Except they did have such trouble containing it, and we know it did because they maliciously prioritized isolating Wuhan and the surrounding areas from the rest of the PRC while allowing it to go wild abroad.
Since the Wuhan flu isn't dangerous, we are left to conclude that the only danger that spread from Wuhan is government overreaction.
If you're trying to spread overreaction, would you try to stop the spread of the virus in earnest?
Firstly: Flu isn't a harmless virus. It is NOT worth shutting down an entire country or global economy over, but it kills thousands in the US every year, let alone globally.
Flu and pneumonia deaths are down this year as Wuhan flu deaths are up. Nothing more dangerous than normal has been released.
Except for mass hysteria, of course. That has spread from its epicentre in Wuhan very nicely.
it takes a real chowderhead to argue it's "harmless."
"Mostly Harmless" IS NOT EQUAL TO "Harmless."
So more people are going to die of pnuemonia and other Wuhan flu related complications this year than normal?
If not, where is the "harm"?
Except, of course, in the mass hysteria.
And i know better in part because I've done volunteer orderly work during it.
Oh, so you have access to more accurate statistics than I do? Could you post them?
There's a reason appeal to authority is a logical fallacy.
Secondly: I'm also precluding the possibility of [the wuhan flu being highly infectious, but harmless] because a major reason why reason why the Wuhan Virology lab brought ChiCom COVID in was to try and understand its cross species jumping and the threat it posed to people. (Ironic, given how their own shitty workmanship helped it get loose and damage humans extensively).
So? China is researching bioweapons, this isn't controversial.
The controversial opinion that you seem to hold is that China is any good at it. They're not. Far better parties than them, such as the Russians and the US and the Jesuits, have tried to create a deadly contagious virus. They have all failed.
So, evidently, has China. But they would have already known that, there's no way anyone would have mistaken the Wuhan flu for a dangerous virus. Which is why the plan from the beginning was to spread hysteria. Which they've done nicely.
The most likely scenario is- surprise- it's like the Flu. A highly infectious but only moderately debilitating/SLIGHTLY dangerous disease.
So where are all the moderately debilitated Wuhan flu patients? Where are the elevated rates of death?
Will you refer me back to your experience as a volunteer again, instead of referring to statistics and data?
But that's a pattern of infection that can still kill thousands upon thousands of people per year, even without nonsense like the Communists going full Milan and welding the infected in to their own homes with their families or Cuomo and Kaiser Wilhelm shoving the infected in nursing homes.
You don't seem to understand that.
Here, I will highlight the most important word in the above statement:
can
Fuck off with these shitty projections. Let us discuss actual data, in which nothing you are saying above has come true.
On the basis of "Do you know LITERALLY ANYTHING about the Chinese Communist Party?"
On the basis of "actually learn something about the average profile of Flu or other High Infectivity low danger diseases and how those can still kill thousands."
On the basis that "frequent dishonesty and bias by private or local authorities cooking the numbers" is less unreliable than "SYSTEMATIC dishonesty in which on top of the locals cooking the books and making it harder to get reliable estimates, the totalitarian regime then takes those already-inaccurate numbers and LIES BLATANTLY ABOUT THEM, persecuting anybody who dares differ."
Even Whitmer the Michigan Hitler hasn't been able to imprison and murder people for daring to raise the alarm about cooked American medical books or overreporting.
That's exactly what the CCP did.
None of this answered my question, which was "why do you trust faked US data over faked Chinese data"? They're both fake.
This is a normal flu season. Unless the Wuhan flu has somehow cured the flu and replaced it with a virus which, for all intents and purposes, is the flu. But I'm going to go with Occam on that one.
This shouldn't be rocket science to someone who isn't a Chinese Communist Shill. The CCP is the most murderous government in the history of PLANET EARTH. To that notable distinction, it is heir to a Marxist-Leninist system of constant dishonesty, suspicion, and Orwellian misgovernment.
As bad as the US is- and it can get pretty bad- it is still FAR less corrupt and dishonest than the PRC HAS. EVER. BEEN.
Do you understand, or do I have to start listing the number of people who were killed to cover this up, often by intentional exposure to the virus along with denial of even basic hygiene or treatment?
You're getting hyperemotional, which is how you've concluded I'm a PRC shill. Fucking kek.
You think a totalitarian Communist Party Government limited its dishonesty to the initial overreaction?
Oh you SWEET NAIVE SUMMER CHILD
Again, this is not true. The dishonesty also extended back to the suppression of early reports (when reasonable and sane precautions could have contained it).
It extends forward to shilling about how well the CCP has handled the virus (or did you not notice Communist shills like Tedros and Bill Gates doing so)?
No, retard, I don't think the CPC's dishonesty is limited in any way. However, I want to re-direct this conversation back away from your manifest emotions, and towards the data.
Where, in the data, is your assertion of a dangerous virus from Wuhan borne out?
It's the flu. The hysteria is the real danger.
No, they didn't.
They initially set out to shut up anybody from the Wuhan Virology Labs from telling people there was a threat of a COVID leak, up to and including the public humiliation and then murder of one of their scientists. All in order to "Save Face."
That backfired on them. So then they progressed to hiding the nature and severity of the outbreak, doing things like cutting Wuhan off from contact with the rest of Commie China and welding people inside their homes while simultaneously not caring about people from Wuhan flying to places like Vietnam, spreading the disease. While simultaneously sending news to their citizens abroad to hoard supplies.
Now we're on stage three, with the virus mostly winding down.
Stage three is about justifying the barbaric conduct of the Communist Party, insisting that it bravely led the Chinese people through the Long March of COVID, and that the CCP's leadership is an example the rest of the world can imitate, while trying to keep the shut down foreign economies shut down for as long as possible.
And of course, thoroughly lying about the CCP's culpability in this getting so bad in the first place and the merest >SUGGESTION that it did not play the role of glorious light of the world.
You apparently haven't been paying attention to this prior to this last stage three, and it shows.
So your theory is that the CCP somehow mistook the harmless Wuhan flu for a dangerous virus, then tried to spread it all over the world before realizing it's actually harmless?
China took the regular flu. It reacted to it in a totally insane manner, which made everyone else wonder if there was something to the virus which justified that reaction. It acted in a suspicious manner intended to make us worry, sending travellers from Wuhan everywhere in the world except China. It banked on its lack of credibility by telling us all there was nothing to worry about (which naturally made us worry more). And now that we're all in a panic over nothing, they're advancing their interests in HK, India, Taiwan, the South Pacific, and elsewhere.
Your theory only makes sense if the Wuhan flu were dangerous, which it isn't, or if there were some reason to believe the Wuhan flu were dangerous, which there never was to begin with.
Do you remember all those CPC videos of people collapsing because of the virus? Why would they make things up about the virus if it were dangerous? They could have just told the truth about the danger of the virus.
Again, learn how dangerous the flu is. Or basic virology.
Just because you haven't died of it and I haven't died of it doesn't mean people don't die of it. A fair number.
It's not a VERY dangerous disease, but even marginally dangerous diseases kill thousands at a rate few people recognize.
And considering how it was apparently suitable enough for the CCP to EXECUTE A WHISTLEBLOWER by way of ChiCom COVID along with denial of basic medical care, it clearly isn't That little of a threat.
Anon. This year's flu season would have occurred with or without China's theatrics in Wuhan. No further biological danger or risk was added to the world. We're all just as likely to die of this year's flu as we have been for previous years.
The only added risk is from the pandemic of hysteria, which is the CPC's only weapon here (since the Wuhan flu is harmless).
You think a totalitarian socialist system is capable of that clear thinking and foreplanning? That's cute.
You think the leaders of China are stupid because they advocate socialism for the Chinese masses?
Chinese Communist hoarding was partially to create shortages and worsen existing ones so that other countries had to come begging to the CCP for imports (at a cost), but the leaks show this was not because the CCP viewed the disease as a non-starter. Very much the opposite.
The leaks. From Communist China.
The entire panic about the Wuhan flu was leaked intentionally.
Again, the fact that they executed a whistleblower using it and had endemic problems in studying it safely in their own Virology Lab shows it.
Doctors have been dying under suspicious circumstances everywhere since the Wuhan flu began. Probably for noticing it's just a flu.
You're trying to beat reality and the evidence to fit your pre-conceived theory rather than adjusting your theory to comport with evidence. And it's showing.
Fucking hilarious. The guy who insists the Wuhan flu is dangerous and harmful, but can't produce a single shred of evidence beyond "I'm a VoLuNtEeR, Ok??", now accuses me of trying to fit the facts to a pre-conceived theory.
I am mostly taking the numbers you can get from previous, mostly non-memory holed records of the average, yearly flu and applying them to the PRC. And noting that it's utterly retarded to claim that a totalitarian, mass murdering, and pervasively dishonest regime that originated the disease and generally has much more brutal, less competent administration and health facilities than we do would have less COVID deaths than we do.
Ok, but where in this do you get the idea that the Wuhan flu is killing more people than the regular flu?
Because it isn't. Nowhere on earth. Not even China.
No, retard, I don't think the CPC's dishonesty is limited in any way.
Let me emphasize the most important part of this sentence, which you apparently do not grasp the importance of.
No, retard, I don't think the CPC's dishonesty is limited in any way.
That's the key freaking difference.
The Western Liars spitting out the false Coronavirus toll are limited. They might be able to lie about someone dying in a car crash being killed by ChiCom COVID, they can classify Pneumonia deaths as COVID, and do a lot.
But they mostly can't manufacture corpses to label as "COVID." They also can't really incinerate hundreds of bodies without record. And they have to at least make the Pretense of keeping an ongoing count of the cases. In no small part because Western citizens aren't totally cucked yet and the corrupt arsehats don't have a one party system where Comrade Hillary will lie about everything for them.
The ChiComs don't have any of those problems , or at least in nowhere near the degree their Mirror Image Western Propagandists do.
Lincoln said that if you want to see the measure of a man, give him power.
The West's swamp dwellers have much less power to lie about things than the Chinese swamp dwellers do. Which is why the former are limited in ways the ChiComs aren't.
As even a Lefty Socialist like Orwell could predict, regarding the production of boots.
In any case, sixty-two millions was no nearer the truth than fifty-seven millions, or than a hundred and forty-five millions. Very likely no boots had been produced at all. Likelier still, nobody knew how many had been produced, much less cared. All one knew was that every quarter astronomical numbers of boots were produced on paper, while perhaps half the population of Oceania went barefoot.
Welcome to Socialism, Comrade. Where death itself waits for Comrade Xi's go ahead.
However, I want to re-direct this conversation back away from your manifest emotions, and towards the data.
That'd be a change, considering you haven't provided any data.
I've had to do that for both of us.
Where, in the data, is your assertion of a dangerous virus from Wuhan borne out?
Both the Hysteria and the WuFlu are real dangers. The Hysteria's the greater one.
And again, you do NOBODY any service by denying reality.
Which is again why you keep failing to discuss the early spread of this virus correctly (as shown by recorded history), and why the Taiwanese acting fast and smart turned it into a nonissue while the idiots trying to deny that WuFlu was even SOMEWHAT dangerous in Florence and New York racked up deaths that could have been prevented entirely.
So your theory is that the CCP somehow mistook the harmless Wuhan flu for a dangerous virus, then tried to spread it all over the world before realizing it's actually harmless?
No you semi-literate.
My theory is simple.
WuFlu is a marginal danger and the Chinese Communists more or less knew it. It can kill you, but not easily.
But what they DIDN'T know was just how easy it was to get sick with it, and how many people would die from that (they just knew it wasn't a world-ender since they were able to study it in its natural habitat in the Southwest). So while they knew it would not do "World Ending damage", they didn't know how much human or economic damage it COULD do (not much, as it turned out) or how to prepare to pre-empt it, just that it could do said damage. Which is kind of important for the CPC, since they are reliant upon economic growth to avoid people turning on them and that growth has been slowing by the month.
So the virus is something that even saner people than the Chinese Communists would like to research.
They were almost certainly not trying to create a Bioweapon (WuFlu isn't THAT dangerous), but probably to find other ways like how to block transmission.
Unfortunately, the staff on hand were idiots and many got infected (see the video above).
But when some of the medical staff tried to warn people about this, the local Commie Party bosses shut it down, up to and including humiliating and then murdering one of their own doctors.
They did this fearing that if Bad Stuff (TM) happened in their neighborhood they'd be made scapegoats and punished by Xi and the higher ups.
But to the surprise of what should have been very few people but- as it turned out- far more because of the Local Party Bosses trying to keep it under wraps, the lab's sloppiness ultimately resulted in the virus getting out and starting to infect lots of people and kill a very few of those, damaging the economy about like what you'd expect from a seasonal Flu.
Bit it also brought the attention of XI and the CCP at large. But it also brought it to the attention of the Chinese citizens living under the Party's yoke and several neighboring countries like Taiwan.
Partially for fear that Commie COVID would devastate the economy and so weaken their power and the iron fist, and partially because they overshot how damaging it was, but primarily in order to Kill The Story. To try and get ahead of events and prevent people from blaming the Party (or at least the National Party) for what happened and retain control with both the regime's credibility and social stability.
To save face.
Which is why when around the time this happened the Taiwanese started warning people about this and send messages to the WHO, the ChiComs worked to shut them out and quash any rumor that there was ANYTHING AT ALL to panic about in Wuhan in order to keep that sweet tourist and export money coming and to buy time to hoard medical supplies in order to try and ride it out.
And it worked far better than it ever should have, because while some people like Trump twigged to it and shut down flights to the PRC, most didn't take such steps.
But the fact that it Worked didn't mean that this actually stopped the spread of ChiCom COVID within China. Like the local party bosses before them, XI and co's decision to bury the story just meant it blew up later, especially since this came after the Chinese Lunar New Year brought people from all across China to Wuhan and then back again.
Fast forward a few months ultimately even puppets like the WHO were limited in how much they could deny the obvious and even looted goods could only go so far. Which led to a vicious little cycle for a bit where the CCP extended its lockdown from Wuhan while at the same time useful idiots like Ferguson and Fauxi gin up panic and shut down the country (along unfortunately with Trump in what I think was an unfortunate overreaction after his initial brilliant one).
And it's only NOW- where they're working but most countries that did shut down still are- that they shifted gears from "Everything's Fine Guys!" to "OMG THE SKY IS FALLING" because the longer they can make foreigners believe the Sky is Falling the more lost ground they can make up before getting run over by the Trump Train and other nations not shackled by such a shithole system recovering.
The Western Liars spitting out the false Coronavirus toll are limited. They might be able to lie about someone dying in a car crash being killed by ChiCom COVID, they can classify Pneumonia deaths as COVID, and do a lot.
But they mostly can't manufacture corpses to label as "COVID." They also can't really incinerate hundreds of bodies without record. And they have to at least make the Pretense of keeping an ongoing count of the cases. In no small part because Western citizens aren't totally cucked yet and the corrupt arsehats don't have a one party system where Comrade Hillary will lie about everything for them.
The ChiComs don't have any of those problems , or at least in nowhere near the degree their Mirror Image Western Propagandists do.
That explains how the US is up to 100,000 so-called Wuhan flu deaths, while Japan only had 800 (and no lockdown)!
You've grossly underestimated the degree of corruption in your country, anon.
Welcome to Socialism, Comrade. Where death itself waits for Comrade Xi's go ahead.
Not from this year's flu season, it doesn't. The Wuhan flu is harmless.
Ask the freaking Taiwanese.
Taiwan had a regular flu season. What are you talking about?
Wuhan Flu is a dangerous virus, just not a greatly dangerous one. It isn't going to end the world but it is something you want to jump on early.
The Taiwanese weren't as ignorant about that principle as you are. Which is precisely why- by recognizing the Coronavirus as the threat it is (no more and no less) they thoroughly kicked its butt without destroying their country or the economy.
