They drew weapons on unarmed females who are not clearly posturing for a fight. They're absolutely being aggressive and arguing, but they're not indicating violent actions.
Drawing a weapon here is absolutely an escalation of force by any definition.
Retreated
Hardly retreating when they exited their vehicle to continue the ego fight.
Stayed calm
Drawing a weapon and participating in the screaming match is not what any logical individual would call, "calm."
Tried to leave
They exited their vehicle instead of driving off. They didn't try very hard to leave.
Defended themselves only after being menaced, threatened with violence, harassed with racial comments, falsely accused, and prevented from leaving.
Words != violence. You can't just draw a firearm because someone said mean things to you. You're going to get prosecuted and sued if you do this.
Furthermore, they were not, "prevented" from leaving. They were discouraged from leaving, however the logical action if they feared for their life was to drive through the idiots standing around their vehicle. They chose to stay when they exited their vehicle. Getting out of the vehicle's body of protection is the worst thing for them to do if they truly feared for their life/severe bodily harm, and only proves that it was an ego fight. This is clear as day and I promise you this is how it will be argued in court.
The Wuestenbergs demonstrated amazing restraint and poise.
The man did, however the woman clearly did not. The man tried to deescalate, avoid a shouting match, and leave. The woman let her ego get the best of her, by FAR. The only thing she did right was to get back in the car after they backed off, instead of trying to wait around for the police to show up. If she's let off the hook, this (combined with the fact that she's a woman (pussy pass) and pregnant) will be the only reasons she gets off from criminal and civil issues.
They handled their firearms per typical training protocols.
Not even fucking close. For starters, she's carrying without one in the chamber, which is a horrible idea for a multitude of reasons, but more importantly she's pointing the weapon at a target that she does not intend to immediately shoot. Anyone who has any self defense training knows to hold a low ready position until the threat becomes imminent, and at this range it's inadvisable to extend the weapon so far out. You want to hold the pistol close to your chest so it can not be easily taken away, unless you have ample distance between you and your target.
They definitely shouldn't be fired for this, and I don't think lawsuits are justified here as both parties are acting like morons. Civilly, there's some torts that could be involved here to save them from a verdict of, "liable" but they're almost certainly still going to have to go through the ordeals of court to get there. Criminally, the DA is clearly trying to make an example of them, so they're going to have some rough experiences there as well.
I personally don't think that we need the courts for this encounter, as there are no damages as a result. However, you're completely talking out of your ass with your comment here, and you are giving horrible advice. These people have massive legal trouble ahead of them that they could have avoided if they actually tried to deescalate the situation, and leave.
Edit: Downvote me if you want, but doing so without commenting as to why only proves that you are not knowledgeable, experienced, or informed as to this topic.
Yes, deport a /r/The_Donald member since ~7,000 subs because I make a valid argument in relation to our laws, legal system, and logical self defense. Solid plan.
I know. They should have just let them beat their white asses. After all, that white lady did bump into her...
We have no idea what happened to make this cool and collected lady pull a gun. But the camera bouncing around like that makes me think they were bum rushing the car. At what point is the pulling of the gun justified? How do you know they were unarmed? Because there was not a gunfight? Does it make a difference to you that the white lady is pregnant?
I know. They should have just let them beat their white asses. After all, that white lady did bump into her...
First of all, if they had violent intentions, don't you think they would've been swinging? It's not like they didn't have a shouting match for at least a few minutes. You're acting like they never got the chance to fight, when that's blatantly false.
And I'm not saying they don't have a right to defend themselves; I'm saying that there's nothing but words in this video. You can't fucking shoot someone over mean words, and I don't get why that's a hard concept for you.
We have no idea what happened to make this cool and collected lady pull a gun.
Actually we have a pretty fucking good idea, considering it's on video.
But the camera bouncing around like that makes me think they were bum rushing the car.
So you think the best response to someone attacking your car is to... get out of the car? Not, drive off like any reasonable person? Not even draw your weapon from within the car; You're saying that removing the only thing separating you from the other person is the best course of action for self perseverance? Could you explain your logic on that one to me?
At what point is the pulling of the gun justified?
It's pretty fucking simple and established law, with slight variances from state to state. You can use deadly force (example: A firearm) in self defense when a reasonable person has fear of death or severe bodily harm. Fat women screaming some insults at you is NOT justification for killing someone, no matter how stupid they are.
