point of note - the mortality rate is slightly under .2% and that's only because of the heavily-weighted over 80yr old numbers.
The common seasonal flu has a mortality rate around .18 or so.
I just checked mortality rates last night and in the US it has climbed to 6%, at least as numbers are reported on worldometers.info
SD is .5% I bet you can tell me why. What are they doing differently there? Their results are not as good as Dr Z's, they're "only" 12 x better than the National average. They probably aren't all consistently following Dr Z's protocol like Brazil has done, to reduce their IFR by 95%. Still ...
The thing is that those numbers are misleading. They only include known tested positives AND the death rate includes some untested and some who had comorbidities that may have actually killed them, skewing it higher. So we have to include those who have it and haven’t been tested (hopefully to be found in other studies- they already imply its 30-50x higher).
It's always funny how they don't get that relevance. Like if I had a room with 10 people in it, and 9 die, you'd say it's an unsafe room to be in. But if you have a room with 500million people and 9 die, it doesn't sound like a bad place to be.
The thing that bothers me most, my mom is one of those feels people and the news exploits this so bad playing sob stories. Last week I tried to balance my sources a little bit so I put on CNN, Anderson Cooper was on and he had on a woman (Remotely) whose husband died from coronavirus. They read his last words on air and cried together. My reaction was “this isn’t the news, this is Oprah”. Then I looked up the guy, and he was on Dialysis before he got coronavirus.
Interesting. I kept seeing that story and clips of her and Anderson crying, they never mentioned the dialysis. Also, the guy looked very heavy. I’ve heard a high BMI can be an issue.
The problem is the news uses numbers ONLY in a way that provokes fear. They don't say "they are expecting 30,000-40,000 deaths, which is typical for every annual flu season".
They'll say "40,000 left dead as the Coronavirus continues its reign of death all across the country".
Then they'll tell you about some 28 year old who dies of WuFlu. But they don't tell you he had leukemia or HIV or cystic fibrosis.
Everything in the media about this normal everyday flu is framed to cause fear and panic (also known as terrorism).
Honestly, this is the biggest psyop we've ever seen. And it's really not that hard to see through it.
I've lost hope for this country ever turning the corner. We can all return to our normal lives when the rulers allow it. But never forget that we are being allowed to.
It can only get worse. Not better. We may have the illusion that it's better, but it won't be.
It's again the law of opposites from the left at work. The lefties who claim to have a deep love for and understanding of science are the very people who dont even do basic math or logic.
Their "deep love" has no connection to being able to actually do anything. And understanding? I see no indication that they even value it. Who has told them this is important?
Yea, that is something that really pisses me off about all this. They are claiming it is so horrible, and "millions will die" and all that, and even their FAKE numbers aren't looking as bad as they keep screaming about. Even when they add up basically any other deaths they can get away with to the virus death count, it STILL doesn't add up to anything serious enough to cause all this mass hysteria with the lockdowns and shit.
And when you learn they are basically adding everything they possibly can to pad the numbers, and still not getting the fatality % they want, you realize the ACTUAL numbers are probably less than 0.5% deaths and they just want to trample on people's rights and gain that little bit more control.
It always amazes me that people STILL don't understand once you give up rights, even under the guise of it being "temporary", you will NEVER get those rights back. They just keep chipping away little by little, and people always think "well that doesn't seem so bad, and it is only temporary" until it is too late to turn back. You give up your right to do X thing "temporarily" and instead of getting it back later, another "temporary" thing comes up.
I keep hearing about the "total # of cases". I actually had to tell someone that countries with much higher populations will have a much higher number of cases.
Peak Clown World, folks. And if I were Bill Gates or George Soros or a Rothschild or whatever boogie man you want, I'd be loving what I'm seeing from the American population.
The only silver lining is that we don't have Hillery right now. Can you imagine? But Trump is temporary.