Japan didn't overreact like Taiwan, and suffered comparable deaths. This is because the Wuhan flu isn't dangerous at all, it's just this year's flu season.
Both the Hysteria and the WuFlu are real dangers. The Hysteria's the greater one.
No, because we have flu seasons every year. There is no additional danger this year over any other year.
We've never had hysteria like this though!
And again, you do NOBODY any service by denying reality.
And where, again, in the world is this reality you imagine manifest?
You tried Taiwan, but it wasn't manifest there. Try again?
Or I can save you some time. The answer is "nowhere in the world. It's just a flu."
Which is again why you keep failing to discuss the early spread of this virus correctly (as shown by recorded history), and why the Taiwanese acting fast and smart turned it into a nonissue
But Japan didn't, and it still wasn't an issue. Weird!
while the idiots trying to deny that WuFlu was even SOMEWHAT dangerous in Florence and New York racked up deaths that could have been prevented entirely.
It wasn't dangerous there. Italy has a meltdown over every flu season, their health care system is in a shambles.
New York/NJ deaths are entirely attributed to moving this year's flu patients into old folks' homes. There was room in the hospitals for them, and the Navy hospital ships were there too (unused). If you did that any other flu season, you'd get additional deaths.
So while they knew it would not do "World Ending damage", they didn't know how much human or economic damage it COULD do (not much, as it turned out) or how to prepare to pre-empt it, just that it could do said damage. Which is kind of important for the CPC, since they are reliant upon economic growth to avoid people turning on them and that growth has been slowing by the month.
Their economy would have crashed around the same time, Wuhan flu or no. The tariffs are fatal to their economy, their foreign cash reserves are just about depleted.
Unfortunately, the staff on hand were idiots and many got infected (see the video above).
But when some of the medical staff tried to warn people about this
Warn people about what? That they invented a flu? That 0.02% of the scientists in the lab died of the flu they invented? How many people working in the lab would have to have gotten infected for there to have been a case to be worth warning anyone about?
the virus spread so widely it became impossible to hide or ignore. )
But it hasn't done this anywhere in the world, at all. Except for old folks' homes into which Wuhan flu patients were intentionally and needlessly moved.
And this is bad in a totalitarian regime that doesn't give a fig about human lives but cares greatly about how well its economy is doing. And while Socialists may claim to have transcended our economics, they have the same problems as the rest of us. So like us, the longer they stayed shut down, the more money they bled and the more people get angry. Only Xi faces the prospect of them getting angry not at Governor Whitmer and going to the Ballot Box, but angry at Him and going to war.
Their economy was doomed because tariffs. The virus was a palatable excuse for China to begin reverting to North Korea standards of living, which is all that China can afford to provide now that the US has erected tariffs.
China took the regular flu. It reacted to it in a totally insane manner, which made everyone else wonder if there was something to the virus which justified that reaction. It acted in a suspicious manner intended to make us worry, sending travellers from Wuhan everywhere in the world except China. It banked on its lack of credibility by telling us all there was nothing to worry about (which naturally made us worry more). And now that we're all in a panic over nothing, they're advancing their interests in HK, India, Taiwan, the South Pacific, and elsewhere.
Talk about an unsupported goulash of a theory, based around trying to ram your pet idea through the evidence rather than making a new one to fit the evidence. And to think you quoted Occam.
Now, let's go through and tear this apart.
China took the regular flu. It reacted to it in a totally insane manner, which made everyone else wonder if there was something to the virus which justified that reaction.
Finally something we can agree on.
The problem is that a lot of people- either those that don't understand how totalitarian socialists (dys)function or those that are totalitarian socialists themselves- underestimated what the heck this represented. Namely: a combination of the actual, relatively mild Coronavirus illnesses and deaths, typical government overreach, the specifically totalitarian need to black out the news and prevent Bad Think complaining about the government's handling of things, and the Party's desire to keep the economy running at almost any cost, even if Wuhan died off.
So even those who were paying attention probably misread what had happened.
And most people at this time weren't paying attention, partially because of initial obscurity and primarily because of what i'm going to talk about next.
It acted in a suspicious manner intended to make us worry, sending travellers from Wuhan everywhere in the world except China.
You're giving a blinkered, sclerotic socialist dictatorship way too much credit.
They acted in a suspicious manner because they're a totalitarian, corrupt, and not terribly competent dictatorship that figured it's better to look suspicious and tyrannical than it is to look incompetent and impotent.
This is also why it persecutes people for "Rumor Mongering", as the Voltaire's Ghost and Laowhy videos showed.
As for why it kept sending travellers from Wuhan to everywhere except other places in the PRC, that it desiring to keep the gears of its foreign businesses going, because it knows a degree of economic success (such as it is) is both necessary to avoid revolution and build on sand. So they wanted to avoid having a large scale disruption of it by cutting Wuhan trade, but they wanted to prevent it from spreading to elsewhere in China too.
(Of course, the dumb bastards being who they are, they underestimated how much it had already spread within the PRC).
It banked on its lack of credibility by telling us all there was nothing to worry about
How stupid can you be?
Seriously, have you even ASKED YOURSELF how they would actually go about doing this? Did you compare this theory to what the CCP actually did?
No, of course not.
If you're a crook that wants to launder money, you give your dirty money through a legitimate- or at least supposedly legitimate- source.
(Sure, those who have worked with the WHO and Left Wing Pols know- or should know- that they aren't credible, but how many people knew that before this? Particularly with things like Tedros the Commie?)
All of which you flat out memory hole. Because it contradicts your pet theory.
In spite of it being easily confirmable, and making more SENSE for a totalitarian regime that is both obsessed with saving face to its own people and the world, and which has spent billions in propaganda trying to put the best face of "Socialism with Chinese Characteristics" to the world.
And now that we're all in a panic over nothing, they're advancing their interests in HK, India, Taiwan, the South Pacific, and elsewhere.
They've been doing that for Decades. Indeed, they wouldn't have been able to punt stuff like "Hug Chinese Day" in Italy if it weren't for how they've been advancing it.
Your theory only makes sense if the Wuhan flu were dangerous, which it isn't, or if there were some reason to believe the Wuhan flu were dangerous, which there never was to begin with.
More circular BS logic.
WuFlu not being Black Death dangerous doesn't mean it's not dangerous.
And even MORE important for the CCP, it not being very dangerous in terms of deaths doesn't mean it's NOT dangerous in terms of economic damage and social unrest.
Do you remember all those CPC videos of people collapsing because of the virus? Why would they make things up about the virus if it were dangerous? They could have just told the truth about the danger of the virus.
Translation: you're not understanding why the CCP lied, or how. So you're just assuming they lied that the virus was dangerous (again, in spite of the basic timeline contradicting it). That if those videos of seemingly well equipped medical doctors rushing people to the ER were fake, so must reports of the virus's damage. So the CCP must be lying about how dangerous it is.
The problem with this is twofold.
Firstly: this ignores how the CCP spent the first several months of this problem perpetually lying about and downplaying the dangers of the disease.
Secondly: you're wrong in assuming the propaganda videos were about showing how dangerous the virus is.
Because yeah, I remember the CPC videos of people collapsing.
So unfortunately you've overthought the basics of why the CCP lied. You thought this was part of some 5 Dimensional Chess game in which Xi and the Commies sought to simultaneously spook the rest of the world into economically devastating itself (which happened) while oddly also insisting everything was fine.
In reality it was mostly due to a universal drive for politicians. To look Good. To be seen as decisive leaders. To be seen as "Doing Something Good." And to say "Commie China Number 1!"
Building (so called) hospitals good.
Having well trained medical staff able to react toe vents good.
Sending massive funeral urn shipments NOT so good.
Welding people in to buildings Bad.
See the pattern? The CPC doesn't like stuff that makes it look bad, no matter how true that is. And if there's one thing the CCP has ALWAYS tried to say during this crisis, it's "Commie Party Good."
Occam's Razor.
Anon. This year's flu season would have occurred with or without China's theatrics in Wuhan.
Yes it would have.
No further biological danger or risk was added to the world.
You're assuming that Wuhan COVID isn't another threat, even a minor one, co-existing with normal Flu and other nasty stuff.
We're all just as likely to die of this year's flu as we have been for previous years.
I'd like to see the data for that. Especially if you're going to bitch to me about not having statistics or data.
The only added risk is from the pandemic of hysteria, which is the CPC's only weapon here (since the Wuhan flu is harmless).
See above.
You think the leaders of China are stupid because they advocate socialism for the Chinese masses?
Yes, Yes I do.
Because Socialism is not a system for the masses, it's a system for the Central Planners.
Why are you assuming that a bunch of people whose Top. People. couldn't handle a moderately infectious and not very lethal Bat Virus properly in a Specially Constructed Bio Lab have managed to beat the Socialist Calculation Problem and other problems?
That doesn't mean they're COMPLETE idiots, but they are institutionally shackled to a certain level of stupidity. To do otherwise would mean reform, and Xi and most others don't want that.
The leaks. From Communist China.
Which were crushed with typical communist Brutality. Because even totalitarian regimes have grape vines and underground dissident writing.
The entire panic about the Wuhan flu was leaked intentionally.
No, it wasn't. The leaks came from grassroots leaks from both inside China and especially its neighbors.
The "Entire Panic" leaked out only slowly via Chinese nationals and neighboring countries. Usually acting in the face of denial by useful idiots like WHO and persecution by the CCP.
Doctors have been dying under suspicious circumstances everywhere since the Wuhan flu began. Probably for noticing it's just a flu.
Fucking hilarious. The guy who insists the Wuhan flu is dangerous and harmful, but can't produce a single shred of evidence beyond "I'm a VoLuNtEeR, Ok??", now accuses me of trying to fit the facts to a pre-conceived theory.
I take back the "semi-literate."
Which is probably part of the reason why you refuse to look at what the CCP actually did during the time you were claiming it was trying to weaponize hysteria.
And because you're so wedded to the idea that a Flu isn't dangerous just because it hasn't killed you yet and it is less infective and murderous than the Black Death.
Which makes about as much sense as noting that shark attacks are rare and usually not lethal, so they're not dangerous and there is no point making shark repellent or weapons that can drive off a Great White.
The problem is that a lot of people- either those that don't understand how totalitarian socialists (dys)function or those that are totalitarian socialists themselves- underestimated what the heck this represented. Namely: a combination of the actual, relatively mild Coronavirus illnesses and deaths, typical government overreach, the specifically totalitarian need to black out the news and prevent Bad Think complaining about the government's handling of things, and the Party's desire to keep the economy running at almost any cost, even if Wuhan died off.
So even those who were paying attention probably misread what had happened.
And most people at this time weren't paying attention, partially because of initial obscurity and primarily because of what i'm going to talk about next.
Actually, anon, it's ever more apparent that you are the one who has not been paying attention.
China had no desire to keep the economy running. The who reason this is happening now is:
China subsidizes its industry's inputs, then makes the subsidies back with dumping and crushing int'l competition
Trump put tariffs on Chinese goods.
China must increase the subsidies to maintain the same price on the shelves. Many of the subsidies, notably oil, can only be bought with USD or other foreign currency reserves.
Phase 1 is fatal to China. The levels of tariffs, combined with the obligation to buy American, completely defeats China's "miraculous" growth. China has been hemorrhaging foreign cash, meanwhile hoping Mueller, then impeachment, would remove Trump from office before they run out.
Right after signing phase 1 with obvious reluctance, we get the Wuhan flu.
The economic collapse in China resulting from the Wuhan flu could not but have happened. If this year's flu season had not been weaponized with propaganda, China's economy would still have collapsed and they would still have had to turn away oil and natural gas and other freighters under force majeure.
You're giving a blinkered, sclerotic socialist dictatorship way too much credit.
Oh, you think the Chinese run China instead of just following instructions from their banker overlords. Good grief.
They acted in a suspicious manner because they're a totalitarian, corrupt, and not terribly competent dictatorship that figured it's better to look suspicious and tyrannical than it is to look incompetent and impotent.
Better? In what sense? Lol. "They were concerned about optics!" What idiocy.
Which is how you get things like this. Not from 21 million people with phones dying from COVID, but from a few people dying and even more talking, so the CCP figures it needs to shut them up.
This is also why it persecutes people for "Rumor Mongering", as the Voltaire's Ghost and Laowhy videos showed.
As for why it kept sending travellers from Wuhan to everywhere except other places in the PRC, that it desiring to keep the gears of its foreign businesses going, because it knows a degree of economic success (such as it is) is both necessary to avoid revolution and build on sand. So they wanted to avoid having a large scale disruption of it by cutting Wuhan trade, but they wanted to prevent it from spreading to elsewhere in China too.
(Of course, the dumb bastards being who they are, they underestimated how much it had already spread within the PRC).
All of this ignores the fact that China's economy was bound to fail right around the time the Wuhan flu arose. What luck for the Communist Party that random Chinese people suddenly started talking up this year's flu just in time, sparking a worldwide panic!
The panic was the goal from the outset.
In spite of it being easily confirmable, and making more SENSE for a totalitarian regime that is both obsessed with saving face to its own people and the world
They're not obsessed with saving face for their own people. They 100% control the narrative in that country. The Chinese people are just cattle to them. So long as they're punching their clocks and not revolting, the CCP doesn't give a shit what the Chinese people think of them.
and which has spent billions in propaganda trying to put the best face of "Socialism with Chinese Characteristics" to the world
The billions in propaganda were spent in anticipation of a compliant US president like Hillary being in office at exactly the right moment (now).
Now that that plan has been foiled, they're going straight for their goals without any pretence. All of 'em, all at once! Under cover of a fake panic they created.
They've been doing that for Decades. Indeed, they wouldn't have been able to punt stuff like "Hug Chinese Day" in Italy if it weren't for how they've been advancing it.
What the fuck, you pretend you read the news, but you're unaware that China is moving at 10x speed in China, the Himalayas, and the South Pacific right now?
More circular BS logic.
WuFlu not being Black Death dangerous doesn't mean it's not dangerous.
And even MORE important for the CCP, it not being very dangerous in terms of deaths doesn't mean it's NOT dangerous in terms of economic damage and social unrest.
Explain Japan's numbers.
USA total pop: 328 million
COVID-19 deaths: 100,000 [lockdown]
Japan total pop: 126 million [condensed (island)]
COVID-19 deaths: 850 [no lockdown]
The wuhan flu isn't dangerous. It's just another flu season.
Translation: you're not understanding why the CCP lied, or how. So you're just assuming they lied that the virus was dangerous (again, in spite of the basic timeline contradicting it).
This retardation again. It's not dangerous because nowhere in the world has it presented as dangerous. If it had, places like the US wouldn't have to count gunshot wounds as Wuhan flu deaths.
See Japan's numbers again. Then marvel at your own idiocy: you fell for Chinese propaganda, it's just this year's flu season.
And I also-also know how Chinese whistleblowers have been talking about how the Party has been sending funeral urns and incinerators into the city on the down low.
There were no more funeral urns than normal. Why would there be? The wuhan flu isn't dangerous, it's just a flu season.
So unfortunately you've overthought the basics of why the CCP lied. You thought this was part of some 5 Dimensional Chess game in which Xi and the Commies sought to simultaneously spook the rest of the world into economically devastating itself (which happened) while oddly also insisting everything was fine.
It is actually you who still hasn't thought it through. Let's walk through it. If you respond to one thing, make it this.
China notices this year's flu season starting in China.
For some reason, Chinese doctors report on social media that this year's flu season is more dangerous than other flu seasons. Why would they do this though? There is no evidence to suggest the Wuhan flu is any more dangerous than any other flu season? Why did these whistleblowers even exist?
China censors these whistleblowers, because they don't want a panic over this year's flu season.
Then China builds a fake hospital, locks down Wuhan, and kneecaps their economy. Why would they do this right after censoring whistleblowers for causing a panic? It is sure to cause a panic, which it did.