How do you know they were unarmed? Because there was not a gunfight?
A better question is what are their intentions. They had many opportunities to physically attack the white couple, but they didn't do anything but shout like spoiled and naive brats. That doesn't guarantee that they won't attack later, but that's beside the point. The white couple as self defenders should be looking do deescalate and evade conflicts. Leaving the only barrier between you and the attacking party is not what any logical individual would do if they are interested in self defense. This is clearly an ego battle, and any idiot can tell that. Absolutely anyone who knows even the most fundamental basics of self defense will tell you this.
The most valuable tool they have is their car, and they were able to enter it without any issue. If they truly felt threatened, their best course of action is to drive away. It's not a hard concept. It doesn't matter if they're standing in front of the car; Run them over. I promise you that action would be easier to defend in court rather than actively choosing to remove barriers of protection and willingly confront the threat when there is an option to leave.
It'd be different if they were threatening them. It'd be different if they were trying to swing at them. It'd be different if she drew before she got into the car for the first time. But that isn't the circumstance that we have, is it? She willingly had an ego battle, and there's no denying that.
Does it make a difference to you that the white lady is pregnant?
ONLY if she had drawn BEFORE entering the car, and I'll explain why (instead of just screaming, "nuh uh im right ur rong"). The shouting match here can be a pre attack indicator for violence, however this is highly circumstantial. As the incident moved towards the car, the distance between both parties became narrower. Now, if they were rapidly charging the pregnant lady, empty handed skills are the best course of action as it simply takes too long to draw a firearm, and it becomes an increased risk when they are in range to grab it. However, they didn't charge at her, but merely walked closer in an intimidating fashion. In order for her to enter her car, she has to position her body in such a way that puts her at an increased risk of a physical attack. If she reasonably felt threatened at that moment, it could be justifiable to draw as she enters the vehicle, and to keep the weapon drawn from within the protection of the car as they drive away.
You cannot tell me with a straight face that if you truly felt that your life was at risk from these people that you'd EXIT YOUR FUCKING VEHICLE TO CONTINUE SHOUTING AT THEM. This logic works both ways, too. The blacks in this video clearly don't believe that this woman is a racist, violent person who wants to kill all blacks, or they wouldn't have continued to shout at her as she pointed a weapon towards them. If you truly think your enemy wants you dead, you wouldn't be provoking them as they point a weapon towards you.
It's amazing to me as to how little you must understand about self defense and the related legislation to try to act as if I'm saying they should've let themselves get hurt here. You are ignorant of this topic (not an insult, I am stating things bluntly. Not meant to belittle you, not meant to be an attack on you, etc etc etc. I am speaking bluntly here.), and yet you still feel as if your opinion is valid. A non-doctor doesn't go around telling surgeons that they're doing their job wrong. A non-engineer doesn't go around telling engineers that their designs will/won't work. So why do you think that your uninformed opinion on self defense practice, legislation, etc is valid?
There are a lot of words here, you should sum up your statements better: I won’t read them all because a pregnant woman was threatened with bodily harm, car attacked and blocked from retreating. I’m on the jury where that lady pulled the trigger- I’d vote justifiable homicide.
I disagree big time. Individuals blocked them from being civil. For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. That is science redcoat. Too many down votes for me to read this shitty thread and your opening argument just leads me to believe I have already wasted too much time on my own post.
So, after you use ad hominem to attack and insult me and then I call you out on it, you delete your comment and decide you better at least try to make an argument? I'd be fine with that if you weren't still using ad hominem attacks (incorrect ones at that) to form your comment.
I'll humor you all the same.
I disagree big time. Individuals blocked them from being civil.
How did they block them from driving away? If they physically stood in front and behind the vehicle to attempt to, "block" them, that still does not justify leaving the vehicle's protection to continue engaging in an ego argument. I'll come back to this point later (though I already addressed it in my original comment, which I'm guessing you didn't read).
If you're saying that as violence increases, one cannot remain, "civil" in their defense, I reject both premises.
For the first premise: First of all, words != violence. These black women were shouting, and had many opportunities for physical violence, but never partook in the action. That doesn't mean that they couldn't have been threatening, or that this wasn't a pre attack indicator for escalated violence, but it does mean that they were at the time not violent. Without violence, there is no reason for the white couple to become, "uncivil."
