I'm gonna do a quick mini-rant. Used to live in a medium-sized southern city. I worked 40-50 hours construction in the summer in residential houses before the AC was in the house. Trimming out the whole house and hardware. 1 or 2 a day, sometimes 6 days a week. Developed a foot fungus because of the sweat.
Started doing DoorDash and Grubhub delivery apps for about 15-30 hours a week on top of that for extra money. I could pull in about 18 an hour pre-taxes. Paychecks were nice.
I'd bust my ass doing trim with no AC, then go work the apps for 3-5 hours a night. It hit me one night while I was delivering to the damn projects two blocks away from my expensive ass apartment. Smelling weed everywhere. Nobody's working because you can smell weed at literally any time of day. 11 AM, 3 PM, midnight. Weed. I deliver to these projects on the first of the month. Answering the door with beers and weed smoke. No tip. I'm busting my ass and my hard work if supplementing their lives. They live in a destination city with expensive ass houses and apartments everywhere. They don't contribute. They live off the working man like leeches. And they don't even give me a dollar tip of my own money back.
I still get pissed thinking about it, obviously. Didn't really have to work that much at the time but two paychecks is sweet. Now I'm making much more so my side work nowadays is not as common but higher paying. I'm gonna go drink a beer.
I'd be fine with ditching both time and a half with payroll taxes. Limiting most people to 40 hours a week is bogus. How much time you spend and how much you get paid for it is between you and your employer.
Of course it does. Work harder and pay more. Someone has to pay for the leeches of society. It’s by the politician design. Make more pay more, Trump needs to push flat tax next term.
I work for the State of NY. One paycheck I worked 9 hours of OT, the next paycheck I had 27 hours of OT.
9 hour of OT paycheck was $1,105 after benefits and retirement taken out. 27 hour of OT paycheck was $1,380 after taxes, benefits, and retirement. I felt like an idiot, had I known I'd only make $200-300 more for two times the amount of OT, I'd have never worked that much to begin with.
This isn't completely accurate. When you make more the calculations assume you moved up a pay bracket as if you would always make that much on a paycheck and withhold a higher percentage. You tax liability will remain the same and you will likely get a larger refund at the end of the year because that assumption meant they took too much out in taxes.
If you work 20 hours of OT every single week then you are simply being taxed at the progressive rate of a person in the next tax bracket pays.
If you only work OT a few weeks of the year then eat it the fuck up because those weeks where the accounting believes you are being paid a high salary will eventually return when filing taxes.
The "diminished" pay is just the effects of a progressive tax system. You get paid a lot so they take more.
Self employed here. Here in Florida I had to pay $136 just to say that nothing changed my business in the last year, my uncle has been in business whole life responded to my question about it like this,: you're a business owner so people assume you have money so they think they can take it from you
Styxhexenhammer666 bitches about that all the time. I think most people who have a wage or salary job have no idea that Americans are punished for being self-employed in the USA.
Remember we're talking about the land of hard work and the American dream lol
We need real fixing for small businesses. They can and should be the lifeblood of this country. And none of that muh minority owned or muh woman owned bullshit. Just tax breaks and get out of the way.
The oligarchs that started running the USA 100 years ago (Carnegie, Rockefeller and JP Morgan etc.) didn't want any future competitors. They use burdensome regulations crafted by politicians in their pockets in order to stave off competition...
Yeah, I've seen some of those interviews too. Styx is a great interviewer. Wish he'd do more! Loved his chat with Shiva Ayyadurai, the real Indian, who ran against Elizabeth Warren, the fake Indian, in 2018.
Yeah but we’ve been saying that for years and it hasn’t happened. “When you get a job and look at your paystub, then you’ll be pissed about how much the govt steals from you.” In reality, they’re just complacent accepting it, or don’t even bother to look, just cash the check. I actually know people who intentionally have as much as possible deducted from their paychecks because their self aware of their own financial mismanagement.
Oh I agree, I’m just not very optimistic than many people will even notice it until it’s taken away, so hopefully that opens a lot of eyes. I am BEYOND happy about this, being self employed, I guess I’ll be saving over 15% of every dollar for a while and all my employees are about to get nearly an 8% raise. Stuff like that can jump start an economy so quickly. How could anyone be opposed to this when millions were laid off for no reason other than a hoax. Why would the Democrats block this? Because they don’t care about the working man, they care more about the jobless Antifa rioters who pays zilch in taxes, no other explanation as to why they’d be against this considering the circumstances imposed by government overreach.
And they see it as a percentage of money not time. Think about it. Say your average tax is 20%, that means 1 out of every 5 days you work for free for the government. It’s like communism-lite.
Can’t legislate just for the stupidest among us. Employers that see a benefit can point it out to their employees and dispense some red pills here and there. Can’t stop trying just cause the populace has been dumbed down.
Legally, he can only do it for 6 months during emergencies. Traditionally congress has this power. It’s an action limited specifically to address emergencies, not making permanent changes.
Technically he can suspend it for 6 months then once he is re-elected he can forgive the repayment. That’s probably his plan. Legally, it would be challenged in the courts to do it more than once and so it probably isn’t worth it. Just use it and get out instead of abusing it and wasting every one’s time
Genius idea. He can use that as leverage going up to election day. Every working class american will now have their vote representing a direct financial interest. If you vote for trump, you get to keep all that money you would have normally paid in taxes. For normies this will cut deep because they all will ask why their paycheck is higher and once they're told that they have to repay the money if Trump loses.....they won't vote for Biden. Money talks folks.
The left has all these idiots clamoring to tax the wealthy more so much that they forgot that they could just vote to tax themselves less. Of course that hasn't been a real option in a long while due to RINOs, but now they'll get a taste.