Then ultimately, based on data from all over the world, it turns out there was never any reason to panic because it's just this year's flu season. So then why were there whistleblowers at all? Why did China build a fake hospital? Why did they kneecap their economy at this critical juncture?
If you just think for a minute, you'd recognize that everything China did was intended to cause the panic we're seeing now.
Your idea that they publicly overreacted to a harmless virus in an attempt to avoid a worldwide panic when the worldwide panic serves their interest makes no fucking sense.
In reality it was mostly due to a universal drive for politicians. To look Good. To be seen as decisive leaders. To be seen as "Doing Something Good." And to say "Commie China Number 1!"
Yeah, they really had to get their numbers up for the next election. KEK!!!!!!
See the pattern? The CPC doesn't like stuff that makes it look bad, no matter how true that is. And if there's one thing the CCP has ALWAYS tried to say during this crisis, it's "Commie Party Good."
But there was nothing to make them look bad in the first place, since it's just a flu. So why would they even react at all?
Fucking nonsense.
You're assuming that Wuhan COVID isn't another threat, even a minor one, co-existing with normal Flu and other nasty stuff.
No, I'm not assuming. If there were concurrent biological threats, we'd see additional deaths. We're not. Ergo, it's just this year's flu season.
I'd like to see the data for that. Especially if you're going to bitch to me about not having statistics or data.
Wonder why they'd have to massage the numbers if there was an elevated risk of death from the Wuhan flu like all the Chinese propaganda you fell for says?
Yes, Yes I do [think China's leadership is dumb]
Because Socialism is not a system for the masses, it's a system for the Central Planners.
Yeah, so those leaders (i.e., central planners) are pretty smart to have attained a system that works so well for them.
Not dumb.
And while even the Chinese Communists weren't capable of completely ignoring how their own system sucks and diluted bits of it, they're still wedded to its core aspects. Which means pervasive lying that Obama could only dream of.
Yeah, like lying a regular flu season into a global pandemic.
Why are you assuming that a bunch of people whose Top. People. couldn't handle a moderately infectious and not very lethal Bat Virus properly in a Specially Constructed Bio Lab
Lol, there's no bat virus. It's just this year's flu season. Good grief, do you just want to believe Chinese propaganda? Why are you so gullible?
have managed to beat the Socialist Calculation Problem and other problems?
I haven't assumed such because they haven't managed to beat this problem. The solution was trillion dollar trade deficits with the Western world. Which solution is totally fucked by tariffs. Which is why we now have Chinese propaganda inciting a worldwide panic over this year's flu season.
That doesn't mean they're COMPLETE idiots, but they are institutionally shackled to a certain level of stupidity. To do otherwise would mean reform, and Xi and most others don't want that.
The CCP brass are not stupid, at all. Underestimate them (and their bankist masters) at your peril.
Which were crushed with typical communist Brutality. Because even totalitarian regimes have grape vines and underground dissident writing.
But why were there leaks from China about this year's flu season at all? What occasion would the leakers have to leak anything? Flu seasons happen every year.
No, it wasn't. The leaks came from grassroots leaks from both inside China and especially its neighbors.
The "Entire Panic" leaked out only slowly via Chinese nationals and neighboring countries. Usually acting in the face of denial by useful idiots like WHO and persecution by the CCP.
Yeah, those grassroots leakers spread the word about this year's flu season. Thank goodness for them, or else we wouldn't have known it was coming! Ha ha ha!!
Well, this one was murdered AFTER the Wuhan Flu began, after being ritually humiliated and imprisoned for trying to spread warning that containment breach was a thing.
Part 2 > The controversial opinion that you seem to hold is that China is any good at it. They're not. Far better parties than them, such as the Russians and the US and the Jesuits, have tried to create a deadly contagious virus. They have all failed.
Which is one reason why we stopped doing it as often. Because we got bored of it and had more than enough deadly bioweapons we couldn't really use but which could have disastrous consequences if we F--ked up with production or containment, as the Soviets at Aralsk-7 Showed.
We still RESEARCH them and produce them, but in much smaller quantities.
The problem is that you seem to think- or act- as if all Virological research is Bioweapons Research. Which is about as ignorant as assuming that all research in construction engineering is to go into build better fortifications.
So, evidently, has China. But they would have already known that,
Wu Flu just wasn't one of them. In the same way that having cultures of the Black Death in secured bioweapons vaults doesn't mean someone is going to try and weaponize the Common Cold. But they ARE probably going to study it, various normal Flus, and the like.
there's no way anyone would have mistaken the Wuhan flu for a dangerous virus. Which is why the plan from the beginning was to spread hysteria. Which they've done nicely.
The logical incoherence behind this is ludicrous.
WuFlu is a Dangerous virus, but not a Highly Dangerous or even moderately dangerous one like Virus. And certainly nowhere near what one would want in a Bioweapon.
Nobody should mistake ChiCom Flu for a Bioweapon, it is nowhere near effective or lethal enough. But there's plenty of reasons to research a virus other than "LET'S WMD IT!" In the same reason there's plenty of reason to research Nuclears without "LET'S MAKE A BIGGER TSAR BOMBA!"
And the Chicom plan wasn't to "spread hysteria from the beginning." Again, their actions show this was to the contrary.
The ChiComs were almost certainly trying to research a more or less mundane case of COVID in Bats and how it might jump to humans (probably in order to find ways to inhibit it or- waaay down the road- weaponize it), but their incompetence meant that they couldn't study it safely. Local party officials tried to muzzle reports of problems at the Lab. So a bunch of staff at the lab got sick, and ultimately the Virus broke containment.
When the CCP at large realized the scope of the problem, they lied through their teeth and claimed everything was alright, intentionally shouting over more honest reports like those by Taiwan that while this wasn't a world-ending problem, it was a problem (and the quicker you jump on a problem, the quicker and easier it is to Solve said problem, as Taiwan's smackdown of WuFlu shows).
Again, THIS IS WHY TRUMP CONDEMNED THE CCP AND WHO (but I repeat myself) FOR LYING ABOUT THE THREAT. At a time when SOME degree of controlled panic was healthy in order to try and make proper preparations to isolate this thing, the CCP sabotaged it.
Which helped enable a bunch of Leftist Control Freaks abroad to shout that the World was Ending unless the Free World surrendered its Freedom to Mask-Stasi.
You haven't provided any evidence to support your claims. I have provided plenty of evidence to puncture them, starting with how the basic timeline doesn't work.
So where are all the moderately debilitated Wuhan flu patients? Where are the elevated rates of death?
Simple, dumbarse.
As for the "moderately debilitated Wuhan flu patients", ask around and you might be able to find them. Starting with hospital records, though those are extreme lowball figures since most people with WuFlu didn't go to the Hospital because it wasn't serious or they didn't know it.
Then look through the number of people who have been tested for Antibodies and rung up positive, indicating they found it.
Obviously, this isn't all the data you'd need (though I note it's still far more than you've EVER provided at any point in this exchange), but it's the right KIND of data you'd need to look for.
And after gathering it all, you'd add up th BS inflated Coronavirus deaths for 2020+ the BS deflated other-causes deaths for it and get Sum 1.
Then you'd add together the Death Tolls for the "Normal" Causes from another year and get Sum 2 (and then for another year and get Sum 3, and so on).
Then you see if Sum 1 is Greater Than, Equal To, or Less Than the death toll Sum 2, Sum 3/Sum Insert Number here.
And you'd have a PALLPARK guesstimate about the death rate of the 2020 Spring Sickness Season (and COVID) compared to others. Average that out and you get it.
Will you refer me back to your experience as a volunteer again, instead of referring to statistics and data?
Oh this is Rich.
But to answer your question: the above text spam shows that No, no I didn't "instead of."
But secondly: it's rich you of all people are trying to claim that, considering you haven't even provided a single bit of evidence, statistics, or data for anybody to believe you, not even a surface level statement that "I Iz expert in Mechanical Surgery".
And many of your claims- such as that the CCP intended to use WuFlu as a weapon of mass hysteria against the West from the get go- are easily contradicted by the arcane art of looking at the goddamn timeline. And seeing how far from trying to spread Panic abroad, the CCP spent months TRYING TO PREVENT other nations from panicking and taking precautions like Trump's stopping of flights.
Here, I will highlight the most important word in the above statement:
And unsurprisingly, you fail at this just as comprehensively as you fail at "reading a timeline."
The most important word in the above statement isn't "Can" (and frankly I mis-wrote, considering the proper phrase should be "DOES." As in, it Does kill thousands every single year.)
The most important word in the above statement isn't "Can."
It's "Understand."
If there's one thing you have shown thus far, it's that you don't understand much in the way of anything, ranging from Bioweapons research (which is apparently the kind of virology anyone does according to you?) to average influenza deaths, to what is dangerous.
Fuck off with these shitty projections. Let us discuss actual data, in which nothing you are saying above has come true.
Shitty projector accuses other people of shitty projections, film at eleven.
Again, this is ironic.
At no point in this discussion have you cited "actual data." The only links about it are coming from me.
And not only has much that I have said come true, plenty of it came true MONTHS ago.
Something that thoroughly guts your beloved theory that the CCP intended to use this virus as a weapon of mass panic from the start by showing that the CCP was trying to prevent panic at the time, even reasonable levels of preparation.
And which you have At No Point Whatsoever addressed. Probably because you can't.
Neither the facts nor the law of the case are on your side, so you've apparently decided to pound the table, complaining about me simplifying or summarizing data while not providing any of your own.
Well, that's no longer going to fly.
Stop wasting my time.
None of this answered my question, which was "why do you trust faked US data over faked Chinese data"?
Then you simply don't know how to read. And you certainly don't know jack about Socialism.
Faked US and other Western Coronavirus figures are mostly faked by mislabeling deaths from other viruses (or even entire causes altogether) as WuFlu, in no small part because it's kind of hard even in Kaiser Wilhelm's New York City to completely conceal the number of people dying. So they have to stick closer to the numbers.
The CCP, on the other hand, are totalitarian socialists. So they not only can do everything the people faking the numbers over here can do, they can invent numbers out of whole cloth and quash anybody trying to gainsay their obviously bogus numbers.
Do I really have to explain to you how the latter "process" will almost invariably churn out numbers less related to reality than the former?
Apparently so.
They're both fake.
A sleazy millionaire (like say Mr. and Mrs. Sanders) mis-filing his tax returns will give a fake figure.
So will a member of the "Nigerian Royalty" promising you millions of dollars in exchange for a down payment.
Does that mean that both figures are equally fake?
That's basically your logic.
This is a normal flu season.
More or less agreed.
Unless the Wuhan flu has somehow cured the flu and replaced it with a virus which, for all intents and purposes, is the flu. But I'm going to go with Occam on that one.
Except even the hard core Dem liars aren't completely claiming that, only "largely." Hence why they haven't completely abolished normal flu deaths even as they've stolen lots from it.
You're getting hyperemotional, which is how you've concluded I'm a PRC shill. Fucking kek.
Again, coming from someone who can't dispute basic DATES that contradict his pet theory and engages in CCP shill style whataboutism of "They're both fake! So why should we trust the corrupt but at least somewhat realistic numbers compared to those that obviously aren't counting anything but what comes out of XI's cloaca?"
If your claims are so poor and deny similar things to what CCP shills deny (like Taiwan shouting there was a problem and being ignored), do you deserve more respect?
No, we've created plenty of deadly contagious viruses. The "Bio-Chernobyl" the Soviets caused was on the Aral Sea and involved supersouped up Anthrax (technically a bacteria rather than a virus, but involving similar scientific and production demands).
Easily treated. Which is why they gave up on it and buried it.
So which deadly contagious virus did we create?
Which is one reason why we stopped doing it as often. Because we got bored of it and had more than enough deadly bioweapons we couldn't really use but which could have disastrous consequences if we F--ked up with production or containment, as the Soviets at Aralsk-7 Showed.
Every time the supposedly deadly Soviet bioweapons leaked, the consequences were not disastrous. The weapons don't work, is the reason why.
The problem is that you seem to think- or act- as if all Virological research is Bioweapons Research. Which is about as ignorant as assuming that all research in construction engineering is to go into build better fortifications.
I don't really care one way or the other. Better parties than the CCP have tried and failed universally. The idea that the CCP could do it where others couldn't is ridiculous. Whether this year's flu season is man-made or not is irrelevant.
I don't really see how a man-made flu could both kill the same number of people as the flu, and also stop the regular flu from killing as many people as it usually does though.
Uh, no, no we don't.
We've got plenty of reason to know that the ChiComs have deadly engineered viruses.
You kind of trailed off there.
WuFlu is a Dangerous virus, but not a Highly Dangerous or even moderately dangerous one like Virus. And certainly nowhere near what one would want in a Bioweapon.
I agree. It's no more dangerous than the flu. Which is why the only weapon here is the hysteria.
And the Chicom plan wasn't to "spread hysteria from the beginning." Again, their actions show this was to the contrary.
They staged a fake deadly outbreak, downplayed it to seed supposed carriers around the world, and are now ramping the hysteria up to 11.
If they had diligently locked down Wuhan, there would be nothing for us to overreact to.
The ChiComs were almost certainly trying to research a more or less mundane case of COVID in Bats and how it might jump to humans (probably in order to find ways to inhibit it or- waaay down the road- weaponize it), but their incompetence meant that they couldn't study it safely. Local party officials tried to muzzle reports of problems at the Lab. So a bunch of staff at the lab got sick, and ultimately the Virus broke containment.
You mean to tell me you think this was an accident that occurred at exactly the time the CCP needed it?
What luck!
When the CCP at large realized the scope of the problem, they lied through their teeth and claimed everything was alright, intentionally shouting over more honest reports like those by Taiwan that while this wasn't a world-ending problem, it was a problem (and the quicker you jump on a problem, the quicker and easier it is to Solve said problem, as Taiwan's smackdown of WuFlu shows).
Scope of what problem. You are assuming once again that the virus must be hitting someone hard. But it isn't hitting anyone hard, including China. It's just a flu.
Again, THIS IS WHY TRUMP CONDEMNED THE CCP AND WHO (but I repeat myself) FOR LYING ABOUT THE THREAT. At a time when SOME degree of controlled panic was healthy in order to try and make proper preparations to isolate this thing, the CCP sabotaged it.
If they hadn't sabotaged it, supposed carriers wouldn't have spread around the world and we would have nothing to overreact to.
Why would we overreact like China wants if they didn't seed supposed carriers everywhere?
Which helped enable a bunch of Leftist Control Freaks abroad to shout that the World was Ending unless the Free World surrendered its Freedom to Mask-Stasi.
This was the end goal from the outset.
As for the "moderately debilitated Wuhan flu patients", ask around and you might be able to find them. Starting with hospital records, though those are extreme lowball figures since most people with WuFlu didn't go to the Hospital because it wasn't serious or they didn't know it.
Then look through the number of people who have been tested for Antibodies and rung up positive, indicating they found it.
As for evidence of an elevated death toll...
Take the "Official", Artificially inflated numbers of COVID deaths
Prune as much obvious BS as you can off of it, such as the number of people marked "Dead of COVID" after being shot or in a car crash.
Then start adding up the "Official", almost-certianly-artificially-deflated numbers of deaths from causes other than COVID.
Like Flu.
And Pneumonia
(Those are just to get you started. There are more.)
Then compare them to previous, pre-ChiCom Flu mortality seasons from the
Like this for the 2017-2018 Flu Season
Obviously, this isn't all the data you'd need (though I note it's still far more than you've EVER provided at any point in this exchange), but it's the right KIND of data you'd need to look for.
And after gathering it all, you'd add up th BS inflated Coronavirus deaths for 2020+ the BS deflated other-causes deaths for it and get Sum 1.
Then you'd add together the Death Tolls for the "Normal" Causes from another year and get Sum 2 (and then for another year and get Sum 3, and so on).