For the second premise: One can defend themselves in any situation while remaining, "civil." It is not uncivil for a person to kill another in self defense. There are two definitions that you could use here for, "civil." The first, would relate to citizenship. It is absolutely American to use lethal force (when it is NECESSARY) in self defense. This should be abundantly clear by the entire history of our country, even if you were to ignore the fact that we are the only country in the world that recognizes a human's God given right to the details of the 2nd. The second definition would relate to societal politeness. It is still perfectly civil to defend yourself when doing so in a logical manner. In any self defense situation, there is a reasonable response to be had, often multiple responses can be valid, but there is always at least one response that is most reasonable. The best strategy (when available) is to deescalate and avoid trouble, but this is not always possible, and of course different circumstances are different. However, one can always remain civil and reasonable given proper knowledge and experience in regards to self defense.
For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. That is science redcoat.
Newton's Third Law of Motion is not applicable to psychological, legal, moral, or self defense topics. I will never understand how someone can know so little about something and act like an expert on it.
Also, could you please fuck off with the insults? It is clear to anyone reading this thread that I am trying to have a real discussion here, and your insults have no place in this.
Too many down votes for me to read this shitty thread and your opening argument just leads me to believe I have already wasted too much time on my own post.
Ah, so you admit to confirming my suspicions. You admit to having near total ignorance of my comment, and yet you still act as if you understand what I am saying. It's baffling as to how someone could be so arrogant as you - to think you understand what I am saying - to think that you understand who I am, what I am trying to do in this thread, what points I am making - without even reading my comment.
I'll suggest it to you once more: I implore you to take a hard look at your actions here. You're not behaving in a logical manner; You're behaving like a liberal.
Hmm, I write a long comment, breaking down each point that the original commenter made, participate in a good discussion, contribute valid points sourced from knowledge, experience, and facts of our legal system and self defense strategy, and you respond with a, "go fuck yourself because I don't have an argument."
Ya know I can't help but see the resemblence between you and an NPC in that response. I'm here trying to have a discussion, and hopefully prevent more people from ruining their lives via legal trouble, and you'd rather scream, "LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU" than consider the possibility that you are incorrect.
I implore you to take a hard look at your actions here. You're not behaving in a logical manner; You're behaving like a liberal.
I believe everyone has the God given right to carry, but I also believe that one has a moral duty (NOTE: NOT A LEGAL DUTY) to carry responsibly. She's clearly ignorant of laws and proper self defense training/knowledge based on her actions here, and that isn't how one carries responsibly. (Not that laws are always correct/just, but it is necessary to understand them to prevent/negate legal difficulties to the best of your ability without sacrificing safety)
It is very likely that she let her hormones get the best of her here, but that does not absolve her of her responsibility to obey the law (or, at least it shouldn't - Women have quite literally used hormones as a defense for murder on more than one occasion).
I think that discretion should be used here in terms of legal action, but clearly it isn't.
Wrong. I don't know why people here are defending this stupid ass white trash couple. You don't pull a gun over an argument. This isn't the fucking wild west. Her husband put her in the car and her stupid ass rolled down the window to talk more shit. You want to get in an argument at the grocery store over a parking spot or some shit and have it turn into a gun fight? That's what people here are advocating.
Considering the black bitches behavior and in light of all that is going on I’d say a pregnant women has every right to defend herself and her unborn child.
And now she's looking at possible jail time if a jury decides it doesn't like her, and they've lost their main source of income. Given that Michigan's an at-will state that job's gone with the wind. Great job defending herself, 10/10.
Actions have consequences, people need to think before making themselves into another moment of internet drama.
Someone has gone to too many conflict resolution classes. The pair blocking and harassing the couple were no better than common highwayman assailing innocent travelers.
The aggressors need some mental health assistance instead of a handout big enough to let them spend $30 at Chipotle. I won't go to a Waffle House after dark just for the same reason these folks were accosted.
Appreciate your concealed carry perspective, but the ladies = absolutely textbook CRYBULLIES. “that’s racist, you’re racist” - while verbally and physically forcing the confrontation? 🙄 puh-LEASE
You saw the car couple try to deescalate multiple times, trying to leave, right? The woman in the car with the presence of mind to say "I'm not a racist, you can't just go around calling every white person a fucking racist, I like all people."
CC protocols and skin color aside, if you have watched the video, then you know which party were acting like aggressive assholes.