If the Fed wants to keep churning out all this BS funny money and pretend MMT is real, then why the hell shouldn't Trump take advantage of it while he can?
The law is pretty clear. Roberts would have a hard time defending such a dumb position. Heck, you might even get a liberal to vote for its defense. Happens
Unless the entrenched political establishment publicly admits there is no emergency and no justification for mail in ballots.
Which dovetails right into what another commenters pointed out, that this sets up a situation where the normie voter knows that if they don't Trump that they can kiss that tax cut good bye, and might even have to repay it.
I paid over $4200 last year to the IRS. Worst was when I owed over $8k.
All because my stocks did well, I sold them, and lived off of them until I could find a job. The fact I was living off of investments instead of taking fucking welfare cost me money.
Clearly, the "safety net" is not for those of us who keep their shit together.
The "welfare state" was actually started by a German politican most people today consider "conservative" as a way of staving power shifting to commies and their related dumbasses. He outright stated it was a means of buying votes.
Obviously I was half-serious. Lots of great things came out of Germany and Austria and whatever we call them now (those names didn't exist for most of history).
But those nuts went from being rather caveman like to being philosophers and musicians in a very short amount of time, and that is...concerning. I blame aliens.
Only thing it missed was the Frankfurt School of Thought which founded cultural marxism and glassed over dominating the EU to flood the region with rapefugees under threat of economic destruction.
Chancellor Otto von Bismarck really hated the Communists, his old age pensioner fund was the only viable success out of his attempts to subvert the Marxists.
The Founders really are rolling in their graves. And don’t get me started on PROPERTY tax. Do you own it? Or just rent it from the government? Because they can evict you if you don’t/can’t pay property tax.
Yeah, I'm not really in the mood to take a loan out of my own money just to pay it back. Maybe it'll earn a little interest in my savings account so I can make a few cents for storing my own money for later disgorgement to the IRS.
He’s referring to the possbility that the payroll taxes will have to be paid back to the government, which basically becomes a loan at 0%. The rest of his comment is rhetoric about the absurdity of savings interest.
It makes my butthole hurt for sure. Uncle Sam doesn’t use lube.
Thank god I live in a state with no state income tax and not some shithole place like California that would charge me another 13.5% for the privilege of getting cucked by Newsom
This just got me thinking. If my stocks hit big and I want to sell, can I move to a state that has no income tax live there for 6+ months then sell? I totally forgot about state taxes, those MFs.
I’m glad that this type of bitter comment gets crushed here at TD where it would be hugely upvoted at cuck reddit. Success should be celebrated and emulated
Sometimes I wonder why the federal government couldn't lower taxes by an enourmous amount, and then produce something within the government that we would want to buy as consumers. You know, like an actual business, instead of just taking it. If you want more money, trade me something for it.
America's issue is its multilayer tax system. I think if we did a 10% state, 10% federal, we'd be in a lot better shape. This of course requires the government to reign in spending so it's a pipe dream.
How the fuck can corrupt assholes like Obama send $300-500 billion in unmarked bills to Iran in the middle of the night if he's not confiscating a significant portion of the US economy?
Of course we need to raise taxes to provide for the common defense. That could be raised from import taxes. Sales taxes. The government should have NO CLUE what your income is and NO INTEREST in it either.
I'm not sure on the statistics for sales taxes, so I'm unable to say if that'd be more profitable than income. I agree with you that on a philosophical level income taxes are less moral. I do believe in a tax on luxury items such as alcohol and very unhealthy foods though. Only makes sense because people who buy those things inevitably cost the medical system more. I'd be willing to remove that if government was completely out of Healthcare though. Outside monopoly busting of course. Besides national defense I don't see a whole lot the federal government should be doing.
Well if you decide to open a business in California and be taxed to death, that was your mistake.
It would lead to a change in the political atmosphere. Most Dem controlled states won't be able to function if businesses decide to move out. Only thing left to blame would be the state and the idiots who run it.
You're right, taxes are a necessary evil. We all need to pitch in for the things that make this country great. The issue is that working people have been shouldering the majority of the burden for too long. Another problem is that a lot of our money is being wasted on crap that doesn't help us. Billions of taxpayer dollars go to foreign governments and politicians' "pet projects". Suspending the payroll tax will provide workers some relief in these tough times and force congress to FINALLY balance the budget by cutting unnecessary spending and eliminating loopholes for the rich and well connected.
I live in the People's Republic of Illinois so any chance I get to screech about taxes I screech loud and proud. I pray that a day will come when we can all come together to make real reforms and compromises. In the mean time I'll take any tax break I can get. This is just a band-aid on top of an infected gangrenous wound.
Commifornia. They take a huge chunk of my paycheck. I wouldn't be as salty if I knew the funds were getting spent correctly, but obviously these crooks are skimming off the top and disappearing funds all the time.
Tariffs, customs, excise taxes, etc. That’s what we did before the 16th Amendment was ratified to authorize theft by the government, anyway. And maybe the government can finally learn how to get rid of waste and live within its means.
That’s exactly right. So they stop living above their means and budget the money they have. As government was meant to be. Not a super spy, nanny state, police state, or welfare state. A government that rules over each of the United States. States makes more of the decisions for their people. If you live in a shitty state, you can move to a new one.
If we collect only tariffs, it will be enough to maintain our military? You mentioned only income tax. What about property tax, sales tax, and I’m pretty sire there’s a multitude of other taxes I haven’t even heard about.
Don’t be an idiot. 1) You don’t have to personally build the freeway- your community can collectively hire an independent company 2) the government is fucking horrible at getting bids and doing construction work because they’re corrupt. You asked a question and I answered it.