Then you see if Sum 1 is Greater Than, Equal To, or Less Than the death toll Sum 2, Sum 3/Sum Insert Number here.
And you'd have a PALLPARK guesstimate about the death rate of the 2020 Spring Sickness Season (and COVID) compared to others. Average that out and you get it.
I've done this. This year's flu season looks marginally worse than the average over the last 10 years. But that's because they're counting gunshot wounds as flu deaths, which they've never done before.
Nowhere on earth does this year's flu season look like an outlier of any kind. And even if it did, you would be unable to conclude that China did any actual thing to harm us (beyond spreading a pandemic of hysteria), since we aren't seeing Wuhan flu deaths ON TOP OF regular flu deaths, we are seeing regular flu deaths ATTRIBUTED TO Wuhan flu.
Oh this is Rich.
But to answer your question: the above text spam shows that No, no I didn't "instead of."
I'm sorry, did you mistake your call for me to review the evidence, quoted in full above, as evidence?
But secondly: it's rich you of all people are trying to claim that, considering you haven't even provided a single bit of evidence, statistics, or data for anybody to believe you, not even a surface level statement that "I Iz expert in Mechanical Surgery".
At no point in this discussion have you cited "actual data." The only links about it are coming from me.
The statistics and data do not support the idea that the Wuhan flu is any more dangerous than any other normal past flu season. What, I'm supposed to prove a negative?
And many of your claims- such as that the CCP intended to use WuFlu as a weapon of mass hysteria against the West from the get go- are easily contradicted by the arcane art of looking at the goddamn timeline. And seeing how far from trying to spread Panic abroad, the CCP spent months TRYING TO PREVENT other nations from panicking and taking precautions like Trump's stopping of flights.
If China's government had diligently locked down Wuhan, what would we have to overreact to?
You keep ignoring this question. China had to do as they did to get the supposed carriers spread across the globe. If they hadn't spread, we would have nothing to overreact to, since there would be no supposed carriers in our countries.
If you were trying to cause a global panic, you would take all of the steps China did, in the order they did. Your seeming inability to think strategically or see beyond a single move is on full display here.
And unsurprisingly, you fail at this just as comprehensively as you fail at "reading a timeline."
The most important word in the above statement isn't "Can" (and frankly I mis-wrote, considering the proper phrase should be "DOES." As in, it Does kill thousands every single year.)
The most important word in the above statement isn't "Can."
It's "Understand."
If there's one thing you have shown thus far, it's that you don't understand much in the way of anything, ranging from Bioweapons research (which is apparently the kind of virology anyone does according to you?) to average influenza deaths, to what is dangerous.
No, the most important word was "can," since the thing you said "can" happen hasn't happened, anywhere on earth. That would imply that it actually "can't" happen.
Shitty projector accuses other people of shitty projections, film at eleven.
Which shitty projection have I made? You said something "can" happen when it apparently can't. By contrast, I've done no such thing.
And not only has much that I have said come true, plenty of it came true MONTHS ago.
Because one of the most clearcut and unambiguous bits of "actual data" in today's wired up recording world is a Date. Which is why it's incredibly easy to verify things like WHO acting as a propaganda arm of the ChiComs and saying "China has not found any evidence of human to human transmission" back in January.
Something that thoroughly guts your beloved theory that the CCP intended to use this virus as a weapon of mass panic from the start by showing that the CCP was trying to prevent panic at the time, even reasonable levels of preparation.
And which you have At No Point Whatsoever addressed. Probably because you can't.
Neither the facts nor the law of the case are on your side, so you've apparently decided to pound the table, complaining about me simplifying or summarizing data while not providing any of your own.
I've addressed it, you illiterate faggot. If China had diligently locked down Wuhan, what would we all be overreacting to? The supposed carriers would all be locked down in Wuhan, and wouldn't have spread across the globe.
Thankfully, they weren't carrying anything that we need to be concerned with. But their presence has enabled all this hysteria.
If they weren't here, we wouldn't be overreacting to them. Why would we?
Then you simply don't know how to read. And you certainly don't know jack about Socialism.
Faked US and other Western Coronavirus figures are mostly faked by mislabeling deaths from other viruses (or even entire causes altogether) as WuFlu, in no small part because it's kind of hard even in Kaiser Wilhelm's New York City to completely conceal the number of people dying. So they have to stick closer to the numbers.
The CCP, on the other hand, are totalitarian socialists. So they not only can do everything the people faking the numbers over here can do, they can invent numbers out of whole cloth and quash anybody trying to gainsay their obviously bogus numbers.
And indeed, they kind of HAVE to because Socialism is such a failure they can't reliably get even passable estimates, so they largely BS them and then try to make policy based on them.
Simply put: The fraudsters in the West are mostly MIScounting actual deaths and lying about people investigating them like citizen journalists.
The fraudsters in the CCP don't have to count at all, and can simply adjust them with a wave of a magic wand and can shoot or imprison anybody they catch contradicting them.
Do I really have to explain to you how the latter "process" will almost invariably churn out numbers less related to reality than the former?
Apparently so.
Both are fake. Neither is trustworthy. Nowhere on earth is the Wuhan flu presenting as more dangerous than the regular flu.
A sleazy millionaire (like say Mr. and Mrs. Sanders) mis-filing his tax returns will give a fake figure.
So will a member of the "Nigerian Royalty" promising you millions of dollars in exchange for a down payment.
Does that mean that both figures are equally fake?
That's basically your logic.
No, my logic is that nowhere on earth has experienced the Wuhan flu as anything other than a regular old flu season, and therefore, China experienced nothing other than a regular old flu season.
Why would China be the only place hit hard?
Except even the hard core Dem liars aren't completely claiming that, only "largely." Hence why they haven't completely abolished normal flu deaths even as they've stolen lots from it.
If they'd completely abolished flu deaths, it would be even less believable than it is now.
Again, coming from someone who can't dispute basic DATES that contradict his pet theory and engages in CCP shill style whataboutism of "They're both fake! So why should we trust the corrupt but at least somewhat realistic numbers compared to those that obviously aren't counting anything but what comes out of XI's cloaca?"
I don't need to dispute the dates. Your timeline is a list of actions that China would have to have taken to spread this pandemic of hysteria. After all, if they had diligently locked down Wuhan, we would all have nothing to overreact to, as the supposed carriers of the virus would not be here amongst us, but back in Wuhan.
If they'd done that, there would be no basis for us to panic. And since panic was the goal from the outset, doing as you suggest would have been self-defeating.
How would diligently locking down Wuhan have resulted in worldwide panic? And since the Wuhan flu is harmless, how could China have started this thing with any goal other than causing a panic?
If your claims are so poor and deny similar things to what CCP shills deny (like Taiwan shouting there was a problem and being ignored), do you deserve more respect?
Taiwan was wrong though. There is no problem. It's the flu.
Ironically, China's planted advice that there was nothing to worry about was actually correct.
I get tired of intellectually dishonest runarounds, and that is what you are doing.
Since the Wuhan flu isn't dangerous, we are left to conclude that the only danger that spread from Wuhan is government overreaction.
Circular "Logic" that fails to prove its necessary assumption: that Wuhan Flu isn't dangerous.
It is. It's just not ultra-dangerous and has a high infectivity, low mortality profile like the Flu. And I hate to tell you this, the Flu's dangerous. Primarily to those in certain at risk demographics (like the old, the young, people with breathing problems, and so forth). But you do have a fair few healthy-as-a-bull people keel over and die of it every year.
That's dangerous, but it's not existential. Take reasonable precautions (which are usually less intrusive than the Masked Mooks demand) and soldier on so that even when people die, most people and the society survive more or less unhindered.
That's the problem. You're acting as if ChiCom Flu is not merely no more dangerous than the Flu (which is correct, and if anything even less dangerous with proper treatment since as the Hydro-Zinc Cocktail), but far far less.
If you're trying to spread overreaction, would you try to stop the spread of the virus in earnest?
"That which is presented without evidence can be dismissed without evidence."
You have provided absolutely zero evidence that the initial response of the CCP was to SPREAD overreaction. Indeed, the evidence I have presented shows that their initial reaction was to do the exact INVERSE of spreading overreaction to different countries: it was to impose UNDER-REACTION on Wuhan by dint of locking up whistle-blowers cutting news, and generally acting as if everything was "Fine." Initially this was just the local party bosses trying to avoid "rumors" (protip: tyrannical assholes hate "rumors") and avoid being blamed.
But when the infection at Wuhan blew up too hard for them to keep a lid on, the PRC decided not to spread overreaction, but to spread the disease. And one of the ways they did this was about LYING about how the disease spread and how prolific it was.
So they spent the crucial breakout period of the disease doing the exact Inverse of spreading Overreaction. First domestically due to the CYA/Saving Face mentality of the Communist Party and the local authorities' concern they might get scapegoated for what happened (as they were), and Secondly internationally as the ChiComs and their fellow shills lied about the gravity of the disease and shut down the based, knowledgeable people trying to warn so this virus could be gotten in hand such as Taiwan.
And no, it's not a coincidence that Taiwan was one of those screaming about the threat of this thing the loudest while its death and infection rates are so low and its
"lockdown" measures are so lax. Because An Ounce of Prevention is worth a Pound of Cure. And being proactive and GETTING ON a disease's trace means you can limit how far it spreads and how much damage it does.
The CCP lying and trying to spread UNDERreaction helped this virus cause the damage it did, both in terms of those directly affected and in the retarded-psychopath overreach by governmental goons claiming "We will totally relinquish these emergency powers."
Trying to spread OVERreaction- like the CCP and co are doing now- was late in the game, now that the virus has spread about as far and as deep as it's going to this season, herd immunity's building up, and the West and ChiComChina's other rivals are starting to reopen.
Flu and pneumonia deaths are down this year as Wuhan flu deaths are up. Nothing more dangerous than normal has been released.
Agreed.
So we can agree that WuFlu IS dangerous, just a mundane kind of dangerous like what a functional society deals with every single day.
Except for mass hysteria, of course. That has spread from its epicentre in Wuhan very nicely.
Again, no it wasn't. You're trying to marry your pet theory without providing evidence.
Mass hysteria didn't spread out from an epicenter in Wuhan. Mass hysteria spread out from almost every OTHER Place from a combination of sane and reasonable warnings (like those by Taiwan) being blown out of proportion, and unscrupulous BS from power grabby scum like Fauxci and the Imperial College Scammer.
The CCP was a late convert to spreading the gospel of mass hysteria, in part because they were worried about it rebounding into their face as people asked "Where did this come from?" (and for instance having punitive action like what Trump is proposing levied on them) or Chinese people saying "What did you do about this?!?", and in part because other left wing tyrants elsewhere beat them to it. The CCP's spreading it NOW because it has no real benefit pretending that nothing happened, but there is benefit in keeping other countries shut down as long as it can and helping their petty tyrants usurp as much power as they can.
Put it simply:
Commie Party at the start: "What are you talking about, a leak? YOU ARE A DOUBLE PLUS BAD WRONGTHINKER. Apologize to the party for daring to say there's a threat! Oh, and by the way enjoy being thrown in a dank cell with COVID...."
Commie Party Stage 2: "EVERYTHING IS FINE! Do not think. Consume. China is cleanest race. Ignore subhuman mongrels like Taiwan. No evidence of human to human transmissability! There's no NEED To stop flights!"
Commie Party Stage 3: "In the DARKEST OF DAYS as the decadent West allowed the Black Death to spread and destroy its society, the Heroic Peoples' Party arose to quell rumor mongering and bring effective treatment, thus showing the Communist Party is ordained by Marx-Heaven to rule foreigner. So while China can tentatively reopen, the barbaric savages abroad would be insane to, since they are totally more afflicted than we are! Praise Chairman Xi, Helm man of destiny!"
This is why I chew you out for not timelining this.
So more people are going to die of pnuemonia and other Wuhan flu related complications this year than normal?
I don't know. If I had to wager a guess I would say "probably, marginally", most likely because even the most dishonest and thoroughly corrupt Western globalist medical hack in the West isn't claiming that Literally NOBODY has died of plain old Flu this season even as they shamelessly stripe mine most of those deaths to relabel as Coronavirus. Meaning that they still acknowledge Flu deaths are a separate thing, even if they have "mysteriously" decreased due to mislabeling them as WuFlu deaths (or WuFlu "Stealing" those deaths naturally).
So you PROBABLY have a small increase in ChiCom COVID deaths put on top of the bog standard "Flu Season + Other deaths."
If not, where is the "harm"? Except, of course, in the mass hysteria.
Simple.
If my theory is correct and there is indeed a slight increase in overall deaths from WuFlu mingling with other deaths, then the provable harm is from the excess.
And if my theory ISN'T correct, the harm is the background statistical noise of more or less routine death. Still harm, but "within normal parameters."
Neither of which are as damaging as the mass hysteria or Swamp State usurpation we've seen gutting our economy and civic culture that were Also spurred by this thing (But of course, by your logic we could point to Swampy corruption and tyranny and economic sabotage going well before even Wuhan had Wuhan Flu and say "Well, what's the harm? It was already happening" while ignoring the intensification of it). But still worth noting.
Oh, so you have access to more accurate statistics than I do? Could you post them?
No, I don't have access to more accurate statistics than you do, though I do know how to find what statistics we have acess to more easily.
The difference is I can interpret them better.
Because I both have some minimal medical experience, and because I'm not a credulous idiot.
Which is why you're caught screaming about "Why are China's death numbers so hard to believe?" and "These faked numbers are more accurate than those faked numbers? On what basis?"
Because apparently you've never read 1984 or understand how pervasive Commie book cooking is, much less how either side arrived at their numbers.
The wrong numbers of COVID deaths and infections in the US, UK, and other nations are based off of normal recording- along with "normal" mistakes like miscounting, double counting, or massaging the numbers to get them low- that are then skewed after the fact using number games, such as slapping normal Flu deaths as WuFlu deaths.
But the wrong numbers for COVID deaths and infections from the CCP have the "added bonus" of coming from a totalitarian dictatorship that is not shy about COMPLETELY INVENTING numbers from whole cloth and is not about to provide any evidence or external review whatsoever. And who are willing to do stuff like vanish people into literal incinerators in the same way that they lie about the US having the largest per capita prison population by pretending that Commie Party Laogai and secretive Blacksites don't exist.
That's the basis for why the West's faked numbers are more accurate than ChiCom faked numbers. As you'd know if you thought about it for five seconds.
There's a reason appeal to authority is a logical fallacy.
Secondly: You're confusing the Argument from Authority fallacy with assessing information gotten by and presented by "So-Called" Experts. Which one can then analyze.
For instance, this is why I am so confident dismissing the CCP numbers, which have a much, much higher probability of simply being invented from whole cloth than our own, in spite of both being wrong.
Put it simply: there's a qualitative difference between saying a Turkey is a Duck, and saying a Turkey is a Black Hole. Both are wrong, but the former is less wrong than the latter. And the latter indicates that someone isn't even looking at or knowledgeable of the actual information.
So? China is researching bioweapons, this isn't controversial.
Except the Wuhan COVID research was almost certainly not Bioweapons research.
Firstly because it was the study of a naturally occurring disease, secondly because even in its current form its lethality is so low (and the CCP showed so little ability to control it, hence the staff infections Laowhy's video covered), and thirdly because Most Bio Research isn't Bioweapons Research.
For the same reason your average GMO isn't trying to create the next biological nuke. That stuff has other utilities than trying to come up with yet another rare white elephant doomsday weapon that is a niche at best.
Circular "Logic" that fails to prove its necessary assumption: that Wuhan Flu isn't dangerous.
That plus the stats. Don't forget the stats!
It is [the wuhan flu is dangerous]
Then where are the statistics proving this?
It's just not ultra-dangerous and has a high infectivity, low mortality profile like the Flu.