Pretty close to the number I came up with if you're looking at total dead vs total population, but that's a largely irrelevant metric. Two different directions give you something more meaningful:
total US deaths in a similar time period, but years apart. Last I knew our total deaths were down by more than total deaths due to CCPvirus. So we should use the left's talking point that "all deaths are Trump's fault," and then accurately state that (by that logic) he's creating more than 20,000 new lives.
This is a sketchy metric right now for a couple reasons: nobody's doing anything and lots more will die, at least from health issues that are NOT CCPvirus because they've been turned away or are deliberately not getting medical care out of fear of catching de plague. We're also going to see a second wave no mattter what we do, and Trump pills would prevent that from turning into a lot more dead. Or hospitalized. Or needing a ventilator.
So all the numbers we have would be not very indicative of what's really going on, even if we were being told the truth. But we know we're being lied to.
Another metric that's more meaningful than dead vs total population is dead vs how many have been exposed to CCPvirus. We don't have that info. We don't have any idea how many caught it. In some small regions you've seen antibody testing show there are somewhere between 30 and 80 x more infected people than previously thought. From MN west to the east side of the coastal mountains on the left coast those numbers probably have no bearing. (And this is probably also true of at least the rural half of WI and IL that still has 10 or fewer cases per County)
All we have is total "confirmed cases," and comparing that to total dead. This is our most meaningful metric. We know this virus is highly contagious, so being able to estimate how many will die per how many catch it is significant. That number (IFR) was 6% for the US last night, using the numbers provided by worldometers.info. SD has .5%. You'd think Governors would be looking at that stark difference and wanting to duplicate whatever SD is doing differently.
They are just trying to pump their points. Just like they say America has the most positive cases! Oh no! But what they leave out is that we are testing the most people and have a much larger population than many of these other places,
The problem when in dialogue with lefty shitweasels is that you have to be cumbersomely specific otherwise they wiggle through any linguistic holes that they can.
I knew this push for universal health care was coming because they are currently in the process of bankrupting all our hospitals. Entire hospital floors empty, doctors and nurses being furloughed, etc.
We have to get them -- and everyone else -- back to work before it's too late.
Wouldn't? Or did they actually face their healthcare system at capacity, with no ability to treat everyone that needed it?
I would point out that they got hit hard so early that we didn't know about Trump pills, and healthcare workers had a legitimate excuse to not know that ventilators are a TERRIBLE way to treat CCPvirus, especially when you use a ventilator in the usual way.
I already knew how ventilators would be misused, and most US Drs are still making that mistake. But I think data does support the "ICU beds and ventilators" shortage that kicked off the media induced hysteria here.
No it causes it, because it ties the healthcare system to the national budget, which inevitably gets strained because of the socialism and then ‘austerity’ is required; ie. cutbacks on the services
They don't but they do look for off-label solutions. Something US Healthcare industry avoids. That's the only highlight I can think of and it isn't directly tied to social medicine. We have a big pharma mafia that needs to be plowed.
When I was growing up, healthcare was never an issue. I’m not super old, Gen X, but I know things were pretty solid until we started getting an influx of immigrants and people who would go to hospitals and not have health insurance.
When I graduated college (at 22), I was off my parents insurance. They did not allow 26-year-olds to still be on mom and dad’s policy like today. Heck, I was an adult! One of the first things I did while looking for a better job was get an insurance policy in case I got sick. I paid $78 a month. I didn’t make a lot, but I knew I needed to be covered just like I had to pay car insurance. I prioritized my needs and didn’t spend money on wants like expensive coffees-I don’t know that we even had any Starbucks around me at that time, technology, clothes and shoes. I worked. Paid my bills and did what I was supposed to do. Now people feel they should get everything free. They show up at an ER with a cough.
I am so exhausted with supplementing everyone else’s food, housing, healthcare.
My great grandmother used to tell us, “Those that work should live better than those that don’t.”
If people don’t want to live in poverty we need to stop encouraging bad choices. We need to stop rewarding people for their poor life choices. To avoid poverty isn’t hard:
Graduate high school 2. No children until your married 3. Work a full time job
No more illegal immigration. No more “free” visits to the ER that raise my premiums and deductibles to cover someone else.