You want free shit, from the sounds of it. This has nothing to do with taxes and everything to do with freedom and self reliance. You won’t HAVE to pay for a road if you don’t want to, or a roof over your head or any other luxury in a free world.
You scoff so readily at a system that worked fine in this country for hundreds of years before a forced tax, yet you fail to recognize how horrible our current system is. Look at Hawaii- 20 years and 20 BILLION dollars to build a RAIL. A RAIL in a 40 mile long ISLAND. Think about that. Now all the foundation work and pillars erected are already starting to crack and crumble. It’s a disaster and YOUR tax money is paying for it.
Would you build a RAIL on an island measuring 40 miles across if you had control of where your money went? Think before you react.
Well our government was set up because there needed to be something in place to represent us as a people. We need a military, infrastructure, and a court to make sure people aren't fucking each other over.
That being said, over the course of our history, being a congressman or president went from doing it as a part time gig, to it being a full fledged job with a 6 figure income and benefits for life.
If we somehow get term limits into the system, it would allow us to cut some of the fat that has grown in our government and it would be easier to cut unnecessary taxes and spending.
No one should be a career politician. No one should hold an elected office until death. It's a bullshit trend that needs to stop.
Taxes over the laffer limit means you can have your cake and eat it at the same time, less taxes with higher total revenues. Regan/Bush/Trump have all done it
That also means your savings are evaporated into nothing. Responsible people who carry no debt and pay their bills on time are the ones who get shafted. You really want to give government that much economic power over you?
I strongly suggest you read more about founding fathers like Thomas Jefferson to get where I am coming from here.
The dollar is only the default currency because the military industrial complex will bomb or start revolutions in countries that oppose the fiat dollar hegemony.
Return to the gold standard and keep the spending by politicians in check!
Nah, sorry. This is stupid. Our current economy could not be maintained with the gold standard and we would dramatically reduce the rate of innovation. If you like the gold standard, just keep your savings in gold.
Yes, that's right our "economy" is a joke. Going back to a gold standard would introduce a shock in the economy that would kill malinvestments such as Tesla motors, a company that wouldn't have been able to get off of the ground without government subsidies.
Our economy since 1913 (when the Federal Reserve Act was passed) is designed for wealthy insiders (big bankers, corporate socialists like the Koch Bros etc.) to profit off of the newly printed money first. People like you or I see those dollars last once inflation is built-in.
Just read "End the Fed" by Ron Paul and he can explain the arguments a hell of a lot better than I can. You cannot escape basic economics. If you don't have the money to afford something, printing more money WILL NOT MAKE YOU RICHER. Think, bro.
Even if you hold your savings in gold, you're still required to pay your taxes in fiat dollars. Just because you buy gold doesn't mean you escape our ponzi economic system.
You're absolutely right that inflation is going to be high.
But technically, I think, it's the private bank called the Federal Reserve which "prints" money out of thin air... and then loans it to the government, with interest. Win for the bankers.
Disagree. The Federal reserve will print money loan it back to the government at an interest rate and then we will have to pay for that interest rate back with higher taxes.
It's only meant to help liquidity for those who have been impacted by the democrats intentionally tanking the economy, forcing unemployment, diminishing freedoms, and ruining the lives of small business owners in an election year in order to make the president look bad with the lives of Middle America as the collateral cannon fodder using a common cold virus as an excuse to overreach their authority and suspend our constitutional rights.
To make the average person realize just how much money they lose to taxes? Thus causing them to react violently against all Democrat plans to add back in more taxes.
If your spouse is on unemployment and shit is really tight, a tax deferral could actually be pretty helpful if you're the main income of the household. You would probably want to adjust your withholding for next year though to offset what your making if it is only a deferral.
If that is the case, you'd be better off not adjusting any tax withholding. Hopefully it's easy enough to decline the deferral. I could see a deferral helping some people who are very strapped now, but for a lot of people you'd be in for a big butt fucking when filing 2021 taxes.
You don’t understand, next year congress will have to slash the government expenditure to prevent from having to collect that money from this year, or they will be defenestrated.
I don't think it would be that extreme. I'm not sure when the deferral would end, but basically it would mean the taxes you would have been paying anyway would be owed at some point.
So if the deferral is for 2020 taxes, that means that you're basically getting a loan from the fed on your taxes until April. So if you would have paid 10k in taxes from now until Dec 31, that amount would be due when the deferral ends.
Perhaps there might be some sort of payment plan you can do on the deferral so you're not stuck with a huge tax bill come April. If there isn't, you would likely see everyone's refunds evaporating in April and potentially many people owing some money back to the fed.
Most savvy people would take the deferral and invest the money elsewhere for a bigger return and then just pay at tax time. But that type of micromanagement isn't for everyone.
Expand your thinking. Just like the gun grabber debate has gotten more pro gun from the Democrats burning cities, the tax debate will become one of much lower taxes and smaller government expenditures. The only reason the government gets away with taxes is because they never let you actually hold that money.
Don't be a 1D thinker. Do you honestly believe that Trump would take the political hit of enforcing a deferral payback? Do you think Trump WANTS people to pay it back to begin with? Do you think he'd leave it to the Democrats to take credit for it?
Take the money if you want it. If you don't, then don't. But you don't have to be hysterical about it.
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. There are usually things people can do, yes, but there are a lot of blue collar workers who love their country, work their asses off, and for whatever reasons aren’t swimming in cash. You don’t need to make fun of them for it.
For a lot of people it is, but for a lot of people it's not. Unforeseeable illness/injury or being a victim of a crime can change someone's financial situation much faster than they can change their living expenses.