It also reduced deaths caused by the flu! Amazing!
And I hate to tell you this, the Flu's dangerous. Primarily to those in certain at risk demographics (like the old, the young, people with breathing problems, and so forth). But you do have a fair few healthy-as-a-bull people keel over and die of it every year.
But the flu isn't a danger that we can do anything about. China hasn't added any actual danger to living this year, since we've always had flu seasons, and they've always killed as many people as this year's flu season is killing.
Disagree? Feel free to point out the statistics showing this year's flu season (including the Wuhan flu) is meaningfully worse than other years.
That's the problem. You're acting as if ChiCom Flu is not merely no more dangerous than the Flu (which is correct, and if anything even less dangerous with proper treatment since as the Hydro-Zinc Cocktail), but far far less.
My claim is that it is the flu. How could the flu be less dangerous than the flu?
"That which is presented without evidence can be dismissed without evidence."
You have provided absolutely zero evidence that the initial response of the CCP was to SPREAD overreaction. Indeed, the evidence I have presented shows that their initial reaction was to do the exact INVERSE of spreading overreaction to different countries: it was to impose UNDER-REACTION on Wuhan by dint of locking up whistle-blowers cutting news, and generally acting as if everything was "Fine." Initially this was just the local party bosses trying to avoid "rumors" (protip: tyrannical assholes hate "rumors") and avoid being blamed.
My basis for concluding such is the fact that the Wuhan flu is harmless, and could never have been mistaken for something harmless.
What kind of master plan is it to spread around a harmless virus?
Far better and more effective to spread hysteria. Which is exactly what they've done. And there's your evidence.
Do you have any evidence at all that anyone, anywhere, had any reasonable basis at any time to think the Wuhan flu was dangerous?
But when the infection at Wuhan blew up too hard for them to keep a lid on, the PRC decided not to spread overreaction, but to spread the disease. And one of the ways they did this was about LYING about how the disease spread and how prolific it was.
But it didn't blow up in China. We can infer this from the fact that it hasn't blown up anywhere else. At all.
If you disagree, please point out the place where Wuhan flu deaths significatly outpaced normal flu deaths. Then we can use that data to interpolate China's deaths. All the data for every affected country indicates this is just another normal (maybe slightly worse, but we can't even conclude that because of gunshot wounds being counted as Wuhan flu deaths) flu season.
And that's Literally. As in the Commie Ethiopian shill at the head of WHO lying through his teeth claiming there was no evidence of human to human transmission even though by this point the CCP must have known.
And the Communist propagandists continued to parrot this "Nothing to see Here, everything is in Order" while smearing or downplaying reports from nations that aren't Totalitarian Shitholes in order to sabotage other nations and give their state-sponsored looters the time to hoard our goods.
So they spent the crucial breakout period of the disease doing the exact Inverse of spreading Overreaction.
If China immediately told everyone "this virus is dangerous, we should stop all travel and try to prevent its spread", then countries would have stopped travel from China and there would be no reason to fear the virus having spread from China.
Unless they initially played "dumb" and allowed international travel, there would be no basis upon which to spread hysteria. And if there were no hysteria, China wouldn't have cover of hysteria to make the moves it's making in HK and India and the South China, etc.
And, of course, we must keep in mind the overarching fact: the Wuhan flu is harmless, just like every flu season.
And no, it's not a coincidence that Taiwan was one of those screaming about the threat of this thing the loudest while its death and infection rates are so low and its "lockdown" measures are so lax. Because An Ounce of Prevention is worth a Pound of Cure. And being proactive and GETTING ON a disease's trace means you can limit how far it spreads and how much damage it does.
Which country failed to implement an ounce of prevention, and is now wishing ruefully it had done so instead of having to implement a pound of cure?
No country, anywhere on earth, has experienced the Wuhan flu as anything worse than a regular flu season. The additional damage caused is ENTIRELY a result of overreaction.
If you disagree, feel free to post the country that was hit significantly harder by the Wuhan flu than that country gets hit by every year's flu season. I've asked several times, and you keep failing to provide this.
The CCP lying and trying to spread UNDERreaction helped this virus cause the damage it did, both in terms of those directly affected and in the retarded-psychopath overreach by governmental goons claiming "We will totally relinquish these emergency powers."
The virus didn't cause any damage that wouldn't have happened with this year's flu season, though. And this year's flu season wasn't caused by China. And it couldn't have been prevented.
The only thing the CCP has done is spread a pandemic of hysteria.
Trying to spread OVERreaction- like the CCP and co are doing now- was late in the game, now that the virus has spread about as far and as deep as it's going to this season, herd immunity's building up, and the West and ChiComChina's other rivals are starting to reopen.
How could they sell an overreaction if they hadn't initially allowed travel abroad? If no one had travelled from Wuhan to spread the putative virus, what would we be overreacting to?
Agreed.
So we can agree that WuFlu IS dangerous, just a mundane kind of dangerous like what a functional society deals with every single day.
Fucking lead with this next time. Sheesh.
Again, no it wasn't. You're trying to marry your pet theory without providing evidence.
Mass hysteria didn't spread out from an epicenter in Wuhan. Mass hysteria spread out from almost every OTHER Place from a combination of sane and reasonable warnings (like those by Taiwan) being blown out of proportion, and unscrupulous BS from power grabby scum like Fauxci and the Imperial College Scammer.
The CCP was a late convert to spreading the gospel of mass hysteria, in part because they were worried about it rebounding into their face as people asked "Where did this come from?" (and for instance having punitive action like what Trump is proposing levied on them) or Chinese people saying "What did you do about this?!?", and in part because other left wing tyrants elsewhere beat them to it. The CCP's spreading it NOW because it has no real benefit pretending that nothing happened, but there is benefit in keeping other countries shut down as long as it can and helping their petty tyrants usurp as much power as they can.
Wrong. The mass hysteria was in response to the half-assed lockdown of Wuhan, which had all the film and television cues for a serious pandemic. We saw China kneecap itself and wondered if they had a reason to do so. They didn't have a direct reason, since the Wuhan flu is harmless. So the only reason they did what they did was to spread panic.
But how could they cause us to panic if they had locked Wuhan down diligently? No one with the putative virus would be here to panic about.
Commie Party at the start: "What are you talking about, a leak? YOU ARE A DOUBLE PLUS BAD WRONGTHINKER. Apologize to the party for daring to say there's a threat! Oh, and by the way enjoy being thrown in a dank cell with COVID...."
How do we know the whistleblowers were put down for saying the Wuhan flu is a threat? They might have been saying "guys, this is weird, we're reacting like lunatics to a flu season." That message getting out would spoil the whole thing.
Commie Party Stage 2: "EVERYTHING IS FINE! Do not think. Consume. China is cleanest race. Ignore subhuman mongrels like Taiwan. No evidence of human to human transmissability! There's no NEED To stop flights!"
How else would "infected" individuals get all over the planet? If they hadn't, we'd have nothing to overreact about.
Commie Party Stage 3: "In the DARKEST OF DAYS as the decadent West allowed the Black Death to spread and destroy its society, the Heroic Peoples' Party arose to quell rumor mongering and bring effective treatment, thus showing the Communist Party is ordained by Marx-Heaven to rule foreigner. So while China can tentatively reopen, the barbaric savages abroad would be insane to, since they are totally more afflicted than we are! Praise Chairman Xi, Helm man of destiny!"
This is why I chew you out for not timelining this.
If China had diligently locked down Wuhan, we would have nothing to panic about. Since panic is the only risk here, and is also the only weaponized portion of the Wuhan flu episode, this reaction at this stage was necessary. Else panic couldn't be spread.
This is why I repeat the same question over and over. You haven't played through the chess game. If China did as you propose, they wouldn't have achieved their ends.
I don't know. If I had to wager a guess I would say "probably, marginally", most likely because even the most dishonest and thoroughly corrupt Western globalist medical hack in the West isn't claiming that Literally NOBODY has died of plain old Flu this season even as they shamelessly stripe mine most of those deaths to relabel as Coronavirus. Meaning that they still acknowledge Flu deaths are a separate thing, even if they have "mysteriously" decreased due to mislabeling them as WuFlu deaths (or WuFlu "Stealing" those deaths naturally).
So you PROBABLY have a small increase in ChiCom COVID deaths put on top of the bog standard "Flu Season + Other deaths."
Harmless.
Simple.
If my theory is correct and there is indeed a slight increase in overall deaths from WuFlu mingling with other deaths, then the provable harm is from the excess.
And if my theory ISN'T correct, the harm is the background statistical noise of more or less routine death. Still harm, but "within normal parameters."
Neither of which are as damaging as the mass hysteria or Swamp State usurpation we've seen gutting our economy and civic culture that were Also spurred by this thing (But of course, by your logic we could point to Swampy corruption and tyranny and economic sabotage going well before even Wuhan had Wuhan Flu and say "Well, what's the harm? It was already happening" while ignoring the intensification of it). But still worth noting.
We'll never know this, because gunshot deaths are being counted as Wuhan flu deaths. Even if there's a slight bump in Wuhan flu deaths this year as compared to flus of years past, we'll never know if the Wuhan flu was actually worse.
No, I don't have access to more accurate statistics than you do, though I do know how to find what statistics we have acess to more easily.
The difference is I can interpret them better.
Because I both have some minimal medical experience, and because I'm not a credulous idiot.
We appear to have interpreted the same, though. The Wuhan flu is just another flu. How is that "better?"
Which is why you're caught screaming about "Why are China's death numbers so hard to believe?" and "These faked numbers are more accurate than those faked numbers? On what basis?"
Because apparently you've never read 1984 or understand how pervasive Commie book cooking is, much less how either side arrived at their numbers.
My complaint is that everyone expects China's numbers to be sky high. But this expectation assumes there is something to be dying of in the first place. There isn't, beyond a regular flu season. I take no issue with anyone calling the CPC liars, as they are that.
The wrong numbers of COVID deaths and infections in the US, UK, and other nations are based off of normal recording- along with "normal" mistakes like miscounting, double counting, or massaging the numbers to get them low- that are then skewed after the fact using number games, such as slapping normal Flu deaths as WuFlu deaths.
But the wrong numbers for COVID deaths and infections from the CCP have the "added bonus" of coming from a totalitarian dictatorship that is not shy about COMPLETELY INVENTING numbers from whole cloth and is not about to provide any evidence or external review whatsoever. And who are willing to do stuff like vanish people into literal incinerators in the same way that they lie about the US having the largest per capita prison population by pretending that Commie Party Laogai and secretive Blacksites don't exist.
That's the basis for why the West's faked numbers are more accurate than ChiCom faked numbers. As you'd know if you thought about it for five seconds.
Neither number is accurate, and so both form a very poor basis from which to try and discern the reality. As does the assumption that there "must" be more Wuhan flu deaths than have been reported. Since the whole thing's a hoax, Wuhan flu deaths are universally over-reported. They should be 0 across the board (and the deaths properly attributed to gunshot wounds, the flu, etc.)
Firstly: Argument from Ignorance is also a logical fallacy, and it amounts to almost everything you've done in this conversation
Yet we arrived at the same conclusion (that the Wuhan flu is just a flu)? Also, that isn't a logical fallacy, it (assuming it happened, which it didn't) is an incorrect apprehension of the facts. Once can have unimpeachable logic with incorrect facts (which isn't what I'm saying I have here).
Secondly: You're confusing the Argument from Authority fallacy with assessing information gotten by and presented by "So-Called" Experts. Which one can then analyze.
You implied I'm not qualified to review the statistics, and you are, because you volunteer and assume I don't (I don't).
It was a naked appeal to authority.
Instead of drawing upon your vast experience as a volunteer, you should have referred to statistics. But those all agree with me, so I see why you didn't.
Except the Wuhan COVID research was almost certainly not Bioweapons research.
Firstly because it was the study of a naturally occurring disease, secondly because even in its current form its lethality is so low (and the CCP showed so little ability to control it, hence the staff infections Laowhy's video covered), and thirdly because Most Bio Research isn't Bioweapons Research.
What the fuck? I suggest you go read up on the USSR's research into naturally occurring smallpox. When creating bioweapons, they don't start from scratch. They peruse nature's best hits, then try to remix and remaster.
The commies probably chose something related to the common cold for maximum spread, not realizing that the mechanism by which viruses spread universally neuters any severe effects of that virus. God probably had to make it that way or else civilization-ending pandemics would be a certainty.
For the same reason your average GMO isn't trying to create the next biological nuke. That stuff has other utilities than trying to come up with yet another rare white elephant doomsday weapon that is a niche at best.
I'm open to ideas as to the utility of a highly infectious novel virus!
Since the Wuhan flu isn't dangerous, we are left to conclude that the only danger that spread from Wuhan is government overreaction.
If you're trying to spread overreaction, would you try to stop the spread of the virus in earnest?
Flu and pneumonia deaths are down this year as Wuhan flu deaths are up. Nothing more dangerous than normal has been released.
Except for mass hysteria, of course. That has spread from its epicentre in Wuhan very nicely.
So more people are going to die of pnuemonia and other Wuhan flu related complications this year than normal?
If not, where is the "harm"?
Except, of course, in the mass hysteria.
Oh, so you have access to more accurate statistics than I do? Could you post them?
There's a reason appeal to authority is a logical fallacy.
So? China is researching bioweapons, this isn't controversial.
The controversial opinion that you seem to hold is that China is any good at it. They're not. Far better parties than them, such as the Russians and the US and the Jesuits, have tried to create a deadly contagious virus. They have all failed.
So, evidently, has China. But they would have already known that, there's no way anyone would have mistaken the Wuhan flu for a dangerous virus. Which is why the plan from the beginning was to spread hysteria. Which they've done nicely.
So where are all the moderately debilitated Wuhan flu patients? Where are the elevated rates of death?
Will you refer me back to your experience as a volunteer again, instead of referring to statistics and data?
Here, I will highlight the most important word in the above statement:
Fuck off with these shitty projections. Let us discuss actual data, in which nothing you are saying above has come true.
None of this answered my question, which was "why do you trust faked US data over faked Chinese data"? They're both fake.
This is a normal flu season. Unless the Wuhan flu has somehow cured the flu and replaced it with a virus which, for all intents and purposes, is the flu. But I'm going to go with Occam on that one.
You're getting hyperemotional, which is how you've concluded I'm a PRC shill. Fucking kek.
No, retard, I don't think the CPC's dishonesty is limited in any way. However, I want to re-direct this conversation back away from your manifest emotions, and towards the data.
Where, in the data, is your assertion of a dangerous virus from Wuhan borne out?
It's the flu. The hysteria is the real danger.
So your theory is that the CCP somehow mistook the harmless Wuhan flu for a dangerous virus, then tried to spread it all over the world before realizing it's actually harmless?
China took the regular flu. It reacted to it in a totally insane manner, which made everyone else wonder if there was something to the virus which justified that reaction. It acted in a suspicious manner intended to make us worry, sending travellers from Wuhan everywhere in the world except China. It banked on its lack of credibility by telling us all there was nothing to worry about (which naturally made us worry more). And now that we're all in a panic over nothing, they're advancing their interests in HK, India, Taiwan, the South Pacific, and elsewhere.
Your theory only makes sense if the Wuhan flu were dangerous, which it isn't, or if there were some reason to believe the Wuhan flu were dangerous, which there never was to begin with.
Do you remember all those CPC videos of people collapsing because of the virus? Why would they make things up about the virus if it were dangerous? They could have just told the truth about the danger of the virus.
Anon. This year's flu season would have occurred with or without China's theatrics in Wuhan. No further biological danger or risk was added to the world. We're all just as likely to die of this year's flu as we have been for previous years.
The only added risk is from the pandemic of hysteria, which is the CPC's only weapon here (since the Wuhan flu is harmless).
You think the leaders of China are stupid because they advocate socialism for the Chinese masses?
