This is brilliant. Just too many unimaginative good guys in the GOP, although the upstarts are pretty savvy, and now fighting through the ruins from decades of cuckery and procedure.
Its racist and prevents black people from voting.
And I'm sure there are other lies as well, but if you cant be bothered to sit at the dmv for an hour and pay 23 bucks to get an id than I do t want you voting anyway. It's a low barrier to entry.
Unlike the barrier on the border. Finish the wall second term
Looks like checks will be tied to income tax returns, that are SS number driven. How many illegals do you think have stolen American SS numbers and filed? That is one crime that has never been prosecuted.
The short answer, no. Because digital data can be altered, easily. It would rely on trusting whomever is running it, and with an anonymous vote, no way to validate it. That would be a hard no for me.
relevant xkcd. Stay far, far, away from electronic voting systems of any capacity. It requires far more trust than anyone should be comfortable with. This includes touch screen machines.
Paper ballot and voter ID (and possibly purple ink on the thumb, Iraq style) is the way to go
You can create a scheme where every citizen of voting age receives a private/public key pair, then uses the private key to sign a block chain transaction with his vote attached to the public key. This way you accomplish two things:
The votes are public for anyone to count while the vote remains anonymous.
Anyone can check the block chain with their private key to make sure their vote is as they issued and has not been tampered with.
You would have to make it easy for people and ideally all with open source software for full transparency, but it is doable with the technology available today.
The only issue would be determining who can vote and providing the keys, but this problem also exists in paper voting.
That’s where you’re wrong. I know enough about software to know that there’s always a vulnerability somewhere (if something hasn’t been hacked, it’s because it isn’t worth the effort for anyone yet. Is there anything more “worth the effort” than the process which decides who runs the world superpower?). Here’s the problems I have with any voting system that’s not paper ballots:
Do you trust that the software installed on the machines is bug-free and records votes correctly?
Do you trust that the hardware of the machines is not compromised in any way?
How do you ensure that someone doesn’t modify the machine while it’s in use, whether that’s through the internet or a physical device?
After the polls are closed, how do you ensure that every vote on the machines is accurately transmitted to the registrar’s office to aggregate?
Once you have that figured out, how is the public sold on the scheme? People generally won’t trust it if they can’t understand how it works, and a key pair is definitely not simple
In the event of a recount, how are the original votes stored? How do we ensure the counts aren’t being tampered with?
There’s issues with paper ballots as well, but they mainly come down to whether we can trust the people doing the counting. That’s mitigated by transparency in the process, where anyone can observe how things are going. We don’t even have that with an electronic solution.
I’m not saying it’s impossible, but anything that people come up with needs to have solutions to the problems I outlined before it gets widespread adoption
Well, I am willing to say it is not possible. Any system that is accessible is hackable. No software is perfect (without bugs or flaws). And who would you trust to build it? I wouldn't trust myself to build it. Not that I am untrustworthy or lack the skills to do so. The implications of failure are so great that I wouldn't want to. That said, knowing that so many of my peers are full-on leftists. Yeah, no thanks.
The vulnerability with ANY remote voting is in the voter, as much or more than the system itself.
Take this blockchain example. The gov sends a bunch of keys to a nursing home. How do we validate that the residents got their key? Worse yet, if they didn't, how do we prove who did?
As President Trump has said, the only reliable way to prevent vote fraud is also incredibly simple. Present yourself at a polling place on the day of the election, produce a state issued photo ID, your name is checked against a list of voters in that district and checked off, you vote, and done. It's not completely impossible to defraud that system, but it's difficult, and nearly impossible to do at-scale without leaving breadcrumbs all over the place.
You have misunderstood what I proposing, which is partly my fault because I did not want to write too much just for a comment in a forum.
In the scheme I'm proposing there would not be voting machines. You would just download a software in your computer and with your unique private key, this program would send a transaction to a block chain.