If you have a mortgage you can easily afford, but then get decimated by an illness in your family, or an uninsured drunk driver destroying your cheap used car that you need to get to work, and injuring you so that you can't work at your job for several weeks or months, or somebody breaks into your garage and steals all your tools that you need to do your self-employed work, your mortgage doesn't evaporate. You aren't just magically transported to a rented single-wide trailer which is what you can now afford, and your house instantly sold for as much or more than you owe on it before your next mortgage payment is due.
Once somebody gets behind, especially with children to support, getting out of the paycheck to paycheck cycle can be very difficult, and impossible if there are additional rounds of bad things happening to you. Like your business income evaporates because the government orders it closed because of a pandemic.
Lmfao trust me when I say you're getting A LOT more of my money than I am yours.
How do I know? Because if that wasn't the case you'd be use to getting jack shit from these "stimulus" bills. But clearly you're furious at the idea of not getting more handouts.
I mean a certain amount of taxation is required. It's not theft. How else do you want to fund the military? The police? Any other worth while institution.
It's taxation without representation that is the true crime. But an incredibly imbalanced budget is more harm to this country and our financial stability than a well allocated and reasonable tax.
I'm all for wanting to keep my own money, but let's not pretend we're not the same group of people arguing for continued support and funding of police.
The problem is how many people will realize that be able to pay it back when it comes due? My guess is not a lot since people are fucking stupid with money.
It took my wife’s coworkers 2 months to realize that Trumps tax cuts were the reason they were making more money.
We'll have to see the exact wording but it's most likely a deferal and we'll owe it next year anyway.
But for those complaining - note that ALL these $600 stimulus checks are TAXABLE AS INCOME and many people will be pushed up a few brackets by taking them.
EDIT: If you guys think your income is taxed fully at the higher bracket level if you "go up a bracket" you really need to check out how taxes work. Here's a good explanation:
People don't want to make more money because of tax brackets???
Skywise, if you are, say 100$ over a bracket, you are ONLY taxed slightly higher on only that 100$.
Never worry about making more money. You've been duped, likely by a shitty boss that convinced you that the government was taking all your overtime or something.
Not sure how/why we're being downvoted here... do people really think once they enter a bracket they're then taxed at that rate for all of their earnings? Sad!
note that ALL these $600 stimulus checks are TAXABLE AS INCOME and many people will be pushed up a few brackets by taking them
$600 isn't going to get you "pushed up a few brackets" even if you took it for weeks on end. The gap between brackets is too large.
I also posted an explanation above as to how tax brackets operate at levels, not a sum total of your income. Going "up a bracket" only affects the money above that bracket limit.
EDIT: Dude, if you're going to ask a question and then edit your comment at least be forthright about it. Bottom kek.
Dude don’t feel that way. I’m not one who believes the virus is a hoax, so I’ll say that at least as far as I know, it’s no one’s fault you’re out of work, least of all your own. And if I’m wrong, and it is all a work, it’s still not on you. You’re not a loser, brother. You’ll be back in business before too long. What is it that you do if you don’t mind saying?
Hang in there man. That's EXACTLY what this is about for politicians; this is a way for them to impose their will become little dictators. They want your business crushed so that you have to be dependent on them. They're absolute scum.
Cousin It and Captain Cuck won’t be able to suppress you and your business forever. Hang in there, and you will make it to the other side. A lot of businesses are hanging in for dear life in PA because of Wolf and the clown car that he brought in to run PA
It's because he can and no one will do anything about it, which is maddening. One thing is for sure - a shit storm is coming this November when so many (D) lose due to being MFing 'activists' instead of doing their GD jobs. Our PA governor is not up for election, but he will feel the political change come November. Mark. My. Words.
Payroll suspension, if it isn't just a deferral, would hit the turbo button on the economy once work is legalized. Be ready to work your ass off and make it back.
You have a lot of support here. Hang in there. That sounds so rough, man. Essentially I think the Dems are punishing us for voting for Trump. Especially Pennsylvania, which hadn't voted red for years. It's awful. You are among frens here.
I am and have been blessed man. My life hasn't really been affected. In fact, I've been working about 50 hours a week the last month and a half.
I feel for the small business owners. I've dabbled in entrepreneurship but never been too successful. I got a lot of respect for yall. It pisses me off.
I think this whole thing has been a deliberate attempt to shake out small businesses and consolidate towards the top. They've let all the big stores stay in business but attacked the mom and pops. It's some evil times we're in. Hope everything works out.
Social Security is the world's biggest and most government-funded Ponzi scheme in history. It literally requires the population to perpetually remain a sharp pyramid, with vastly more youthful workers feeding the fund than retirees draining it, while also requiring inflation to stay at 0% in order for the money put in to match with the money that would later be taken out.
At no point in human history could it ever function as originally described. At best, it's constantly stealing money from the young to give a tiny stipend to the old. At worst, it's nothing more than a giant slush fund to be frivolously used/abused by any politician who even glances in its general direction for more than 2 seconds.
Payroll taxes are the taxes taken out of your paycheck besides income tax:FICA, Medicare, idk some other bullshit. It is not a tax break for some who is paying a “payroll”
If you’re salaried, take your gross pay per pay period and multiply by 7.65%. This will fall straight to your bottom line. Multiply by number of pay periods left in 2020 with your employer, that’s the total of TrumpBucks you’re getting from this stimulus in total.
Get fucked liberals without jobs screeching about this.
My understanding is that the president can postpone/defer taxes but can’t forgive them. That would require Congress.
Paying people not to work is a perverse inventive. Rewarding them more for working is what we need. Payroll tax cut is great. Hopefully this will put incredible pressure on Congress. Trump will be able to campaign on, “if you don’t want to have to pay that back, vote Trump and republican!”
