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aparition42 -3 points ago +2 / -5

You're just espousing opinions as fact. What's considered the "best" music by the most pale-skinned people is crap like Justin Bieber.

To say that all music from the majority of the entire continent of Europe over the course of several hundred years represents a singular culture is just a very pompous, faux-intellectual way of saying "all white people are the same".

Many notable composers of orchestral music never heard Beethoven. It wasn't like today when a single artist can easily be heard by the entire world. Many works have had to be altered from their original forms because different areas and eras didn't even use the same temperament much less the same instrumentation and layout. Modern orchestral music has been homogenized for convenience giving the false impression of greater similarity than actually existed in the original works.

We're talking about thousands of disparate groups that didn't speak the same languages, practice the same religions, and were often at war with one another. To call all of that one "European culture" erases history and cultures rather than preserves them.

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Indefatigable_Winner 1 point ago +1 / -0

Name ONE notable composer of orchestral music after Beethoven who had never heard of him. You can’t.

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aparition42 1 point ago +1 / -0

Paganini, Rossini, Donizetti...

You find me proof they were musically influenced by Beethoven if you honestly care.

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Indefatigable_Winner 1 point ago +1 / -0

I said that had heard of him in response to your saying the same. Paganini and Beethoven apparently had a falling out over something. Rossini wanted to meet Beethoven and after meeting him, Beethoven complemented his opera buffa abilities and recommended he stick with that. Donezetti was active in Italy and later gained fame across Europe, traveling all around the region. Much of this was at the same time as Beethoven. While I cannot prove that they met, it is almost inconceivable that Donezetti hadn’t heard of Beethoven.

Furthermore, your criteria was for an orchestral composer IIRC. Each of the composers you chose were not known for this. Of course each did use the orchestra, but their use was as an accompanying element to highlight either solo works or operas. Yeah, yeah, I know they wrote small pieces for orchestra alone, but those were not their primary focus. Additionally, Beethoven was not an opera composer other than Fidelio.