(Show me some video of the car couple hip-checking the “ladies“ kids or grandmother into the paper towel shelves and i’ll revise my opinion accordingly :-)
I agree with you. This is the Donald so I will speak frankly. Certain black people are masters at this kind of victim behavior. There is no amount of logical reasoning or deescalation you can do once they feel slighted. The only option at that point is to calmly walk away. There's nothing to prove, there's no ground to hold. Unless of course you want to literally kill a woman over some minor altercation, which is what a lot of people here are advocating. Everyone knows about the people that try to get close to your vehicle and slap it to act like they're hit. You going to pull a gun on them? You know how often altercations happen like this at grocery stores and parking lots, etc?
Listen to yourself. You're a fool. These downvotes are hilarious. A couple of you were even salty enough to go through my entire post history mass downvoting everything lol. You've all been whipped into a hate frenzy by the MSM at the same time you laugh at others for being brainwashed. Most people here were so adamant about this case so I REWATCHED the full video to make sure I didn't miss anything. I hope none of you hot headed fools ever get your CCW. If you do, the instructor will tell you the exact same thing I am about deescalation. You can tell the game warden how big of a cuck he is at that point
I hope 4 black people stop you in public with their cellphone cameras and start claiming you are racists and proceed to accost you and escalate their attack every time you try to disengage. I hope they're snot-nosed 14-year-olds too so you look like an even bigger monster on social media.
I want to see the video of your reaction, and you have a flashback to this couple's situation and know the fact that you are going to jail. And when it happens, you better not try and defend yourself or your dignity. You better take it, like you certainly think everyone else should.
edit: I don't give a shit about your post history.
I agree with you, but in this case the lady clearly didn't pick a fight. The only reason she got back out of the car was because they were prevented from leaving.
They're in a vehicle, which offers protection and mobility. Leaving the vehicle is not logical if someone fears for their life. Just drive through them. That's arguably less force than pulling the weapon, and it is ABSOLUTELY safer/easier to defend in court than LEAVING THE VEHICLE to pull a firearm over fucking WORDS.
It might be different if they were actually being violent, or posturing for immediate violence, but the black women here are just being loud women. They're not indicating violence.
The Wuestenberg’s
They drew weapons on unarmed females who are not clearly posturing for a fight. They're absolutely being aggressive and arguing, but they're not indicating violent actions.
Drawing a weapon here is absolutely an escalation of force by any definition.
Hardly retreating when they exited their vehicle to continue the ego fight.
Drawing a weapon and participating in the screaming match is not what any logical individual would call, "calm."
They exited their vehicle instead of driving off. They didn't try very hard to leave.
Words != violence. You can't just draw a firearm because someone said mean things to you. You're going to get prosecuted and sued if you do this.
Furthermore, they were not, "prevented" from leaving. They were discouraged from leaving, however the logical action if they feared for their life was to drive through the idiots standing around their vehicle. They chose to stay when they exited their vehicle. Getting out of the vehicle's body of protection is the worst thing for them to do if they truly feared for their life/severe bodily harm, and only proves that it was an ego fight. This is clear as day and I promise you this is how it will be argued in court.
The man did, however the woman clearly did not. The man tried to deescalate, avoid a shouting match, and leave. The woman let her ego get the best of her, by FAR. The only thing she did right was to get back in the car after they backed off, instead of trying to wait around for the police to show up. If she's let off the hook, this (combined with the fact that she's a woman (pussy pass) and pregnant) will be the only reasons she gets off from criminal and civil issues.
Not even fucking close. For starters, she's carrying without one in the chamber, which is a horrible idea for a multitude of reasons, but more importantly she's pointing the weapon at a target that she does not intend to immediately shoot. Anyone who has any self defense training knows to hold a low ready position until the threat becomes imminent, and at this range it's inadvisable to extend the weapon so far out. You want to hold the pistol close to your chest so it can not be easily taken away, unless you have ample distance between you and your target.
They definitely shouldn't be fired for this, and I don't think lawsuits are justified here as both parties are acting like morons. Civilly, there's some torts that could be involved here to save them from a verdict of, "liable" but they're almost certainly still going to have to go through the ordeals of court to get there. Criminally, the DA is clearly trying to make an example of them, so they're going to have some rough experiences there as well.
I personally don't think that we need the courts for this encounter, as there are no damages as a result. However, you're completely talking out of your ass with your comment here, and you are giving horrible advice. These people have massive legal trouble ahead of them that they could have avoided if they actually tried to deescalate the situation, and leave.