He does need to go more on helping us essentials out. Biden is going around claiming "He is our friend," Trump needs to counter that good and with stuff that will work or else Biden will swing some indy's away with that. Last thing we need.
I'm not super thrilled with the tax cut as my return won't be as big as I want next year so I hope something good comes out of it to make up if we can get Congress back.
Yes that would be true, if there was enough jobs for people to go back to. For those of us who live in smaller towns that's not necessarily an option. You think those people should just be screwed because the government decided to decimate the economy?
Yes, it's just that your employer is not deducting more than you owe, hence the tax refund at the end of the year. And you won't be giving the government an interest-free loan every week.
I'm not so sure that's true. My understanding is that Trump is allowing "employers to defer payment of the employee portion of payroll tax", which means that you would still have to withhold income tax from your paycheck (FICA, federal, and state taxes), but the employer does not have to remit the taxes until a later date if they elect to do so. It essentially allows business to have more cash in the near-term, but they have to be careful because eventually they will have to pay the tax when it becomes due. Please correct me if I am wrong.
Yes, double that. I was clarifying exactly what FICA was for the previous poster. Also as others have pointed out, unless you are a 1099 employee or business owner that pays yourself wages, you will see a 7.65% savings unless/until YTD gross pay hits $137,700 before year-end, in which case the Soc Security portion (6.2%) is waived.
All the taxes that typically get taken out besides income tax ( FICA, Medicare, I think there’s another stupid one) won’t come out. Your net pay will go up probably significantly
Yes. Some people will find that option attractive though and would rather have the money now for present expenses. The IRS also has options for payment plans, which while not ideal, still give you time to get things back together.
Being in debt but able to pay bills and live inside a building is a much better situation than trying to start over as a homeless person.
There was some fear mongering from lefty rags that employers would still withhold it so they don't end up on the hook if you leave the job, but my guess is Trump will have the IRS work a repayment provision into the 1040 for 2021. There's already a way to pay these taxes on the 1040 if you're self employed, or get a refund if you make over the SS cap through multiple jobs.
Taxes should never be taken out of paychecks. Pay taxes once per year at tax time. The way the current scam runs, the cattle never feel the real burden of taxes.
Traditionally, Democrats have favored payroll tax cuts because these cuts provide a direct tax cut that benefits workers over investors since payroll taxes are only paid on income from work and not on investment income. Because payroll taxes are paid only on income up to the wage base limit, a payroll tax cut also disproportionally benefits low and middle income workers who are taxed on their entire salaries instead of only on part of their income. These workers typically spend -- rather than save -- the extra money, bolstering the economy by helping businesses.
I don’t think this is a misstep. The details just need to be clear. Is he taking the tax rate to zero or is everyone just getting a bill in a few months? I don’t know if he has the power to completely eliminate the payroll tax or if he only has the power to delay it. If he can only delay it, then this makes a lot of sense.
Somewhere in the future I am hoping that the federal reserve is gone, and our savings will actually be worth something again. Trump is the man to do it!
I personally am probably not going to benefit much from the payroll tax cuts but I think a lot of people will. More student loan deferments will be a huge boon. All in all Covid has put enough in my pockets to just about pay off the whole thing in a lump sum. Anyone with student debt please be smart and use this time to attack that principle balance of you can.
Actually that’s not a smart play. Government backed public student loan debt sucks for society, but it’s ‘good’ debt to an individual. If you don’t have private loans, there’s no reason to pay off any student loans with a rate generally below a 4-5%. You’re better off minimizing your payment and investing the rest and turn a 6-10% yearly with it.
Besides. It’d be my luck I make my last payment right before they wipe them all. (Not likely or desired...I’ll pay my debt back, but that’s exactly what would happen; I know it!)
The sneaky, low risk, cleverly smart play is to make money with money that costs nothing, so you have more money at the end of the year, and can pay off the loan quicker overall.
He knows tariffs are bringing in a huge amount and it could be more. China has a disaster happening, even if the 3 Gorges Dam holds up. There is massive flooding above and below the dam. Crops are ruined and winter is on the way. They will be forced to buy food elsewhere. On top of that, the dam is damaged.
In principle, I support the move. In practice I have several questions, chief among them: How?
Is he simply directing federal agencies not to collect the taxes? He would seemingly be in his rights to do so, but that does nothing about whatever or not you, as a citizen, owe them.
A complicated move here. It was probably his best available play. Lot of questions.
Agencies can’t pass laws, but agencies pass rules. They will establish a new Treasury agency rule that suspends the collection mechanism, and guidance will go out to satellite offices and industry associations to recommend accountants adjust their tax guidance to their customers. Software companies like Intuit will adjust their code to recalculate deductions after they have some time, and that will be it.
That’s exactly what happened after the CARES act passed. About a month into it, options appeared in QuickBooks payroll to add PTO options to staff for the three options for expanded leave, and the payroll tax reports automatically deduct the tax credit for your payments out to the Treasury.
That’s the part of the final rule we will have to see. Laws are written but rules set processes on how to apply them. We will see where this lands. They could set it to be paid back spread over multiple years for all we know right now.
Well i know Mnuchin was working on a new relief effort and was very hush hush about the details last month when they inquired about it. Maybe this was it? Instead of everyone getting 1 check, we all get to keep 8% of our paychecks until the end of the year.
I'm sure the "How" part has already been figured out, and the plans for it will be rolled out in a press conference in the near future I suspect.
Hell Yes! I just saved 15.3% for a few months and I’m saving 7.65% off all my employees AND they just got a 7.65% raise. I’m tired ATM, but I ain’t tired of winning. Love this POTUS.