There anyone can see the vote to count it, but not associate it to you. And you could use a different program to check that the first program has emitted the vote as you wished, hell, you could even check that in a webpage listing the block chain (ala a block explorer for crypto currencies). So if the first software was trying to cheat people, the voters would notice and raise the alarm.
You are right that the private key system could be difficult, specially at first. But you could distribute a self signing USB device to every voter, similar to a crypto currency hardware wallet but only for voting. In case you don't know how they work, this device stores the private key internally and never shares it with the computer (which could have malware), it just receives an input, in this case the vote, signs it with the private key internally and then gives the signed transaction for the computer to send it to the block chain.
You can find these devices for around 20usd. With the money you save from not having the whole in person electoral system, it could be easily funded. It might even save money, although being the government they would find a way of making it more expensive.
If you have more questions about how it would work, don't hold yourself back and ask. I'll be happy to answer.
And just for the record, I have no affiliation with any company pushing this system. This is just an idea that has been discussed in crypto currency circles.
Correction: there is no need to put anything in the next stimulus bill because there should not be another one. In fact, the existing stimulus bills should immediately be repealed.
But that would mean they'd suddenly grow Testicles and understand what they're used for. Our Gelded RINO's are incapable of fighting for anything.
We need to replace ALL of them. Only a select few seem to be able to fight so keep them. The rest, shitcan.
THEN! Then we cut the Gordian Knot and pass a law repealing EVERYTHING that was passed for 40-50 years while in the same bill replacing it all with only NEEDED laws and no fillers. You want filler? Go bitch to your state gov. No more AA, no more Title IX or X, no more special set asides, no more nothing. If your "Whateverthefuck" needs to be subsidized....then tough shit. If we suffer from it's disappearance then we'll see if we can bring it back. Until then we determine what's needed on the "Pain Scale". If we remove it and it hurts bad enough then maybe we bring it back. Until then it's gone.
Total annihilation of 50+ years of Bullshit that isn't needed and has turned into complete and total bloat costing us so much money it might even be unable to count it. Once that happens we can even pay off whatever debt we have even faster.
Make the Rebuilding of America a Priority. New Infrastructure from Coast to Coast to include looking at new and better ways to build Roads, Bridges, Communications Networks, Mass Transit and Railroads, Pipelines. New Construction Techniques. Redo Homes and Buildings in Hurricane Risk areas so that every damn time one makes land we don't lose a Bagillion Dollars and have everything go haywire for months on end. New Construction materials for Homes that are more efficient and sturdier. Make a REAL Education System where the Kids go to school all year around (where applicable) and get big breaks thru the year. Enable Learn/Work from Home to alleviate traffic congestion and give kids the ability to learn in an easier environment.
That California Commie made a good observation noticing that this is an opportunity to reform how we do things. IT IS!!!! But how about WE FUCKING DO IT THIS TIME. We put forth a complete plan. We reform everything to better fit a FREE Society of Independent Citizens who know better as to what THEIR pursuit of happiness is since only You can know what makes You Happy. Not some Bureaucrat in a far off place.
Let's do this. Let's just take over. We keep losing because the opposition has a plan. It's a shitty plan......but it's a plan and as history has shown, even a small Roman Legion, when faced with overwhelming odds, would often come out victorious due simply to discipline and A Fucking Plan of Action that each and every soldier knew. This needs to be us.
How about we just not play political games during a crisis when people's livelihoods are on the line? Let Nancy continue to self immolate with her pretty antics.
They should but they won't and really can't with Pelosi running the house. The only way that happens is if there are serious concessions by Republicans. Then the left will run this through their courts and get what they want anyway before 2020.
Next time we're the majority with a Dem president, Republicans better load every single bill with our wish lists if they keep this ridiculousness up through Trump 2nd term.
Except Democrats are paying a HEAVY political price. I have far leftist friends who were even expressing irritation that Pelosi hurt their election chances by playing politics with Covid. Even MSNPC criticized Pelosi.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD GET THIS PATRIOT A BRICK! THAT'S 167660 BRICKS HANDED OUT!