This is why I told my boys when they were mite hockey players to CARRY THEIR OWN BAG! None of those lazy, old lady roller bags for our family. My kids were packing and carrying those hockey bags by themselves. Some days, when the snow was high, it was a struggle. But today, they are better for it.
Giving people free stuff or doing things for people that they should do themselves doesn't help them in the long run.
how short people's memories are! at the beginning of this, when it was revealed that cuomo had frittered away respirator/emergency funds on solar panels, his medical plan also came to light: care by lottery, "making the difficult decisions" as to who got care, and it wasn't looking good for those of us over 55. iow, effingham death panels.
and now, in hindsight, we can see that his version of "socialized medicine" involves sending covid+ seniors back to nursing homes to "socialize" with the elderly and most vulnerable residents and kill them off.
Yes, because universal health care has worked so well in Europe where fatality rates are about double what they are here.
Per capita, don’t leave that out they’ll call you out on the numbers
Reasonable person: We did well considering mortality rates were expected to be around 5%.
The left: Less people died in Iceland.
Also the left: travel bans are racist, not eating Chinese food is racist, not going to Chinatown for lunar new year is racist.
Well, fuck most foreigners and their new year, the food can stay.
point of note - the mortality rate is slightly under .2% and that's only because of the heavily-weighted over 80yr old numbers. The common seasonal flu has a mortality rate around .18 or so.
Considering it is less than .03% to .1%, it's just a fucking common cold.
I just checked mortality rates last night and in the US it has climbed to 6%, at least as numbers are reported on worldometers.info
SD is .5% I bet you can tell me why. What are they doing differently there? Their results are not as good as Dr Z's, they're "only" 12 x better than the National average. They probably aren't all consistently following Dr Z's protocol like Brazil has done, to reduce their IFR by 95%. Still ...
The thing is that those numbers are misleading. They only include known tested positives AND the death rate includes some untested and some who had comorbidities that may have actually killed them, skewing it higher. So we have to include those who have it and haven’t been tested (hopefully to be found in other studies- they already imply its 30-50x higher).
It's always funny how they don't get that relevance. Like if I had a room with 10 people in it, and 9 die, you'd say it's an unsafe room to be in. But if you have a room with 500million people and 9 die, it doesn't sound like a bad place to be.
Leftist think math is racist so it shouldn't be a surprise. Understanding they don't understand math explains a lot as to why they favor communism.
And why they insist so much on being recognized for their deep appreciation of science.
Common core
The thing that bothers me most, my mom is one of those feels people and the news exploits this so bad playing sob stories. Last week I tried to balance my sources a little bit so I put on CNN, Anderson Cooper was on and he had on a woman (Remotely) whose husband died from coronavirus. They read his last words on air and cried together. My reaction was “this isn’t the news, this is Oprah”. Then I looked up the guy, and he was on Dialysis before he got coronavirus.
Interesting. I kept seeing that story and clips of her and Anderson crying, they never mentioned the dialysis. Also, the guy looked very heavy. I’ve heard a high BMI can be an issue.
You’re right. Anderson is Oprah.
The problem is the news uses numbers ONLY in a way that provokes fear. They don't say "they are expecting 30,000-40,000 deaths, which is typical for every annual flu season".
They'll say "40,000 left dead as the Coronavirus continues its reign of death all across the country".
Then they'll tell you about some 28 year old who dies of WuFlu. But they don't tell you he had leukemia or HIV or cystic fibrosis.
Everything in the media about this normal everyday flu is framed to cause fear and panic (also known as terrorism).
Honestly, this is the biggest psyop we've ever seen. And it's really not that hard to see through it.
I've lost hope for this country ever turning the corner. We can all return to our normal lives when the rulers allow it. But never forget that we are being allowed to.
It can only get worse. Not better. We may have the illusion that it's better, but it won't be.
A room with 500 million people sounds like a horrible place to be, it would smell like hoagies and pee probably.
So you're saying it would smell better than a feminist rally.