Most people don’t even know the employers pay that. It’s not like you accept a job at $12/hr including employer payroll tax. It’s an employer tax not an employee tax. Why shouldn’t they keep it?
I’ll give you an upvote to bring you back to zero, and just add that these are usually taken out of a future tax CREDIT, so it isn’t something someone would pay BACK, but it would certainly reduce a future refund. That however, could happen via an adjustment to the standard deduction, etc. so it’ll go unnoticed by most.
Yeah, can you imagine that negotiation 6 months from now? Who has the upper hand? The guy who wants to let you keep your money or the guy who wants you to pay it back? This is a brilliant move.
Yeah? I mean, "bribing" voters with their own money is pretty okay with me. Do you mean "tax credits" instead of "tax cuts"?
Well the plan was to increase tax receipts with low unemployment, withdrawal troops from foreign wars and re-negotiate the bad trade deals in our favor. I'm assuming you are libertarian and want small government. Tell me, what has Rand and Ron done the past 3 decades in Congress that we could emulate on a large scale to reduce the national debt?
Hmm...interesting. Let me make sure I understand you. The Trump Tax Cuts was in 2017. Was the federal tax revenue in FY2019 higher or lower than FY2017? Was the massive Trump tax cuts able to generate enough growth to offset the initial loss of revenue?
It's late for me to be doing maths, but if you claim the right amount of exemptions on your W-4, you don't usually owe or get much of a refund. Claiming the right amount of exemptions lets you keep most of your money, without anticipating a refund (read: giving the government an interest free loan).
Now, if you are claiming the right amount of exemptions, and they defer the payroll tax, aren't you going to either make the adjustment to your W-4, claiming zero exemptions, or have to bank the "extra" cash you are now getting to pay back, because now you will be getting "more" on your checks?
I am not a tax person at all, I am just wondering how exemptions are offset from a payroll rax deferral.
You don’t adjust your w4. Even last year with the payroll tax change, the withholdings just updated on the payroll softwares and the manual tax spreadsheets (if anyone does payroll taxes manually when hand writing checks.)
W4s just tell your employer how much to withhold, based on selecting IRS criteria. You don’t say ‘24% bracket’, you say ‘head of household’ etc.
The # of exemptions actually doesn’t exist anymore on the w4. They took that away in 2019.
This still doesn't answer my question. I can still claim dependents and filing status on my W-4. And it impacts how much I owe, or get a refund on.
It sounds like a payroll tax deferment would by like claiming exempt from withholding by default, if it is "automatic", meaning I start seeing more money on my check, but they still want it back at some point. People might not be cognizant of this until tax season, and that money may already be spent, then you might have to pay "double" taxes to catch up through the next tax season, if you can't pay it when the deferment comes due. Am I not being clear with what I am asking?
You are clear, and I understand your statement. What we are missing each other on the main theme. I describe altering the standard deduction above, but the most likely scenario is they would be giving you a reduction in your withholdings as an 'early' refundable credit anyway. So getting it this year (spread across six months’ paychecks) would simply remove it from a future year...it isn't owing more taxes when you do that year, it is just getting that credit now...(and still getting this year’s) You are envisioning a loan, to be paid back. I’m describing an advance on a future discount, so to speak. A discount you get every year, so this year you get it twice, next year none. Not a loan, just early.
On the exemptions: The IRS dropped them last year, and you don't get to claim the arbitrary numbers you used to. There is no way to file exempt now when you are not exempt. There is no way to lower your taxes either....you used to enter extra exemptions, but that is gone. The only options is to pre-calculate your estimated deductions v. the standard deduction (pg. 3) and/or reduce the amount of withholdings directly related to your child tax credit (see step 3 on the form, it's in dollars now) IF you will make low enough to claim it. For a reference, here is the current W4
Why not permanently?
Once people get a taste of the greatness...
People are gonna realize what an 8% larger take-home paycheck means and demand Congress make it permanent.
And Congress will laugh and spit in our eye.
15% to self employed
Yes, indeed.
No one will ever pay payroll taxes again.
what good is cutting payroll tax if Trump doesn't cut government spending ?
Why is that all Trump's job? Wouldnt that fall on the people being there for 50 years that have fucked it all up?
Ain't that a bitch? You do it all yourself, gibs moar!
Write off as much as you can is all I can say...If I had a business my garage would be a $1500/mo warehouse rental to be deducted...
That works right? 😏
I want overtime to be tax-free, because I'm a selfish son of a bitch. I bust out 50-60 hours a week and that OT pay just diminishes.
Yeah the extra on OT makes zero sense.
I'm gonna do a quick mini-rant. Used to live in a medium-sized southern city. I worked 40-50 hours construction in the summer in residential houses before the AC was in the house. Trimming out the whole house and hardware. 1 or 2 a day, sometimes 6 days a week. Developed a foot fungus because of the sweat.
Started doing DoorDash and Grubhub delivery apps for about 15-30 hours a week on top of that for extra money. I could pull in about 18 an hour pre-taxes. Paychecks were nice.
I'd bust my ass doing trim with no AC, then go work the apps for 3-5 hours a night. It hit me one night while I was delivering to the damn projects two blocks away from my expensive ass apartment. Smelling weed everywhere. Nobody's working because you can smell weed at literally any time of day. 11 AM, 3 PM, midnight. Weed. I deliver to these projects on the first of the month. Answering the door with beers and weed smoke. No tip. I'm busting my ass and my hard work if supplementing their lives. They live in a destination city with expensive ass houses and apartments everywhere. They don't contribute. They live off the working man like leeches. And they don't even give me a dollar tip of my own money back.
