The state owns your life. Just ask the families of Charlie Gard and Alfie Evans.
"There's no such thing as death panels!!!"
The untold story.
Straight up
Even though this will be a hated comment...
The old voted for the politicians that installed and perpetuated the system that has actually hurt the younger generations(as they pay more, do not use as many resources and are subject to a less viable economy then when the adults who voted for this system were at the time).
These traits are also true in America, especially after ACA.
I am shocked... no not really.
When our private/public partnership beats this I can’t wait to use it forever as one example of why socialized medicine is bad. When you use the economic might of our country and rely on numerous companies to help you don’t have one choke point that can fail and the whole thing collapses.
Quick question, why does anyone think we will be different here in the US?
As a healthcare worker the US is probably more susceptible to being a shitshow than anywhere else. None of the hospital systems even have enough PPE to last a month when things start getting bad in most of the country within thr next 7-10 days. This is going to be a shitshow all the way around, the Us Isnt going to be spared.
Wrong. Look at the stats
This has always been a really weak point to latch on to. Universal health care administered at a state level is the path forward. For-profit insurance denials in the USA cause an unimaginable number of bankruptcies for good families that started with good insurance.
Wrong
These people have NO choice but to pay into the system. They also have NO choice when the system decides to turn its back on the very people who are funding it.
Imagine paying into a system your whole life, only to be told you're too old and too costly to receive care. No matter how much money you put into the system in your youth. It somehow manages to be even worse than Social Security, jesus.
Not only is that an unethical scam, it's also getting people killed.
Socialism is never the path forward.
Hospital filled to the brim with patients during a crisis and you think you can show up with cash and demand to have someone poorer removed. Whos unethical now? Same number of people die in both scenarios buckaroo. Lets go deeper, private insurance is literally incentivized to decline treatment (and often does based on typos) during a health crisis. There is no cash incentive to decline treatment in a universal system. In both cases, similar folks are making the choice for you - you dont get a choice unless youre an executive, but you aint shit, you serve the health insurers. Id prefer actual health professionals make the call.
That's not at all an accurate representation of what I said.
I wouldn't call it "the answer" quite yet, but I'd like to see various experimental implementations at the state level. The federal govt is supremely incompetent. State govts are still incompetent but slightly less so.
IMO we need to decouple health insurance from employment and also only use insurance for high-cost unforeseen circumstances. There's no reason my annual checkup or trip to the Urgent Care should be billed through insurance. Totally defeats the purpose of "insurance".
I think your comment is the middle lane on what Damorelizing was saying.
If a state run universal plan worked really well, with outcome and cost data reflecting that compared to all or most of the other states, I'd absolutely reconsider my position. I just don't see it happening but states should be allowed to try it. We'd learn so much getting the federal government out of it.
Exactly. We need more middle-lane compromise and less bullheaded polarization.
Yes. It's another illness from WW2 when pay raises were banned