Edit: Downvote me if you want, but doing so without commenting as to why only proves that you are not knowledgeable, experienced, or informed as to this topic.
Deport this fucking retard folks.
Yes, deport a /r/The_Donald member since ~7,000 subs because I make a valid argument in relation to our laws, legal system, and logical self defense. Solid plan.
I know. They should have just let them beat their white asses. After all, that white lady did bump into her...
We have no idea what happened to make this cool and collected lady pull a gun. But the camera bouncing around like that makes me think they were bum rushing the car. At what point is the pulling of the gun justified? How do you know they were unarmed? Because there was not a gunfight? Does it make a difference to you that the white lady is pregnant?
First of all, if they had violent intentions, don't you think they would've been swinging? It's not like they didn't have a shouting match for at least a few minutes. You're acting like they never got the chance to fight, when that's blatantly false.
And I'm not saying they don't have a right to defend themselves; I'm saying that there's nothing but words in this video. You can't fucking shoot someone over mean words, and I don't get why that's a hard concept for you.
Actually we have a pretty fucking good idea, considering it's on video.
So you think the best response to someone attacking your car is to... get out of the car? Not, drive off like any reasonable person? Not even draw your weapon from within the car; You're saying that removing the only thing separating you from the other person is the best course of action for self perseverance? Could you explain your logic on that one to me?
It's pretty fucking simple and established law, with slight variances from state to state. You can use deadly force (example: A firearm) in self defense when a reasonable person has fear of death or severe bodily harm. Fat women screaming some insults at you is NOT justification for killing someone, no matter how stupid they are.
A better question is what are their intentions. They had many opportunities to physically attack the white couple, but they didn't do anything but shout like spoiled and naive brats. That doesn't guarantee that they won't attack later, but that's beside the point. The white couple as self defenders should be looking do deescalate and evade conflicts. Leaving the only barrier between you and the attacking party is not what any logical individual would do if they are interested in self defense. This is clearly an ego battle, and any idiot can tell that. Absolutely anyone who knows even the most fundamental basics of self defense will tell you this.
The most valuable tool they have is their car, and they were able to enter it without any issue. If they truly felt threatened, their best course of action is to drive away. It's not a hard concept. It doesn't matter if they're standing in front of the car; Run them over. I promise you that action would be easier to defend in court rather than actively choosing to remove barriers of protection and willingly confront the threat when there is an option to leave.
It'd be different if they were threatening them. It'd be different if they were trying to swing at them. It'd be different if she drew before she got into the car for the first time. But that isn't the circumstance that we have, is it? She willingly had an ego battle, and there's no denying that.
ONLY if she had drawn BEFORE entering the car, and I'll explain why (instead of just screaming, "nuh uh im right ur rong"). The shouting match here can be a pre attack indicator for violence, however this is highly circumstantial. As the incident moved towards the car, the distance between both parties became narrower. Now, if they were rapidly charging the pregnant lady, empty handed skills are the best course of action as it simply takes too long to draw a firearm, and it becomes an increased risk when they are in range to grab it. However, they didn't charge at her, but merely walked closer in an intimidating fashion. In order for her to enter her car, she has to position her body in such a way that puts her at an increased risk of a physical attack. If she reasonably felt threatened at that moment, it could be justifiable to draw as she enters the vehicle, and to keep the weapon drawn from within the protection of the car as they drive away.
You cannot tell me with a straight face that if you truly felt that your life was at risk from these people that you'd EXIT YOUR FUCKING VEHICLE TO CONTINUE SHOUTING AT THEM. This logic works both ways, too. The blacks in this video clearly don't believe that this woman is a racist, violent person who wants to kill all blacks, or they wouldn't have continued to shout at her as she pointed a weapon towards them. If you truly think your enemy wants you dead, you wouldn't be provoking them as they point a weapon towards you.
It's amazing to me as to how little you must understand about self defense and the related legislation to try to act as if I'm saying they should've let themselves get hurt here. You are ignorant of this topic (not an insult, I am stating things bluntly. Not meant to belittle you, not meant to be an attack on you, etc etc etc. I am speaking bluntly here.), and yet you still feel as if your opinion is valid. A non-doctor doesn't go around telling surgeons that they're doing their job wrong. A non-engineer doesn't go around telling engineers that their designs will/won't work. So why do you think that your uninformed opinion on self defense practice, legislation, etc is valid?