I still get pissed thinking about it, obviously. Didn't really have to work that much at the time but two paychecks is sweet. Now I'm making much more so my side work nowadays is not as common but higher paying. I'm gonna go drink a beer.
I'd be fine with ditching both time and a half with payroll taxes. Limiting most people to 40 hours a week is bogus. How much time you spend and how much you get paid for it is between you and your employer.
Tax rate on OT punishes productivity. It's such bullshit.
Of course it does. Work harder and pay more. Someone has to pay for the leeches of society. It’s by the politician design. Make more pay more, Trump needs to push flat tax next term.
I work for the State of NY. One paycheck I worked 9 hours of OT, the next paycheck I had 27 hours of OT.
9 hour of OT paycheck was $1,105 after benefits and retirement taken out. 27 hour of OT paycheck was $1,380 after taxes, benefits, and retirement. I felt like an idiot, had I known I'd only make $200-300 more for two times the amount of OT, I'd have never worked that much to begin with.
That's crazy. At least your tax money goes to a good purpose. Oh wait.
All these taxes go to paying some lazy ass's salary in the government.
This isn't completely accurate. When you make more the calculations assume you moved up a pay bracket as if you would always make that much on a paycheck and withhold a higher percentage. You tax liability will remain the same and you will likely get a larger refund at the end of the year because that assumption meant they took too much out in taxes.
Yup. Sayin goes: you’re better off working at McyDs than OTs thanks to the government.
There comes a point of diminishing returns..you have to know what that point is.
Yeah i work in NY and the rule of thumb is to not fo over 10hrs of OT. UNLESS you can dump extra into a 401 or somehwere you wont get taxed
That's such a mischaracterization.
If you work 20 hours of OT every single week then you are simply being taxed at the progressive rate of a person in the next tax bracket pays.
If you only work OT a few weeks of the year then eat it the fuck up because those weeks where the accounting believes you are being paid a high salary will eventually return when filing taxes.
The "diminished" pay is just the effects of a progressive tax system. You get paid a lot so they take more.
Yep. Same for my 10% semi annual bonus. Oh cool I got $1000? i'll see around $600-ish.
You work 50-60 AND make OT? Damn. Truckers gotta start demanding more pay. Especially those poor SOBs driving flatbeds. 🤔
Truckers make insane money as long as they aren't company men.
Source: I am a dispatcher for owner operators. When the economy is bumping, some guys bring home $4k+ a week.
Also, if you have an employee you get to pay the missing half of his payroll taxes. Sneaky taxes are the best of all taxes
It can but it's gotta be real
Looks outside
Yep, the garage is really there. I put stuff in it even!
Self employed here. Here in Florida I had to pay $136 just to say that nothing changed my business in the last year, my uncle has been in business whole life responded to my question about it like this,: you're a business owner so people assume you have money so they think they can take it from you
Styxhexenhammer666 bitches about that all the time. I think most people who have a wage or salary job have no idea that Americans are punished for being self-employed in the USA.
Remember we're talking about the land of hard work and the American dream lol
We need real fixing for small businesses. They can and should be the lifeblood of this country. And none of that muh minority owned or muh woman owned bullshit. Just tax breaks and get out of the way.
The oligarchs that started running the USA 100 years ago (Carnegie, Rockefeller and JP Morgan etc.) didn't want any future competitors. They use burdensome regulations crafted by politicians in their pockets in order to stave off competition...
Regulatory Capture. Remember those two words any time a corporation wants increased regulations on their industry.
BTW the CPA, Chris Whalen, that skyx promoted on his channel is based. Cool guy.
Yeah, I've seen some of those interviews too. Styx is a great interviewer. Wish he'd do more! Loved his chat with Shiva Ayyadurai, the real Indian, who ran against Elizabeth Warren, the fake Indian, in 2018.
Social security is massively underfunded. Why pay into something that's mismanaged? We can invest for our own retirement ourselves!
Am LLC, can confirm
Boom, yes. this is the best news I've had as self-employed in a long time from the government.
That's a huge cut of money back in the pocket.
What happened last time a government-imposed an unfair tax on a people without their consent LOL?
Nothing its been happening for hundreds of years
True
So I am getting an 8% raise till at least January?
...
6.2% raise til January at least. It’s the part that you pay to the government on your paycheck.
What utopia do you live in? 33% here
Yeah but we’ve been saying that for years and it hasn’t happened. “When you get a job and look at your paystub, then you’ll be pissed about how much the govt steals from you.” In reality, they’re just complacent accepting it, or don’t even bother to look, just cash the check. I actually know people who intentionally have as much as possible deducted from their paychecks because their self aware of their own financial mismanagement.
Do people not do their own taxes? How can you not know how much you paid.
Oh I agree, I’m just not very optimistic than many people will even notice it until it’s taken away, so hopefully that opens a lot of eyes. I am BEYOND happy about this, being self employed, I guess I’ll be saving over 15% of every dollar for a while and all my employees are about to get nearly an 8% raise. Stuff like that can jump start an economy so quickly. How could anyone be opposed to this when millions were laid off for no reason other than a hoax. Why would the Democrats block this? Because they don’t care about the working man, they care more about the jobless Antifa rioters who pays zilch in taxes, no other explanation as to why they’d be against this considering the circumstances imposed by government overreach.
And they see it as a percentage of money not time. Think about it. Say your average tax is 20%, that means 1 out of every 5 days you work for free for the government. It’s like communism-lite.
Can’t legislate just for the stupidest among us. Employers that see a benefit can point it out to their employees and dispense some red pills here and there. Can’t stop trying just cause the populace has been dumbed down.
This pede gets it.