The leaks. From Communist China.
The entire panic about the Wuhan flu was leaked intentionally.
Doctors have been dying under suspicious circumstances everywhere since the Wuhan flu began. Probably for noticing it's just a flu.
Fucking hilarious. The guy who insists the Wuhan flu is dangerous and harmful, but can't produce a single shred of evidence beyond "I'm a VoLuNtEeR, Ok??", now accuses me of trying to fit the facts to a pre-conceived theory.
Ok, but where in this do you get the idea that the Wuhan flu is killing more people than the regular flu?
Because it isn't. Nowhere on earth. Not even China.
Where does this timeline show that the Wuhan flu is any more dangerous than the regular flu?
To sum it up:
The wuhan flu is harmless, since it's indistinguishable from a regular flu season. The only danger is in overreaction.
Part 3
Let me emphasize the most important part of this sentence, which you apparently do not grasp the importance of.
That's the key freaking difference.
The Western Liars spitting out the false Coronavirus toll are limited. They might be able to lie about someone dying in a car crash being killed by ChiCom COVID, they can classify Pneumonia deaths as COVID, and do a lot.
But they mostly can't manufacture corpses to label as "COVID." They also can't really incinerate hundreds of bodies without record. And they have to at least make the Pretense of keeping an ongoing count of the cases. In no small part because Western citizens aren't totally cucked yet and the corrupt arsehats don't have a one party system where Comrade Hillary will lie about everything for them.
The ChiComs don't have any of those problems , or at least in nowhere near the degree their Mirror Image Western Propagandists do.
Indeed, they don't even have to pretend they're keeping an ongoing count.
Lincoln said that if you want to see the measure of a man, give him power.
The West's swamp dwellers have much less power to lie about things than the Chinese swamp dwellers do. Which is why the former are limited in ways the ChiComs aren't.
As even a Lefty Socialist like Orwell could predict, regarding the production of boots.
Welcome to Socialism, Comrade. Where death itself waits for Comrade Xi's go ahead.
That'd be a change, considering you haven't provided any data.
I've had to do that for both of us.
Ask the freaking Taiwanese.
Wuhan Flu is a dangerous virus, just not a greatly dangerous one. It isn't going to end the world but it is something you want to jump on early.
The Taiwanese weren't as ignorant about that principle as you are. Which is precisely why- by recognizing the Coronavirus as the threat it is (no more and no less) they thoroughly kicked its butt without destroying their country or the economy.
More or less.
Both the Hysteria and the WuFlu are real dangers. The Hysteria's the greater one.
And again, you do NOBODY any service by denying reality.
Which is again why you keep failing to discuss the early spread of this virus correctly (as shown by recorded history), and why the Taiwanese acting fast and smart turned it into a nonissue while the idiots trying to deny that WuFlu was even SOMEWHAT dangerous in Florence and New York racked up deaths that could have been prevented entirely.
You DO remember the ChiCom-Western Leftist propaganda campaign encouraging Italians to hug Chinese people during the early part of the WuFlu spread, right?
No you semi-literate.
My theory is simple.
WuFlu is a marginal danger and the Chinese Communists more or less knew it. It can kill you, but not easily.
But what they DIDN'T know was just how easy it was to get sick with it, and how many people would die from that (they just knew it wasn't a world-ender since they were able to study it in its natural habitat in the Southwest). So while they knew it would not do "World Ending damage", they didn't know how much human or economic damage it COULD do (not much, as it turned out) or how to prepare to pre-empt it, just that it could do said damage. Which is kind of important for the CPC, since they are reliant upon economic growth to avoid people turning on them and that growth has been slowing by the month.
So the virus is something that even saner people than the Chinese Communists would like to research.
Which is why they brought it and several infected bats from their natural habitate to the Wuhan Virology Lab to study them in what they thought was "safety."
They were almost certainly not trying to create a Bioweapon (WuFlu isn't THAT dangerous), but probably to find other ways like how to block transmission.
Unfortunately, the staff on hand were idiots and many got infected (see the video above).
But when some of the medical staff tried to warn people about this, the local Commie Party bosses shut it down, up to and including humiliating and then murdering one of their own doctors.
They did this fearing that if Bad Stuff (TM) happened in their neighborhood they'd be made scapegoats and punished by Xi and the higher ups.
( Which by the way is EXACTLY what happened when the virus spread so widely it became impossible to hide or ignore. )
But to the surprise of what should have been very few people but- as it turned out- far more because of the Local Party Bosses trying to keep it under wraps, the lab's sloppiness ultimately resulted in the virus getting out and starting to infect lots of people and kill a very few of those, damaging the economy about like what you'd expect from a seasonal Flu.
Bit it also brought the attention of XI and the CCP at large. But it also brought it to the attention of the Chinese citizens living under the Party's yoke and several neighboring countries like Taiwan.
And those people began to talk, revealing how the Party had so thoroughly fucked up the situation. And while the CCP can afford to lose hundreds, thousands, and even millions of its own people,. it cannot afford long term economic quarantine and it DEFINITELY can't afford being exposed as ineffective or corrupt.
So the CCP began cracking down.
All the Way Down.
Partially for fear that Commie COVID would devastate the economy and so weaken their power and the iron fist, and partially because they overshot how damaging it was, but primarily in order to Kill The Story. To try and get ahead of events and prevent people from blaming the Party (or at least the National Party) for what happened and retain control with both the regime's credibility and social stability.
To save face.
Which is why when around the time this happened the Taiwanese started warning people about this and send messages to the WHO, the ChiComs worked to shut them out and quash any rumor that there was ANYTHING AT ALL to panic about in Wuhan in order to keep that sweet tourist and export money coming and to buy time to hoard medical supplies in order to try and ride it out.
And it worked far better than it ever should have, because while some people like Trump twigged to it and shut down flights to the PRC, most didn't take such steps.
But the fact that it Worked didn't mean that this actually stopped the spread of ChiCom COVID within China. Like the local party bosses before them, XI and co's decision to bury the story just meant it blew up later, especially since this came after the Chinese Lunar New Year brought people from all across China to Wuhan and then back again.
Fast forward a few months ultimately even puppets like the WHO were limited in how much they could deny the obvious and even looted goods could only go so far. Which led to a vicious little cycle for a bit where the CCP extended its lockdown from Wuhan while at the same time useful idiots like Ferguson and Fauxi gin up panic and shut down the country (along unfortunately with Trump in what I think was an unfortunate overreaction after his initial brilliant one).
And this is bad in a totalitarian regime that doesn't give a fig about human lives but cares greatly about how well its economy is doing. And while Socialists may claim to have transcended our economics, they have the same problems as the rest of us. So like us, the longer they stayed shut down, the more money they bled and the more people get angry. Only Xi faces the prospect of them getting angry not at Governor Whitmer and going to the Ballot Box, but angry at Him and going to war.
So eventually the Party decides it can't wait anymore and opens up long before most countries that bothered shutting down. The fact that this was around the time that the first major reports showing ChiCom COVID wasn't as dangerous as even the mild fears of 1% mortality was- at best- a happy coincidence. Because even if they had people dropping left and right on the assembly line, the Party needs to return to work (like any other economy) in order to avoid them getting 1776'd by a lot of angry, freedom hungry, unemployed Chinese. But it didn't go quite as well as they'd hoped, and in any case they're still kneecapped by being a Socialist Shithole Country.
And it's only NOW- where they're working but most countries that did shut down still are- that they shifted gears from "Everything's Fine Guys!" to "OMG THE SKY IS FALLING" because the longer they can make foreigners believe the Sky is Falling the more lost ground they can make up before getting run over by the Trump Train and other nations not shackled by such a shithole system recovering.
That explains how the US is up to 100,000 so-called Wuhan flu deaths, while Japan only had 800 (and no lockdown)!
You've grossly underestimated the degree of corruption in your country, anon.
Not from this year's flu season, it doesn't. The Wuhan flu is harmless.
Taiwan had a regular flu season. What are you talking about?
Japan didn't overreact like Taiwan, and suffered comparable deaths. This is because the Wuhan flu isn't dangerous at all, it's just this year's flu season.
No, because we have flu seasons every year. There is no additional danger this year over any other year.
We've never had hysteria like this though!
And where, again, in the world is this reality you imagine manifest?
You tried Taiwan, but it wasn't manifest there. Try again?
Or I can save you some time. The answer is "nowhere in the world. It's just a flu."
But Japan didn't, and it still wasn't an issue. Weird!
It wasn't dangerous there. Italy has a meltdown over every flu season, their health care system is in a shambles.
New York/NJ deaths are entirely attributed to moving this year's flu patients into old folks' homes. There was room in the hospitals for them, and the Navy hospital ships were there too (unused). If you did that any other flu season, you'd get additional deaths.
Their economy would have crashed around the same time, Wuhan flu or no. The tariffs are fatal to their economy, their foreign cash reserves are just about depleted.
Warn people about what? That they invented a flu? That 0.02% of the scientists in the lab died of the flu they invented? How many people working in the lab would have to have gotten infected for there to have been a case to be worth warning anyone about?
But it hasn't done this anywhere in the world, at all. Except for old folks' homes into which Wuhan flu patients were intentionally and needlessly moved.
Their economy was doomed because tariffs. The virus was a palatable excuse for China to begin reverting to North Korea standards of living, which is all that China can afford to provide now that the US has erected tariffs.
Part 4
Talk about an unsupported goulash of a theory, based around trying to ram your pet idea through the evidence rather than making a new one to fit the evidence. And to think you quoted Occam.
Now, let's go through and tear this apart.
Finally something we can agree on.
The problem is that a lot of people- either those that don't understand how totalitarian socialists (dys)function or those that are totalitarian socialists themselves- underestimated what the heck this represented. Namely: a combination of the actual, relatively mild Coronavirus illnesses and deaths, typical government overreach, the specifically totalitarian need to black out the news and prevent Bad Think complaining about the government's handling of things, and the Party's desire to keep the economy running at almost any cost, even if Wuhan died off.
So even those who were paying attention probably misread what had happened.
And most people at this time weren't paying attention, partially because of initial obscurity and primarily because of what i'm going to talk about next.
You're giving a blinkered, sclerotic socialist dictatorship way too much credit.
They acted in a suspicious manner because they're a totalitarian, corrupt, and not terribly competent dictatorship that figured it's better to look suspicious and tyrannical than it is to look incompetent and impotent.
Which is how you get things like this. Not from 21 million people with phones dying from COVID, but from a few people dying and even more talking, so the CCP figures it needs to shut them up.
This is also why it persecutes people for "Rumor Mongering", as the Voltaire's Ghost and Laowhy videos showed.
As for why it kept sending travellers from Wuhan to everywhere except other places in the PRC, that it desiring to keep the gears of its foreign businesses going, because it knows a degree of economic success (such as it is) is both necessary to avoid revolution and build on sand. So they wanted to avoid having a large scale disruption of it by cutting Wuhan trade, but they wanted to prevent it from spreading to elsewhere in China too.
(Of course, the dumb bastards being who they are, they underestimated how much it had already spread within the PRC).
How stupid can you be?
Seriously, have you even ASKED YOURSELF how they would actually go about doing this? Did you compare this theory to what the CCP actually did?
No, of course not.
If you're a crook that wants to launder money, you give your dirty money through a legitimate- or at least supposedly legitimate- source.
If you want to bank on your own lack of credibility in order to use reverse psychology, WHY WOULD YOU GO TO SUCH GREAT PAINS to "launder" your claims through sources that have more credibility (at least supposedly)?
(Sure, those who have worked with the WHO and Left Wing Pols know- or should know- that they aren't credible, but how many people knew that before this? Particularly with things like Tedros the Commie?)
So at the very time your theory posits that the CCP was banking on its own lack of credibility, it was laundering its propaganda through different organs in order to make it more credible.
And indeed, even proposing major PR propaganda stunts with them in order to buttress the central claim of CHINA GOOD, NOTHING TO FEAR, DON'T LISTEN TO THE BAD NEWS.
All of which you flat out memory hole. Because it contradicts your pet theory.
In spite of it being easily confirmable, and making more SENSE for a totalitarian regime that is both obsessed with saving face to its own people and the world, and which has spent billions in propaganda trying to put the best face of "Socialism with Chinese Characteristics" to the world.
They've been doing that for Decades. Indeed, they wouldn't have been able to punt stuff like "Hug Chinese Day" in Italy if it weren't for how they've been advancing it.
More circular BS logic.
WuFlu not being Black Death dangerous doesn't mean it's not dangerous.
And even MORE important for the CCP, it not being very dangerous in terms of deaths doesn't mean it's NOT dangerous in terms of economic damage and social unrest.
Translation: you're not understanding why the CCP lied, or how. So you're just assuming they lied that the virus was dangerous (again, in spite of the basic timeline contradicting it). That if those videos of seemingly well equipped medical doctors rushing people to the ER were fake, so must reports of the virus's damage. So the CCP must be lying about how dangerous it is.
The problem with this is twofold.
Firstly: this ignores how the CCP spent the first several months of this problem perpetually lying about and downplaying the dangers of the disease.
Secondly: you're wrong in assuming the propaganda videos were about showing how dangerous the virus is.
Because yeah, I remember the CPC videos of people collapsing.
I ALSO remember the videos about the Communist Chinese building a bunch of supposedly new hospitals outside Wuhan to combat the virus.
[And I also remembered how they were utterly unsafe, unusable props that were utterly ignored after the cameras went off.] (https://www.businessinsider.co.za/wuhan-coronavirus-hospitals-not-filling-beds-data-2020-2)
And I also-also know how Chinese whistleblowers have been talking about how the Party has been sending funeral urns and incinerators into the city on the down low.
So unfortunately you've overthought the basics of why the CCP lied. You thought this was part of some 5 Dimensional Chess game in which Xi and the Commies sought to simultaneously spook the rest of the world into economically devastating itself (which happened) while oddly also insisting everything was fine.
In reality it was mostly due to a universal drive for politicians. To look Good. To be seen as decisive leaders. To be seen as "Doing Something Good." And to say "Commie China Number 1!"
Building (so called) hospitals good.
Having well trained medical staff able to react toe vents good.
Sending massive funeral urn shipments NOT so good.
Welding people in to buildings Bad.
See the pattern? The CPC doesn't like stuff that makes it look bad, no matter how true that is. And if there's one thing the CCP has ALWAYS tried to say during this crisis, it's "Commie Party Good."
Occam's Razor.
Yes it would have.
You're assuming that Wuhan COVID isn't another threat, even a minor one, co-existing with normal Flu and other nasty stuff.
I'd like to see the data for that. Especially if you're going to bitch to me about not having statistics or data.
See above.
Yes, Yes I do.
Because Socialism is not a system for the masses, it's a system for the Central Planners.
And while even the Chinese Communists weren't capable of completely ignoring how their own system sucks and diluted bits of it, they're still wedded to its core aspects. Which means pervasive lying that Obama could only dream of.
Why are you assuming that a bunch of people whose Top. People. couldn't handle a moderately infectious and not very lethal Bat Virus properly in a Specially Constructed Bio Lab have managed to beat the Socialist Calculation Problem and other problems?
That doesn't mean they're COMPLETE idiots, but they are institutionally shackled to a certain level of stupidity. To do otherwise would mean reform, and Xi and most others don't want that.
Which were crushed with typical communist Brutality. Because even totalitarian regimes have grape vines and underground dissident writing.
No, it wasn't. The leaks came from grassroots leaks from both inside China and especially its neighbors.
The "Entire Panic" leaked out only slowly via Chinese nationals and neighboring countries. Usually acting in the face of denial by useful idiots like WHO and persecution by the CCP.
Well, this one was murdered AFTER the Wuhan Flu began, after being ritually humiliated and imprisoned for trying to spread warning that containment breach was a thing.
I take back the "semi-literate."