There are a lot of words here, you should sum up your statements better: I won’t read them all because a pregnant woman was threatened with bodily harm, car attacked and blocked from retreating. I’m on the jury where that lady pulled the trigger- I’d vote justifiable homicide.
I disagree big time. Individuals blocked them from being civil. For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. That is science redcoat. Too many down votes for me to read this shitty thread and your opening argument just leads me to believe I have already wasted too much time on my own post.
So, after you use ad hominem to attack and insult me and then I call you out on it, you delete your comment and decide you better at least try to make an argument? I'd be fine with that if you weren't still using ad hominem attacks (incorrect ones at that) to form your comment.
I'll humor you all the same.
How did they block them from driving away? If they physically stood in front and behind the vehicle to attempt to, "block" them, that still does not justify leaving the vehicle's protection to continue engaging in an ego argument. I'll come back to this point later (though I already addressed it in my original comment, which I'm guessing you didn't read).
If you're saying that as violence increases, one cannot remain, "civil" in their defense, I reject both premises.
For the first premise: First of all, words != violence. These black women were shouting, and had many opportunities for physical violence, but never partook in the action. That doesn't mean that they couldn't have been threatening, or that this wasn't a pre attack indicator for escalated violence, but it does mean that they were at the time not violent. Without violence, there is no reason for the white couple to become, "uncivil."
For the second premise: One can defend themselves in any situation while remaining, "civil." It is not uncivil for a person to kill another in self defense. There are two definitions that you could use here for, "civil." The first, would relate to citizenship. It is absolutely American to use lethal force (when it is NECESSARY) in self defense. This should be abundantly clear by the entire history of our country, even if you were to ignore the fact that we are the only country in the world that recognizes a human's God given right to the details of the 2nd. The second definition would relate to societal politeness. It is still perfectly civil to defend yourself when doing so in a logical manner. In any self defense situation, there is a reasonable response to be had, often multiple responses can be valid, but there is always at least one response that is most reasonable. The best strategy (when available) is to deescalate and avoid trouble, but this is not always possible, and of course different circumstances are different. However, one can always remain civil and reasonable given proper knowledge and experience in regards to self defense.
Newton's Third Law of Motion is not applicable to psychological, legal, moral, or self defense topics. I will never understand how someone can know so little about something and act like an expert on it.
Also, could you please fuck off with the insults? It is clear to anyone reading this thread that I am trying to have a real discussion here, and your insults have no place in this.
Ah, so you admit to confirming my suspicions. You admit to having near total ignorance of my comment, and yet you still act as if you understand what I am saying. It's baffling as to how someone could be so arrogant as you - to think you understand what I am saying - to think that you understand who I am, what I am trying to do in this thread, what points I am making - without even reading my comment.
I'll suggest it to you once more: I implore you to take a hard look at your actions here. You're not behaving in a logical manner; You're behaving like a liberal.
Hmm, I write a long comment, breaking down each point that the original commenter made, participate in a good discussion, contribute valid points sourced from knowledge, experience, and facts of our legal system and self defense strategy, and you respond with a, "go fuck yourself because I don't have an argument."
Ya know I can't help but see the resemblence between you and an NPC in that response. I'm here trying to have a discussion, and hopefully prevent more people from ruining their lives via legal trouble, and you'd rather scream, "LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU" than consider the possibility that you are incorrect.
I implore you to take a hard look at your actions here. You're not behaving in a logical manner; You're behaving like a liberal.
He should have never allowed her to carry, she should have never carried. She wasn't in fear of her life, truly.
I feel very bad for them, but those fat loudmouths were not a mortal threat.
And she wasn't wearing her mask
I believe everyone has the God given right to carry, but I also believe that one has a moral duty (NOTE: NOT A LEGAL DUTY) to carry responsibly. She's clearly ignorant of laws and proper self defense training/knowledge based on her actions here, and that isn't how one carries responsibly. (Not that laws are always correct/just, but it is necessary to understand them to prevent/negate legal difficulties to the best of your ability without sacrificing safety)
It is very likely that she let her hormones get the best of her here, but that does not absolve her of her responsibility to obey the law (or, at least it shouldn't - Women have quite literally used hormones as a defense for murder on more than one occasion).