We are at 23.6146933904552952407793280% of our goal to BUILD THE WALL starting from Imperial Beach, CA to Brownsville, Texas! Let's make sure everyone gets a brick in the United States! For every Centipede a brick, for every brick a Centipede!
At this rate, the wall will be 1843.59672098179427990135920 MILES WIDE and 491.335010371028130990967020 FEET HIGH by tomorrow! DO YOUR PART!
Voter ID and no mail in voting for National elections, to include Congress. Also, make ballot harvesting illegal at the Federal election. Everyone is responsible for their own vote.
Might not be a popular opinion, but that is a horrible idea. Federal government should be involved as little as possible in how the states determine their elections.
This is brilliant. Just too many unimaginative good guys in the GOP, although the upstarts are pretty savvy, and now fighting through the ruins from decades of cuckery and procedure.
Can't wait til Candace Owens gets into Congress. Dream come true would be watching her steamroll AOC, Ilhan, Rashida and Mad Maxine.
Its racist and prevents black people from voting. And I'm sure there are other lies as well, but if you cant be bothered to sit at the dmv for an hour and pay 23 bucks to get an id than I do t want you voting anyway. It's a low barrier to entry.
Unlike the barrier on the border. Finish the wall second term
Is there a way to absolutely secure mail in or online voting? I have to believe a bank could come up with something. As with online banking.
It would probably involve something like voter ID first.
I wouldn't rely on the govt to come up with something.
Looks like checks will be tied to income tax returns, that are SS number driven. How many illegals do you think have stolen American SS numbers and filed? That is one crime that has never been prosecuted.
The short answer, no. Because digital data can be altered, easily. It would rely on trusting whomever is running it, and with an anonymous vote, no way to validate it. That would be a hard no for me.
You can use encryption and blockchain technology to make it secure and anonymous at the same time.
relevant xkcd. Stay far, far, away from electronic voting systems of any capacity. It requires far more trust than anyone should be comfortable with. This includes touch screen machines.
Paper ballot and voter ID (and possibly purple ink on the thumb, Iraq style) is the way to go
No, you don't understand.
You can create a scheme where every citizen of voting age receives a private/public key pair, then uses the private key to sign a block chain transaction with his vote attached to the public key. This way you accomplish two things:
The votes are public for anyone to count while the vote remains anonymous.
Anyone can check the block chain with their private key to make sure their vote is as they issued and has not been tampered with.
You would have to make it easy for people and ideally all with open source software for full transparency, but it is doable with the technology available today.
The only issue would be determining who can vote and providing the keys, but this problem also exists in paper voting.
That’s where you’re wrong. I know enough about software to know that there’s always a vulnerability somewhere (if something hasn’t been hacked, it’s because it isn’t worth the effort for anyone yet. Is there anything more “worth the effort” than the process which decides who runs the world superpower?). Here’s the problems I have with any voting system that’s not paper ballots:
Do you trust that the software installed on the machines is bug-free and records votes correctly?
Do you trust that the hardware of the machines is not compromised in any way?
How do you ensure that someone doesn’t modify the machine while it’s in use, whether that’s through the internet or a physical device?
After the polls are closed, how do you ensure that every vote on the machines is accurately transmitted to the registrar’s office to aggregate?
Once you have that figured out, how is the public sold on the scheme? People generally won’t trust it if they can’t understand how it works, and a key pair is definitely not simple
In the event of a recount, how are the original votes stored? How do we ensure the counts aren’t being tampered with?
There’s issues with paper ballots as well, but they mainly come down to whether we can trust the people doing the counting. That’s mitigated by transparency in the process, where anyone can observe how things are going. We don’t even have that with an electronic solution.