Which is probably part of the reason why you refuse to look at what the CCP actually did during the time you were claiming it was trying to weaponize hysteria.
And because you're so wedded to the idea that a Flu isn't dangerous just because it hasn't killed you yet and it is less infective and murderous than the Black Death.
Which makes about as much sense as noting that shark attacks are rare and usually not lethal, so they're not dangerous and there is no point making shark repellent or weapons that can drive off a Great White.
Actually, anon, it's ever more apparent that you are the one who has not been paying attention.
China had no desire to keep the economy running. The who reason this is happening now is:
China subsidizes its industry's inputs, then makes the subsidies back with dumping and crushing int'l competition
Trump put tariffs on Chinese goods.
China must increase the subsidies to maintain the same price on the shelves. Many of the subsidies, notably oil, can only be bought with USD or other foreign currency reserves.
Phase 1 is fatal to China. The levels of tariffs, combined with the obligation to buy American, completely defeats China's "miraculous" growth. China has been hemorrhaging foreign cash, meanwhile hoping Mueller, then impeachment, would remove Trump from office before they run out.
Right after signing phase 1 with obvious reluctance, we get the Wuhan flu.
The economic collapse in China resulting from the Wuhan flu could not but have happened. If this year's flu season had not been weaponized with propaganda, China's economy would still have collapsed and they would still have had to turn away oil and natural gas and other freighters under force majeure.
Oh, you think the Chinese run China instead of just following instructions from their banker overlords. Good grief.
Better? In what sense? Lol. "They were concerned about optics!" What idiocy.
All of this ignores the fact that China's economy was bound to fail right around the time the Wuhan flu arose. What luck for the Communist Party that random Chinese people suddenly started talking up this year's flu just in time, sparking a worldwide panic!
The panic was the goal from the outset.
They're not obsessed with saving face for their own people. They 100% control the narrative in that country. The Chinese people are just cattle to them. So long as they're punching their clocks and not revolting, the CCP doesn't give a shit what the Chinese people think of them.
The billions in propaganda were spent in anticipation of a compliant US president like Hillary being in office at exactly the right moment (now).
Now that that plan has been foiled, they're going straight for their goals without any pretence. All of 'em, all at once! Under cover of a fake panic they created.
What the fuck, you pretend you read the news, but you're unaware that China is moving at 10x speed in China, the Himalayas, and the South Pacific right now?
Explain Japan's numbers.
USA total pop: 328 million COVID-19 deaths: 100,000 [lockdown]
Japan total pop: 126 million [condensed (island)] COVID-19 deaths: 850 [no lockdown]
The wuhan flu isn't dangerous. It's just another flu season.
This retardation again. It's not dangerous because nowhere in the world has it presented as dangerous. If it had, places like the US wouldn't have to count gunshot wounds as Wuhan flu deaths.
See Japan's numbers again. Then marvel at your own idiocy: you fell for Chinese propaganda, it's just this year's flu season.
There were no more funeral urns than normal. Why would there be? The wuhan flu isn't dangerous, it's just a flu season.
It is actually you who still hasn't thought it through. Let's walk through it. If you respond to one thing, make it this.
China notices this year's flu season starting in China.
For some reason, Chinese doctors report on social media that this year's flu season is more dangerous than other flu seasons. Why would they do this though? There is no evidence to suggest the Wuhan flu is any more dangerous than any other flu season? Why did these whistleblowers even exist?
China censors these whistleblowers, because they don't want a panic over this year's flu season.
Then China builds a fake hospital, locks down Wuhan, and kneecaps their economy. Why would they do this right after censoring whistleblowers for causing a panic? It is sure to cause a panic, which it did.
Then ultimately, based on data from all over the world, it turns out there was never any reason to panic because it's just this year's flu season. So then why were there whistleblowers at all? Why did China build a fake hospital? Why did they kneecap their economy at this critical juncture?
If you just think for a minute, you'd recognize that everything China did was intended to cause the panic we're seeing now.
Your idea that they publicly overreacted to a harmless virus in an attempt to avoid a worldwide panic when the worldwide panic serves their interest makes no fucking sense.
Yeah, they really had to get their numbers up for the next election. KEK!!!!!!
But there was nothing to make them look bad in the first place, since it's just a flu. So why would they even react at all?
Fucking nonsense.
No, I'm not assuming. If there were concurrent biological threats, we'd see additional deaths. We're not. Ergo, it's just this year's flu season.
https://wearethene.ws/notable/108025
Wonder why they'd have to massage the numbers if there was an elevated risk of death from the Wuhan flu like all the Chinese propaganda you fell for says?
Yeah, so those leaders (i.e., central planners) are pretty smart to have attained a system that works so well for them.
Not dumb.
Yeah, like lying a regular flu season into a global pandemic.
Lol, there's no bat virus. It's just this year's flu season. Good grief, do you just want to believe Chinese propaganda? Why are you so gullible?
I haven't assumed such because they haven't managed to beat this problem. The solution was trillion dollar trade deficits with the Western world. Which solution is totally fucked by tariffs. Which is why we now have Chinese propaganda inciting a worldwide panic over this year's flu season.
The CCP brass are not stupid, at all. Underestimate them (and their bankist masters) at your peril.
But why were there leaks from China about this year's flu season at all? What occasion would the leakers have to leak anything? Flu seasons happen every year.
Yeah, those grassroots leakers spread the word about this year's flu season. Thank goodness for them, or else we wouldn't have known it was coming! Ha ha ha!!
Containment breach... of what? Ha ha ha!!!
Part 2 > The controversial opinion that you seem to hold is that China is any good at it. They're not. Far better parties than them, such as the Russians and the US and the Jesuits, have tried to create a deadly contagious virus. They have all failed.
No, we've created plenty of deadly contagious viruses. The "Bio-Chernobyl" the Soviets caused was on the Aral Sea and involved supersouped up Anthrax (technically a bacteria rather than a virus, but involving similar scientific and production demands).
Which is one reason why we stopped doing it as often. Because we got bored of it and had more than enough deadly bioweapons we couldn't really use but which could have disastrous consequences if we F--ked up with production or containment, as the Soviets at Aralsk-7 Showed.
We still RESEARCH them and produce them, but in much smaller quantities.
The problem is that you seem to think- or act- as if all Virological research is Bioweapons Research. Which is about as ignorant as assuming that all research in construction engineering is to go into build better fortifications.
Uh, no, no we don't.
We've got plenty of reason to know that the ChiComs have deadly engineered viruses.
Wu Flu just wasn't one of them. In the same way that having cultures of the Black Death in secured bioweapons vaults doesn't mean someone is going to try and weaponize the Common Cold. But they ARE probably going to study it, various normal Flus, and the like.
The logical incoherence behind this is ludicrous.
WuFlu is a Dangerous virus, but not a Highly Dangerous or even moderately dangerous one like Virus. And certainly nowhere near what one would want in a Bioweapon.
Nobody should mistake ChiCom Flu for a Bioweapon, it is nowhere near effective or lethal enough. But there's plenty of reasons to research a virus other than "LET'S WMD IT!" In the same reason there's plenty of reason to research Nuclears without "LET'S MAKE A BIGGER TSAR BOMBA!"
And the Chicom plan wasn't to "spread hysteria from the beginning." Again, their actions show this was to the contrary.
The ChiComs were almost certainly trying to research a more or less mundane case of COVID in Bats and how it might jump to humans (probably in order to find ways to inhibit it or- waaay down the road- weaponize it), but their incompetence meant that they couldn't study it safely. Local party officials tried to muzzle reports of problems at the Lab. So a bunch of staff at the lab got sick, and ultimately the Virus broke containment.
When the CCP at large realized the scope of the problem, they lied through their teeth and claimed everything was alright, intentionally shouting over more honest reports like those by Taiwan that while this wasn't a world-ending problem, it was a problem (and the quicker you jump on a problem, the quicker and easier it is to Solve said problem, as Taiwan's smackdown of WuFlu shows).
Again, THIS IS WHY TRUMP CONDEMNED THE CCP AND WHO (but I repeat myself) FOR LYING ABOUT THE THREAT. At a time when SOME degree of controlled panic was healthy in order to try and make proper preparations to isolate this thing, the CCP sabotaged it.
Which helped enable a bunch of Leftist Control Freaks abroad to shout that the World was Ending unless the Free World surrendered its Freedom to Mask-Stasi.
You haven't provided any evidence to support your claims. I have provided plenty of evidence to puncture them, starting with how the basic timeline doesn't work.
Simple, dumbarse.
As for the "moderately debilitated Wuhan flu patients", ask around and you might be able to find them. Starting with hospital records, though those are extreme lowball figures since most people with WuFlu didn't go to the Hospital because it wasn't serious or they didn't know it.
Then look through the number of people who have been tested for Antibodies and rung up positive, indicating they found it.
As for evidence of an elevated death toll...
Take the "Official", Artificially inflated numbers of COVID deaths
Prune as much obvious BS as you can off of it, such as the number of people marked "Dead of COVID" after being shot or in a car crash.
Then start adding up the "Official", almost-certianly-artificially-deflated numbers of deaths from causes other than COVID.
Like Flu.
And Pneumonia
(Those are just to get you started. There are more.)
Then compare them to previous, pre-ChiCom Flu mortality seasons from the
Like this for the 2017-2018 Flu Season
Obviously, this isn't all the data you'd need (though I note it's still far more than you've EVER provided at any point in this exchange), but it's the right KIND of data you'd need to look for.
And after gathering it all, you'd add up th BS inflated Coronavirus deaths for 2020+ the BS deflated other-causes deaths for it and get Sum 1.
Then you'd add together the Death Tolls for the "Normal" Causes from another year and get Sum 2 (and then for another year and get Sum 3, and so on).
Then you see if Sum 1 is Greater Than, Equal To, or Less Than the death toll Sum 2, Sum 3/Sum Insert Number here.
And you'd have a PALLPARK guesstimate about the death rate of the 2020 Spring Sickness Season (and COVID) compared to others. Average that out and you get it.
Oh this is Rich.
But to answer your question: the above text spam shows that No, no I didn't "instead of."
But secondly: it's rich you of all people are trying to claim that, considering you haven't even provided a single bit of evidence, statistics, or data for anybody to believe you, not even a surface level statement that "I Iz expert in Mechanical Surgery".
And many of your claims- such as that the CCP intended to use WuFlu as a weapon of mass hysteria against the West from the get go- are easily contradicted by the arcane art of looking at the goddamn timeline. And seeing how far from trying to spread Panic abroad, the CCP spent months TRYING TO PREVENT other nations from panicking and taking precautions like Trump's stopping of flights.
And unsurprisingly, you fail at this just as comprehensively as you fail at "reading a timeline."
The most important word in the above statement isn't "Can" (and frankly I mis-wrote, considering the proper phrase should be "DOES." As in, it Does kill thousands every single year.)
The most important word in the above statement isn't "Can."
It's "Understand."
If there's one thing you have shown thus far, it's that you don't understand much in the way of anything, ranging from Bioweapons research (which is apparently the kind of virology anyone does according to you?) to average influenza deaths, to what is dangerous.
Shitty projector accuses other people of shitty projections, film at eleven.
Again, this is ironic.
At no point in this discussion have you cited "actual data." The only links about it are coming from me.
And not only has much that I have said come true, plenty of it came true MONTHS ago.
Because one of the most clearcut and unambiguous bits of "actual data" in today's wired up recording world is a Date. Which is why it's incredibly easy to verify things like WHO acting as a propaganda arm of the ChiComs and saying "China has not found any evidence of human to human transmission" back in January.
Something that thoroughly guts your beloved theory that the CCP intended to use this virus as a weapon of mass panic from the start by showing that the CCP was trying to prevent panic at the time, even reasonable levels of preparation.
And which you have At No Point Whatsoever addressed. Probably because you can't.
Neither the facts nor the law of the case are on your side, so you've apparently decided to pound the table, complaining about me simplifying or summarizing data while not providing any of your own.
Well, that's no longer going to fly.
Stop wasting my time.
Then you simply don't know how to read. And you certainly don't know jack about Socialism.
Faked US and other Western Coronavirus figures are mostly faked by mislabeling deaths from other viruses (or even entire causes altogether) as WuFlu, in no small part because it's kind of hard even in Kaiser Wilhelm's New York City to completely conceal the number of people dying. So they have to stick closer to the numbers.
The CCP, on the other hand, are totalitarian socialists. So they not only can do everything the people faking the numbers over here can do, they can invent numbers out of whole cloth and quash anybody trying to gainsay their obviously bogus numbers.
And indeed, they kind of HAVE to because Socialism is such a failure they can't reliably get even passable estimates, so they largely BS them and then try to make policy based on them.
Simply put: The fraudsters in the West are mostly MIScounting actual deaths and lying about people investigating them like citizen journalists.
The fraudsters in the CCP don't have to count at all, and can simply adjust them with a wave of a magic wand and can shoot or imprison anybody they catch contradicting them.
Do I really have to explain to you how the latter "process" will almost invariably churn out numbers less related to reality than the former?
Apparently so.
A sleazy millionaire (like say Mr. and Mrs. Sanders) mis-filing his tax returns will give a fake figure.
So will a member of the "Nigerian Royalty" promising you millions of dollars in exchange for a down payment.
Does that mean that both figures are equally fake?
That's basically your logic.
More or less agreed.
Except even the hard core Dem liars aren't completely claiming that, only "largely." Hence why they haven't completely abolished normal flu deaths even as they've stolen lots from it.
Again, coming from someone who can't dispute basic DATES that contradict his pet theory and engages in CCP shill style whataboutism of "They're both fake! So why should we trust the corrupt but at least somewhat realistic numbers compared to those that obviously aren't counting anything but what comes out of XI's cloaca?"
If your claims are so poor and deny similar things to what CCP shills deny (like Taiwan shouting there was a problem and being ignored), do you deserve more respect?
1 of 2
Easily treated. Which is why they gave up on it and buried it.
So which deadly contagious virus did we create?
Every time the supposedly deadly Soviet bioweapons leaked, the consequences were not disastrous. The weapons don't work, is the reason why.
I don't really care one way or the other. Better parties than the CCP have tried and failed universally. The idea that the CCP could do it where others couldn't is ridiculous. Whether this year's flu season is man-made or not is irrelevant.
I don't really see how a man-made flu could both kill the same number of people as the flu, and also stop the regular flu from killing as many people as it usually does though.
You kind of trailed off there.
I agree. It's no more dangerous than the flu. Which is why the only weapon here is the hysteria.
They staged a fake deadly outbreak, downplayed it to seed supposed carriers around the world, and are now ramping the hysteria up to 11.
If they had diligently locked down Wuhan, there would be nothing for us to overreact to.
You mean to tell me you think this was an accident that occurred at exactly the time the CCP needed it?
What luck!
Scope of what problem. You are assuming once again that the virus must be hitting someone hard. But it isn't hitting anyone hard, including China. It's just a flu.
If they hadn't sabotaged it, supposed carriers wouldn't have spread around the world and we would have nothing to overreact to.
Why would we overreact like China wants if they didn't seed supposed carriers everywhere?
This was the end goal from the outset.
I've done this. This year's flu season looks marginally worse than the average over the last 10 years. But that's because they're counting gunshot wounds as flu deaths, which they've never done before.
Nowhere on earth does this year's flu season look like an outlier of any kind. And even if it did, you would be unable to conclude that China did any actual thing to harm us (beyond spreading a pandemic of hysteria), since we aren't seeing Wuhan flu deaths ON TOP OF regular flu deaths, we are seeing regular flu deaths ATTRIBUTED TO Wuhan flu.
I'm sorry, did you mistake your call for me to review the evidence, quoted in full above, as evidence?
The statistics and data do not support the idea that the Wuhan flu is any more dangerous than any other normal past flu season. What, I'm supposed to prove a negative?