I think that discretion should be used here in terms of legal action, but clearly it isn't.
"It is very likely that she let her hormones get the best of her here"
I was thinking of this as well, and it might be something to defend her actions and minimize her penalty. "mama bear", my GF called it.
Those fat slob scumbags kept pushing.
Wrong. I don't know why people here are defending this stupid ass white trash couple. You don't pull a gun over an argument. This isn't the fucking wild west. Her husband put her in the car and her stupid ass rolled down the window to talk more shit. You want to get in an argument at the grocery store over a parking spot or some shit and have it turn into a gun fight? That's what people here are advocating.
Considering the black bitches behavior and in light of all that is going on I’d say a pregnant women has every right to defend herself and her unborn child.
And now she's looking at possible jail time if a jury decides it doesn't like her, and they've lost their main source of income. Given that Michigan's an at-will state that job's gone with the wind. Great job defending herself, 10/10.
Actions have consequences, people need to think before making themselves into another moment of internet drama.
Okay so when they are very violent, block their way and bang on their car it's not enough for self defense. What is then?
When they break a window? When they hurt someone? Or when someone starts bleeding?
I have no idea why you are being downvoted, you are right this was stupid as fuck
Someone has gone to too many conflict resolution classes. The pair blocking and harassing the couple were no better than common highwayman assailing innocent travelers.
The aggressors need some mental health assistance instead of a handout big enough to let them spend $30 at Chipotle. I won't go to a Waffle House after dark just for the same reason these folks were accosted.
Appreciate your concealed carry perspective, but the ladies = absolutely textbook CRYBULLIES. “that’s racist, you’re racist” - while verbally and physically forcing the confrontation? 🙄 puh-LEASE
You saw the car couple try to deescalate multiple times, trying to leave, right? The woman in the car with the presence of mind to say "I'm not a racist, you can't just go around calling every white person a fucking racist, I like all people."
CC protocols and skin color aside, if you have watched the video, then you know which party were acting like aggressive assholes.
(Show me some video of the car couple hip-checking the “ladies“ kids or grandmother into the paper towel shelves and i’ll revise my opinion accordingly :-)
I agree with you. This is the Donald so I will speak frankly. Certain black people are masters at this kind of victim behavior. There is no amount of logical reasoning or deescalation you can do once they feel slighted. The only option at that point is to calmly walk away. There's nothing to prove, there's no ground to hold. Unless of course you want to literally kill a woman over some minor altercation, which is what a lot of people here are advocating. Everyone knows about the people that try to get close to your vehicle and slap it to act like they're hit. You going to pull a gun on them? You know how often altercations happen like this at grocery stores and parking lots, etc?
Agree 100%
Listen to yourself. You're a fool. These downvotes are hilarious. A couple of you were even salty enough to go through my entire post history mass downvoting everything lol. You've all been whipped into a hate frenzy by the MSM at the same time you laugh at others for being brainwashed. Most people here were so adamant about this case so I REWATCHED the full video to make sure I didn't miss anything. I hope none of you hot headed fools ever get your CCW. If you do, the instructor will tell you the exact same thing I am about deescalation. You can tell the game warden how big of a cuck he is at that point
I hope 4 black people stop you in public with their cellphone cameras and start claiming you are racists and proceed to accost you and escalate their attack every time you try to disengage. I hope they're snot-nosed 14-year-olds too so you look like an even bigger monster on social media.
I want to see the video of your reaction, and you have a flashback to this couple's situation and know the fact that you are going to jail. And when it happens, you better not try and defend yourself or your dignity. You better take it, like you certainly think everyone else should.
edit: I don't give a shit about your post history.
Yeah bad look for us for sure
I don’t know how many more times this needs to be said but DO NOT ENGAGE WITH THESE PEOPLE!! You literally can’t win
Also anyone who thinks we win this culture war by winning fights in parking lots is an idiot
I agree with you, but in this case the lady clearly didn't pick a fight. The only reason she got back out of the car was because they were prevented from leaving.
They're in a vehicle, which offers protection and mobility. Leaving the vehicle is not logical if someone fears for their life. Just drive through them. That's arguably less force than pulling the weapon, and it is ABSOLUTELY safer/easier to defend in court than LEAVING THE VEHICLE to pull a firearm over fucking WORDS.
It might be different if they were actually being violent, or posturing for immediate violence, but the black women here are just being loud women. They're not indicating violence.