I’m not saying it’s impossible, but anything that people come up with needs to have solutions to the problems I outlined before it gets widespread adoption
Well, I am willing to say it is not possible. Any system that is accessible is hackable. No software is perfect (without bugs or flaws). And who would you trust to build it? I wouldn't trust myself to build it. Not that I am untrustworthy or lack the skills to do so. The implications of failure are so great that I wouldn't want to. That said, knowing that so many of my peers are full-on leftists. Yeah, no thanks.
The vulnerability with ANY remote voting is in the voter, as much or more than the system itself.
Take this blockchain example. The gov sends a bunch of keys to a nursing home. How do we validate that the residents got their key? Worse yet, if they didn't, how do we prove who did?
As President Trump has said, the only reliable way to prevent vote fraud is also incredibly simple. Present yourself at a polling place on the day of the election, produce a state issued photo ID, your name is checked against a list of voters in that district and checked off, you vote, and done. It's not completely impossible to defraud that system, but it's difficult, and nearly impossible to do at-scale without leaving breadcrumbs all over the place.
Sometimes, the old-tech simple ways are best.
You have misunderstood what I proposing, which is partly my fault because I did not want to write too much just for a comment in a forum.
In the scheme I'm proposing there would not be voting machines. You would just download a software in your computer and with your unique private key, this program would send a transaction to a block chain.
There anyone can see the vote to count it, but not associate it to you. And you could use a different program to check that the first program has emitted the vote as you wished, hell, you could even check that in a webpage listing the block chain (ala a block explorer for crypto currencies). So if the first software was trying to cheat people, the voters would notice and raise the alarm.
You are right that the private key system could be difficult, specially at first. But you could distribute a self signing USB device to every voter, similar to a crypto currency hardware wallet but only for voting. In case you don't know how they work, this device stores the private key internally and never shares it with the computer (which could have malware), it just receives an input, in this case the vote, signs it with the private key internally and then gives the signed transaction for the computer to send it to the block chain.
You can find these devices for around 20usd. With the money you save from not having the whole in person electoral system, it could be easily funded. It might even save money, although being the government they would find a way of making it more expensive.
If you have more questions about how it would work, don't hold yourself back and ask. I'll be happy to answer.
And just for the record, I have no affiliation with any company pushing this system. This is just an idea that has been discussed in crypto currency circles.
Whatever solution you come up with is going to be branded as 'racist' by dirty Dems approximately 1.2 milliseconds after they hear it.
Sounds like free advertising.
They have successfully worn that word out.
You can put the vote on a blockchain and the votes can never be changed. You would still need someway of identifiying the person doing the voting.
Correction: there is no need to put anything in the next stimulus bill because there should not be another one. In fact, the existing stimulus bills should immediately be repealed.
Let's ban ballot harvesting while we're at it. Once the polls close that should be it.
It isn't just ballot harvesting; take a look a Maine congressional district 2. The left stole that seat with "ranked choice".
Voter ID laws prevent internal election meddling. Of course the Democrats are the ones performing internal election meddling.
They prevent voter fraud, but not the widespread election fraud done by democrats.
But that would mean they'd suddenly grow Testicles and understand what they're used for. Our Gelded RINO's are incapable of fighting for anything.
We need to replace ALL of them. Only a select few seem to be able to fight so keep them. The rest, shitcan.
THEN! Then we cut the Gordian Knot and pass a law repealing EVERYTHING that was passed for 40-50 years while in the same bill replacing it all with only NEEDED laws and no fillers. You want filler? Go bitch to your state gov. No more AA, no more Title IX or X, no more special set asides, no more nothing. If your "Whateverthefuck" needs to be subsidized....then tough shit. If we suffer from it's disappearance then we'll see if we can bring it back. Until then we determine what's needed on the "Pain Scale". If we remove it and it hurts bad enough then maybe we bring it back. Until then it's gone.
Total annihilation of 50+ years of Bullshit that isn't needed and has turned into complete and total bloat costing us so much money it might even be unable to count it. Once that happens we can even pay off whatever debt we have even faster.