Sounds like the Minnesota State Fair they rave about around here.
It's how big the 2023 Trump rallies are going to be.
It's again the law of opposites from the left at work. The lefties who claim to have a deep love for and understanding of science are the very people who dont even do basic math or logic.
I've observed the same.
Their "deep love" has no connection to being able to actually do anything. And understanding? I see no indication that they even value it. Who has told them this is important?
Reality is a fluid thing in the minds of Leftists.
Deaths per 1M Pop (from worldometer site)
USA: 179
Spain: 519
Italy: 453
France: 362
UK: 319
Germany: 75
Belgium: 647
Netherlands: 275
Sweeden: 244
And this includes all of the fake deaths being reported in places like New York.
Yea, that is something that really pisses me off about all this. They are claiming it is so horrible, and "millions will die" and all that, and even their FAKE numbers aren't looking as bad as they keep screaming about. Even when they add up basically any other deaths they can get away with to the virus death count, it STILL doesn't add up to anything serious enough to cause all this mass hysteria with the lockdowns and shit.
And when you learn they are basically adding everything they possibly can to pad the numbers, and still not getting the fatality % they want, you realize the ACTUAL numbers are probably less than 0.5% deaths and they just want to trample on people's rights and gain that little bit more control.
It always amazes me that people STILL don't understand once you give up rights, even under the guise of it being "temporary", you will NEVER get those rights back. They just keep chipping away little by little, and people always think "well that doesn't seem so bad, and it is only temporary" until it is too late to turn back. You give up your right to do X thing "temporarily" and instead of getting it back later, another "temporary" thing comes up.
I keep hearing about the "total # of cases". I actually had to tell someone that countries with much higher populations will have a much higher number of cases.
Peak Clown World, folks. And if I were Bill Gates or George Soros or a Rothschild or whatever boogie man you want, I'd be loving what I'm seeing from the American population.
The only silver lining is that we don't have Hillery right now. Can you imagine? But Trump is temporary.
I’m no math person, so someone help me out, but what is that? 0.017 percent?
We shutdown the economy and have 26 million unemployed people for this?
Anything to damage the economy Trump built.
Literally the flu.
If you haven't watched the two California ER docs posted on TD, I'd recommend it. Simple logic says this is mass hysteria.
Pretty close to the number I came up with if you're looking at total dead vs total population, but that's a largely irrelevant metric. Two different directions give you something more meaningful:
This is a sketchy metric right now for a couple reasons: nobody's doing anything and lots more will die, at least from health issues that are NOT CCPvirus because they've been turned away or are deliberately not getting medical care out of fear of catching de plague. We're also going to see a second wave no mattter what we do, and Trump pills would prevent that from turning into a lot more dead. Or hospitalized. Or needing a ventilator.
So all the numbers we have would be not very indicative of what's really going on, even if we were being told the truth. But we know we're being lied to.
All we have is total "confirmed cases," and comparing that to total dead. This is our most meaningful metric. We know this virus is highly contagious, so being able to estimate how many will die per how many catch it is significant. That number (IFR) was 6% for the US last night, using the numbers provided by worldometers.info. SD has .5%. You'd think Governors would be looking at that stark difference and wanting to duplicate whatever SD is doing differently.
Yep, i don't know if they aren't smart enough to realize these are smaller countries, or just intentionally ignorant to force their point
They are just trying to pump their points. Just like they say America has the most positive cases! Oh no! But what they leave out is that we are testing the most people and have a much larger population than many of these other places,
So I'm being pedantic here, but the word "rates" already implies per-capita.
The problem when in dialogue with lefty shitweasels is that you have to be cumbersomely specific otherwise they wiggle through any linguistic holes that they can.
And - how does the universality of a healthcare system prevent infection or prevent hospital overloads?
It doesn't. It is not about helping people. It is about control.
It prevents hospital overloads because they can just kick out the people they don’t think deserve to be there!
I knew this push for universal health care was coming because they are currently in the process of bankrupting all our hospitals. Entire hospital floors empty, doctors and nurses being furloughed, etc.