If China's government had diligently locked down Wuhan, what would we have to overreact to?
You keep ignoring this question. China had to do as they did to get the supposed carriers spread across the globe. If they hadn't spread, we would have nothing to overreact to, since there would be no supposed carriers in our countries.
If you were trying to cause a global panic, you would take all of the steps China did, in the order they did. Your seeming inability to think strategically or see beyond a single move is on full display here.
No, the most important word was "can," since the thing you said "can" happen hasn't happened, anywhere on earth. That would imply that it actually "can't" happen.
Which shitty projection have I made? You said something "can" happen when it apparently can't. By contrast, I've done no such thing.
I've addressed it, you illiterate faggot. If China had diligently locked down Wuhan, what would we all be overreacting to? The supposed carriers would all be locked down in Wuhan, and wouldn't have spread across the globe.
Thankfully, they weren't carrying anything that we need to be concerned with. But their presence has enabled all this hysteria.
If they weren't here, we wouldn't be overreacting to them. Why would we?
Fucking make me, faggot.
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Both are fake. Neither is trustworthy. Nowhere on earth is the Wuhan flu presenting as more dangerous than the regular flu.
No, my logic is that nowhere on earth has experienced the Wuhan flu as anything other than a regular old flu season, and therefore, China experienced nothing other than a regular old flu season.
Why would China be the only place hit hard?
If they'd completely abolished flu deaths, it would be even less believable than it is now.
I don't need to dispute the dates. Your timeline is a list of actions that China would have to have taken to spread this pandemic of hysteria. After all, if they had diligently locked down Wuhan, we would all have nothing to overreact to, as the supposed carriers of the virus would not be here amongst us, but back in Wuhan.
If they'd done that, there would be no basis for us to panic. And since panic was the goal from the outset, doing as you suggest would have been self-defeating.
How would diligently locking down Wuhan have resulted in worldwide panic? And since the Wuhan flu is harmless, how could China have started this thing with any goal other than causing a panic?
Taiwan was wrong though. There is no problem. It's the flu.
Ironically, China's planted advice that there was nothing to worry about was actually correct.
I get tired of intellectually dishonest runarounds, and that is what you are doing.
Circular "Logic" that fails to prove its necessary assumption: that Wuhan Flu isn't dangerous.
It is. It's just not ultra-dangerous and has a high infectivity, low mortality profile like the Flu. And I hate to tell you this, the Flu's dangerous. Primarily to those in certain at risk demographics (like the old, the young, people with breathing problems, and so forth). But you do have a fair few healthy-as-a-bull people keel over and die of it every year.
That's dangerous, but it's not existential. Take reasonable precautions (which are usually less intrusive than the Masked Mooks demand) and soldier on so that even when people die, most people and the society survive more or less unhindered.
That's the problem. You're acting as if ChiCom Flu is not merely no more dangerous than the Flu (which is correct, and if anything even less dangerous with proper treatment since as the Hydro-Zinc Cocktail), but far far less.
"That which is presented without evidence can be dismissed without evidence."
You have provided absolutely zero evidence that the initial response of the CCP was to SPREAD overreaction. Indeed, the evidence I have presented shows that their initial reaction was to do the exact INVERSE of spreading overreaction to different countries: it was to impose UNDER-REACTION on Wuhan by dint of locking up whistle-blowers cutting news, and generally acting as if everything was "Fine." Initially this was just the local party bosses trying to avoid "rumors" (protip: tyrannical assholes hate "rumors") and avoid being blamed.
But when the infection at Wuhan blew up too hard for them to keep a lid on, the PRC decided not to spread overreaction, but to spread the disease. And one of the ways they did this was about LYING about how the disease spread and how prolific it was.
And that's Literally. As in the Commie Ethiopian shill at the head of WHO lying through his teeth claiming there was no evidence of human to human transmission even though by this point the CCP must have known.
And the Communist propagandists continued to parrot this "Nothing to see Here, everything is in Order" while smearing or downplaying reports from nations that aren't Totalitarian Shitholes in order to sabotage other nations and give their state-sponsored looters the time to hoard our goods.
So they spent the crucial breakout period of the disease doing the exact Inverse of spreading Overreaction. First domestically due to the CYA/Saving Face mentality of the Communist Party and the local authorities' concern they might get scapegoated for what happened (as they were), and Secondly internationally as the ChiComs and their fellow shills lied about the gravity of the disease and shut down the based, knowledgeable people trying to warn so this virus could be gotten in hand such as Taiwan.
And no, it's not a coincidence that Taiwan was one of those screaming about the threat of this thing the loudest while its death and infection rates are so low and its "lockdown" measures are so lax. Because An Ounce of Prevention is worth a Pound of Cure. And being proactive and GETTING ON a disease's trace means you can limit how far it spreads and how much damage it does.
The CCP lying and trying to spread UNDERreaction helped this virus cause the damage it did, both in terms of those directly affected and in the retarded-psychopath overreach by governmental goons claiming "We will totally relinquish these emergency powers."
Trying to spread OVERreaction- like the CCP and co are doing now- was late in the game, now that the virus has spread about as far and as deep as it's going to this season, herd immunity's building up, and the West and ChiComChina's other rivals are starting to reopen.
Agreed.
So we can agree that WuFlu IS dangerous, just a mundane kind of dangerous like what a functional society deals with every single day.
Again, no it wasn't. You're trying to marry your pet theory without providing evidence.
Mass hysteria didn't spread out from an epicenter in Wuhan. Mass hysteria spread out from almost every OTHER Place from a combination of sane and reasonable warnings (like those by Taiwan) being blown out of proportion, and unscrupulous BS from power grabby scum like Fauxci and the Imperial College Scammer.
The CCP was a late convert to spreading the gospel of mass hysteria, in part because they were worried about it rebounding into their face as people asked "Where did this come from?" (and for instance having punitive action like what Trump is proposing levied on them) or Chinese people saying "What did you do about this?!?", and in part because other left wing tyrants elsewhere beat them to it. The CCP's spreading it NOW because it has no real benefit pretending that nothing happened, but there is benefit in keeping other countries shut down as long as it can and helping their petty tyrants usurp as much power as they can.
Put it simply:
Commie Party at the start: "What are you talking about, a leak? YOU ARE A DOUBLE PLUS BAD WRONGTHINKER. Apologize to the party for daring to say there's a threat! Oh, and by the way enjoy being thrown in a dank cell with COVID...."
Commie Party Stage 2: "EVERYTHING IS FINE! Do not think. Consume. China is cleanest race. Ignore subhuman mongrels like Taiwan. No evidence of human to human transmissability! There's no NEED To stop flights!"
Commie Party Stage 3: "In the DARKEST OF DAYS as the decadent West allowed the Black Death to spread and destroy its society, the Heroic Peoples' Party arose to quell rumor mongering and bring effective treatment, thus showing the Communist Party is ordained by Marx-Heaven to rule foreigner. So while China can tentatively reopen, the barbaric savages abroad would be insane to, since they are totally more afflicted than we are! Praise Chairman Xi, Helm man of destiny!"
This is why I chew you out for not timelining this.
I don't know. If I had to wager a guess I would say "probably, marginally", most likely because even the most dishonest and thoroughly corrupt Western globalist medical hack in the West isn't claiming that Literally NOBODY has died of plain old Flu this season even as they shamelessly stripe mine most of those deaths to relabel as Coronavirus. Meaning that they still acknowledge Flu deaths are a separate thing, even if they have "mysteriously" decreased due to mislabeling them as WuFlu deaths (or WuFlu "Stealing" those deaths naturally).
So you PROBABLY have a small increase in ChiCom COVID deaths put on top of the bog standard "Flu Season + Other deaths."
Simple.
If my theory is correct and there is indeed a slight increase in overall deaths from WuFlu mingling with other deaths, then the provable harm is from the excess.
And if my theory ISN'T correct, the harm is the background statistical noise of more or less routine death. Still harm, but "within normal parameters."
Neither of which are as damaging as the mass hysteria or Swamp State usurpation we've seen gutting our economy and civic culture that were Also spurred by this thing (But of course, by your logic we could point to Swampy corruption and tyranny and economic sabotage going well before even Wuhan had Wuhan Flu and say "Well, what's the harm? It was already happening" while ignoring the intensification of it). But still worth noting.
No, I don't have access to more accurate statistics than you do, though I do know how to find what statistics we have acess to more easily.
The difference is I can interpret them better.
Because I both have some minimal medical experience, and because I'm not a credulous idiot.
Which is why you're caught screaming about "Why are China's death numbers so hard to believe?" and "These faked numbers are more accurate than those faked numbers? On what basis?"
Because apparently you've never read 1984 or understand how pervasive Commie book cooking is, much less how either side arrived at their numbers.
The wrong numbers of COVID deaths and infections in the US, UK, and other nations are based off of normal recording- along with "normal" mistakes like miscounting, double counting, or massaging the numbers to get them low- that are then skewed after the fact using number games, such as slapping normal Flu deaths as WuFlu deaths.
But the wrong numbers for COVID deaths and infections from the CCP have the "added bonus" of coming from a totalitarian dictatorship that is not shy about COMPLETELY INVENTING numbers from whole cloth and is not about to provide any evidence or external review whatsoever. And who are willing to do stuff like vanish people into literal incinerators in the same way that they lie about the US having the largest per capita prison population by pretending that Commie Party Laogai and secretive Blacksites don't exist.
That's the basis for why the West's faked numbers are more accurate than ChiCom faked numbers. As you'd know if you thought about it for five seconds.
Firstly: Argument from Ignorance is also a logical fallacy, and it amounts to almost everything you've done in this conversation
Secondly: You're confusing the Argument from Authority fallacy with assessing information gotten by and presented by "So-Called" Experts. Which one can then analyze.
For instance, this is why I am so confident dismissing the CCP numbers, which have a much, much higher probability of simply being invented from whole cloth than our own, in spite of both being wrong.
Put it simply: there's a qualitative difference between saying a Turkey is a Duck, and saying a Turkey is a Black Hole. Both are wrong, but the former is less wrong than the latter. And the latter indicates that someone isn't even looking at or knowledgeable of the actual information.
Except the Wuhan COVID research was almost certainly not Bioweapons research.
Firstly because it was the study of a naturally occurring disease, secondly because even in its current form its lethality is so low (and the CCP showed so little ability to control it, hence the staff infections Laowhy's video covered), and thirdly because Most Bio Research isn't Bioweapons Research.
For the same reason your average GMO isn't trying to create the next biological nuke. That stuff has other utilities than trying to come up with yet another rare white elephant doomsday weapon that is a niche at best.
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That plus the stats. Don't forget the stats!
Then where are the statistics proving this?
It also reduced deaths caused by the flu! Amazing!
But the flu isn't a danger that we can do anything about. China hasn't added any actual danger to living this year, since we've always had flu seasons, and they've always killed as many people as this year's flu season is killing.
Disagree? Feel free to point out the statistics showing this year's flu season (including the Wuhan flu) is meaningfully worse than other years.
My claim is that it is the flu. How could the flu be less dangerous than the flu?
My basis for concluding such is the fact that the Wuhan flu is harmless, and could never have been mistaken for something harmless.
What kind of master plan is it to spread around a harmless virus?
Far better and more effective to spread hysteria. Which is exactly what they've done. And there's your evidence.
Do you have any evidence at all that anyone, anywhere, had any reasonable basis at any time to think the Wuhan flu was dangerous?
But it didn't blow up in China. We can infer this from the fact that it hasn't blown up anywhere else. At all.
If you disagree, please point out the place where Wuhan flu deaths significatly outpaced normal flu deaths. Then we can use that data to interpolate China's deaths. All the data for every affected country indicates this is just another normal (maybe slightly worse, but we can't even conclude that because of gunshot wounds being counted as Wuhan flu deaths) flu season.
If China immediately told everyone "this virus is dangerous, we should stop all travel and try to prevent its spread", then countries would have stopped travel from China and there would be no reason to fear the virus having spread from China.
Unless they initially played "dumb" and allowed international travel, there would be no basis upon which to spread hysteria. And if there were no hysteria, China wouldn't have cover of hysteria to make the moves it's making in HK and India and the South China, etc.
And, of course, we must keep in mind the overarching fact: the Wuhan flu is harmless, just like every flu season.
Which country failed to implement an ounce of prevention, and is now wishing ruefully it had done so instead of having to implement a pound of cure?
No country, anywhere on earth, has experienced the Wuhan flu as anything worse than a regular flu season. The additional damage caused is ENTIRELY a result of overreaction.
If you disagree, feel free to post the country that was hit significantly harder by the Wuhan flu than that country gets hit by every year's flu season. I've asked several times, and you keep failing to provide this.
The virus didn't cause any damage that wouldn't have happened with this year's flu season, though. And this year's flu season wasn't caused by China. And it couldn't have been prevented.
The only thing the CCP has done is spread a pandemic of hysteria.
How could they sell an overreaction if they hadn't initially allowed travel abroad? If no one had travelled from Wuhan to spread the putative virus, what would we be overreacting to?
Fucking lead with this next time. Sheesh.
Wrong. The mass hysteria was in response to the half-assed lockdown of Wuhan, which had all the film and television cues for a serious pandemic. We saw China kneecap itself and wondered if they had a reason to do so. They didn't have a direct reason, since the Wuhan flu is harmless. So the only reason they did what they did was to spread panic.
But how could they cause us to panic if they had locked Wuhan down diligently? No one with the putative virus would be here to panic about.
How do we know the whistleblowers were put down for saying the Wuhan flu is a threat? They might have been saying "guys, this is weird, we're reacting like lunatics to a flu season." That message getting out would spoil the whole thing.
How else would "infected" individuals get all over the planet? If they hadn't, we'd have nothing to overreact about.
If China had diligently locked down Wuhan, we would have nothing to panic about. Since panic is the only risk here, and is also the only weaponized portion of the Wuhan flu episode, this reaction at this stage was necessary. Else panic couldn't be spread.
This is why I repeat the same question over and over. You haven't played through the chess game. If China did as you propose, they wouldn't have achieved their ends.
Harmless.
We'll never know this, because gunshot deaths are being counted as Wuhan flu deaths. Even if there's a slight bump in Wuhan flu deaths this year as compared to flus of years past, we'll never know if the Wuhan flu was actually worse.
We appear to have interpreted the same, though. The Wuhan flu is just another flu. How is that "better?"
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My complaint is that everyone expects China's numbers to be sky high. But this expectation assumes there is something to be dying of in the first place. There isn't, beyond a regular flu season. I take no issue with anyone calling the CPC liars, as they are that.
Neither number is accurate, and so both form a very poor basis from which to try and discern the reality. As does the assumption that there "must" be more Wuhan flu deaths than have been reported. Since the whole thing's a hoax, Wuhan flu deaths are universally over-reported. They should be 0 across the board (and the deaths properly attributed to gunshot wounds, the flu, etc.)
Yet we arrived at the same conclusion (that the Wuhan flu is just a flu)? Also, that isn't a logical fallacy, it (assuming it happened, which it didn't) is an incorrect apprehension of the facts. Once can have unimpeachable logic with incorrect facts (which isn't what I'm saying I have here).
You implied I'm not qualified to review the statistics, and you are, because you volunteer and assume I don't (I don't).
It was a naked appeal to authority.
Instead of drawing upon your vast experience as a volunteer, you should have referred to statistics. But those all agree with me, so I see why you didn't.
What the fuck? I suggest you go read up on the USSR's research into naturally occurring smallpox. When creating bioweapons, they don't start from scratch. They peruse nature's best hits, then try to remix and remaster.
The commies probably chose something related to the common cold for maximum spread, not realizing that the mechanism by which viruses spread universally neuters any severe effects of that virus. God probably had to make it that way or else civilization-ending pandemics would be a certainty.
I'm open to ideas as to the utility of a highly infectious novel virus!