Make the Rebuilding of America a Priority. New Infrastructure from Coast to Coast to include looking at new and better ways to build Roads, Bridges, Communications Networks, Mass Transit and Railroads, Pipelines. New Construction Techniques. Redo Homes and Buildings in Hurricane Risk areas so that every damn time one makes land we don't lose a Bagillion Dollars and have everything go haywire for months on end. New Construction materials for Homes that are more efficient and sturdier. Make a REAL Education System where the Kids go to school all year around (where applicable) and get big breaks thru the year. Enable Learn/Work from Home to alleviate traffic congestion and give kids the ability to learn in an easier environment.
That California Commie made a good observation noticing that this is an opportunity to reform how we do things. IT IS!!!! But how about WE FUCKING DO IT THIS TIME. We put forth a complete plan. We reform everything to better fit a FREE Society of Independent Citizens who know better as to what THEIR pursuit of happiness is since only You can know what makes You Happy. Not some Bureaucrat in a far off place.
Let's do this. Let's just take over. We keep losing because the opposition has a plan. It's a shitty plan......but it's a plan and as history has shown, even a small Roman Legion, when faced with overwhelming odds, would often come out victorious due simply to discipline and A Fucking Plan of Action that each and every soldier knew. This needs to be us.
REFICIO AMERICANA
How about we just not play political games during a crisis when people's livelihoods are on the line? Let Nancy continue to self immolate with her pretty antics.
Republicans should be putting voter ID in nearly every bill.
Lindsey Graham will go on Hannity to talk about how we should have this and then do nothing about it.
Thank you for sharing.
We must combat voter fraud. President Trump’s biggest threat will not be Joe Biden. It will be voter fraud.
BRILLIANT MIND!!!
They should but they won't and really can't with Pelosi running the house. The only way that happens is if there are serious concessions by Republicans. Then the left will run this through their courts and get what they want anyway before 2020.
Too impractical.
How would voter ID be an effective counter to ballot harvesting or mail-in ballots? It wouldn't.
That would require them having the balls to implement their lip service, so not likely.
Concealed carry reciprocity. Voter ID. Free speech protections. Term limits. Immigration controls.
It's too late for this election.
Repubs don't wont it either. exterminate them all, replacement is the only answer
Next time we're the majority with a Dem president, Republicans better load every single bill with our wish lists if they keep this ridiculousness up through Trump 2nd term.
Should already be in effect!
👌👍👊😁😎😃💪
Except Democrats are paying a HEAVY political price. I have far leftist friends who were even expressing irritation that Pelosi hurt their election chances by playing politics with Covid. Even MSNPC criticized Pelosi.
Why not make the wall one foot higher while you’re at it! Need more bricks!
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD GET THIS PATRIOT A BRICK! THAT'S 167660 BRICKS HANDED OUT!
We are at 23.6146933904552952407793280% of our goal to BUILD THE WALL starting from Imperial Beach, CA to Brownsville, Texas! Let's make sure everyone gets a brick in the United States! For every Centipede a brick, for every brick a Centipede!
At this rate, the wall will be 1843.59672098179427990135920 MILES WIDE and 491.335010371028130990967020 FEET HIGH by tomorrow! DO YOUR PART!
Republicans will never fight.
Lol... they'd never sign it. Genius!
Would be nice to see Republicans grow a backbone and fight for their side. We've got a handful of good guys. We need more.
problem is, they don't want it either.
But voter id is racists towards dead people :)
Put immediate deportation for all illegals in there. We obviously cant take care of them in the middle of this shit.
What a great to get the Dems to vote against their own bill!
Why do we never get pork in but they always do?
Voter ID and no mail in voting for National elections, to include Congress. Also, make ballot harvesting illegal at the Federal election. Everyone is responsible for their own vote.
And repeal the NFA
Then the Democrats have to either pass it or eat their own words across every national headline. Brilliant idea.
Might not be a popular opinion, but that is a horrible idea. Federal government should be involved as little as possible in how the states determine their elections.
you dont think federal gov. should have a say in how federal elections are conducted?