We have to get them -- and everyone else -- back to work before it's too late.
It's too late.
I like where you're going with this...
...and that right there is why the mortality rate in Italy was so high. They wouldn't treat the elderly.
Wouldn't? Or did they actually face their healthcare system at capacity, with no ability to treat everyone that needed it?
I would point out that they got hit hard so early that we didn't know about Trump pills, and healthcare workers had a legitimate excuse to not know that ventilators are a TERRIBLE way to treat CCPvirus, especially when you use a ventilator in the usual way.
I already knew how ventilators would be misused, and most US Drs are still making that mistake. But I think data does support the "ICU beds and ventilators" shortage that kicked off the media induced hysteria here.
It does not.
No it causes it, because it ties the healthcare system to the national budget, which inevitably gets strained because of the socialism and then ‘austerity’ is required; ie. cutbacks on the services
This is exactly what happened in Italy
Ding! Ding! Ding!
They don't but they do look for off-label solutions. Something US Healthcare industry avoids. That's the only highlight I can think of and it isn't directly tied to social medicine. We have a big pharma mafia that needs to be plowed.
"Swimmin with the fishes" is an approved mafia term. Whacked. Offd. Wearing cement shoes. "Let's take a little ride" even has the same connotation.
Getting plowed has a rather different meaning, or at least it used to lol
When I was growing up, healthcare was never an issue. I’m not super old, Gen X, but I know things were pretty solid until we started getting an influx of immigrants and people who would go to hospitals and not have health insurance.
When I graduated college (at 22), I was off my parents insurance. They did not allow 26-year-olds to still be on mom and dad’s policy like today. Heck, I was an adult! One of the first things I did while looking for a better job was get an insurance policy in case I got sick. I paid $78 a month. I didn’t make a lot, but I knew I needed to be covered just like I had to pay car insurance. I prioritized my needs and didn’t spend money on wants like expensive coffees-I don’t know that we even had any Starbucks around me at that time, technology, clothes and shoes. I worked. Paid my bills and did what I was supposed to do. Now people feel they should get everything free. They show up at an ER with a cough.
I am so exhausted with supplementing everyone else’s food, housing, healthcare.
My great grandmother used to tell us, “Those that work should live better than those that don’t.”
If people don’t want to live in poverty we need to stop encouraging bad choices. We need to stop rewarding people for their poor life choices. To avoid poverty isn’t hard:
No more illegal immigration. No more “free” visits to the ER that raise my premiums and deductibles to cover someone else.
I could rant all day.
My first real job in high school was 2004 working at Arby's. Full time, benefits, 401k with a match, health and dental.
After the ACA...kids today probably wouldn't believe me. This was entry level fast food.
So now things are worse and the government that made it worse gets to bitch about it and tell us they can fix it.
Every time the government gets involved things get screwed up.
This is why I told my boys when they were mite hockey players to CARRY THEIR OWN BAG! None of those lazy, old lady roller bags for our family. My kids were packing and carrying those hockey bags by themselves. Some days, when the snow was high, it was a struggle. But today, they are better for it.
Giving people free stuff or doing things for people that they should do themselves doesn't help them in the long run.
Yeah but they can then deny access to healthcare for racists, nazis, bigots, ... which is the actual plan
Bingo. The goal is to deny certain people access to anything and everything. Food, shelter, jobs, healtchcare, you name it.
This is the 666 of Revelation.
how short people's memories are! at the beginning of this, when it was revealed that cuomo had frittered away respirator/emergency funds on solar panels, his medical plan also came to light: care by lottery, "making the difficult decisions" as to who got care, and it wasn't looking good for those of us over 55. iow, effingham death panels.
and now, in hindsight, we can see that his version of "socialized medicine" involves sending covid+ seniors back to nursing homes to "socialize" with the elderly and most vulnerable residents and kill them off.
How old is he? He looks older than the crypt keeper. Ugly bastard. Pretty shortsighted move there