Why do they need a taste? Who would seriously be opposed to this besides the elites?
Requires Congress, if I'm not mistaken.
So did DACA. Right?
Hah.. Precisely.
Not so fast..Chief Justice Roberts decides these important matters.
Hawaii Judge has entered the chat.
Judge Sullivan just appointed an amicus curiae.
Andrew Weissmann is ghost-writing the brief.
Always good for a laff
Wipe dat jizz off yo chin, yo honor.
My sincere apologies to the Crown.
Supreme Court ruled that the president is a king awhile back.
Legally, he can only do it for 6 months during emergencies. Traditionally congress has this power. It’s an action limited specifically to address emergencies, not making permanent changes.
Technically he can suspend it for 6 months then once he is re-elected he can forgive the repayment. That’s probably his plan. Legally, it would be challenged in the courts to do it more than once and so it probably isn’t worth it. Just use it and get out instead of abusing it and wasting every one’s time
Genius idea. He can use that as leverage going up to election day. Every working class american will now have their vote representing a direct financial interest. If you vote for trump, you get to keep all that money you would have normally paid in taxes. For normies this will cut deep because they all will ask why their paycheck is higher and once they're told that they have to repay the money if Trump loses.....they won't vote for Biden. Money talks folks.
If they’re made to understand that last point. Media lies. And people are stupid.
The left has all these idiots clamoring to tax the wealthy more so much that they forgot that they could just vote to tax themselves less. Of course that hasn't been a real option in a long while due to RINOs, but now they'll get a taste.
If the Fed wants to keep churning out all this BS funny money and pretend MMT is real, then why the hell shouldn't Trump take advantage of it while he can?
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
I seem to remember hearing Obama say “Debt doesn’t matter.”
The law is pretty clear. Roberts would have a hard time defending such a dumb position. Heck, you might even get a liberal to vote for its defense. Happens
He just voted for casinos over churches, so I wouldn't put anything past him.
Unless the entrenched political establishment publicly admits there is no emergency and no justification for mail in ballots.
Which dovetails right into what another commenters pointed out, that this sets up a situation where the normie voter knows that if they don't Trump that they can kiss that tax cut good bye, and might even have to repay it.
Vote Nov 3rd.
Can we talk about how on fire Trump has been the last 4 or 5 days? This is the president I voted for.
I wish. 920 bucks in federal taxes my last check.
I paid over $4200 last year to the IRS. Worst was when I owed over $8k.
All because my stocks did well, I sold them, and lived off of them until I could find a job. The fact I was living off of investments instead of taking fucking welfare cost me money.
Clearly, the "safety net" is not for those of us who keep their shit together.
The "welfare state" was actually started by a German politican most people today consider "conservative" as a way of staving power shifting to commies and their related dumbasses. He outright stated it was a means of buying votes.
Why is it, that most of the problems in our world, dating back to the middle of the first millennia, came from Germanic people?
Related. Ignore the obvious ironic statements but it never fails to make me laugh.
But yeah, it pisses me off that people keep on attributing Austrian/Romanian/Prussian accomplishments to worst Germany.
Obviously I was half-serious. Lots of great things came out of Germany and Austria and whatever we call them now (those names didn't exist for most of history).
But those nuts went from being rather caveman like to being philosophers and musicians in a very short amount of time, and that is...concerning. I blame aliens.
Or the obvious alternative: history is a crock of shit and Germanic people have always been the light of the world.
That video is a beautiful parody. It's the video version of this meme: https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/137/265/e4e.jpg
Only thing it missed was the Frankfurt School of Thought which founded cultural marxism and glassed over dominating the EU to flood the region with rapefugees under threat of economic destruction.
Chancellor Otto von Bismarck really hated the Communists, his old age pensioner fund was the only viable success out of his attempts to subvert the Marxists.
Gains are taxed. If you lose or break even, you're fine.
Different tax rates for gains, depending on time. Long term gains are taxed roughly half the rate.
It really is BS that investing gets taxed. It kind of chokes investing by normies and keeps investing in the realm of the "professionals".
You take all the risk and the government says “nah, some of that payoff is mine”
The Founders really are rolling in their graves. And don’t get me started on PROPERTY tax. Do you own it? Or just rent it from the government? Because they can evict you if you don’t/can’t pay property tax.
I'll never understand why people do it. And they look forward to getting it back every year, instead of letting it draw interest for you.
Hmmm. Not interested in that case.
Yeah, I'm not really in the mood to take a loan out of my own money just to pay it back. Maybe it'll earn a little interest in my savings account so I can make a few cents for storing my own money for later disgorgement to the IRS.
ELI5?
He’s referring to the possbility that the payroll taxes will have to be paid back to the government, which basically becomes a loan at 0%. The rest of his comment is rhetoric about the absurdity of savings interest.
Lol bro. I will pay around $850,000 in federal taxes for 2020. Just in case you want to feel better
Are you hiring? Lol
Lol if you have extremely specialized knowledge and a huge appetite for risk
That made my soul hurt.
It makes my butthole hurt for sure. Uncle Sam doesn’t use lube.
Thank god I live in a state with no state income tax and not some shithole place like California that would charge me another 13.5% for the privilege of getting cucked by Newsom
This just got me thinking. If my stocks hit big and I want to sell, can I move to a state that has no income tax live there for 6+ months then sell? I totally forgot about state taxes, those MFs.
Riiiiight. ;-)
Believe it.
I spy a jealous child
I’m glad that this type of bitter comment gets crushed here at TD where it would be hugely upvoted at cuck reddit. Success should be celebrated and emulated
Yeah same
ALL TAXATION IS THEFT
yep
Taxation is robbery, inflation is theft*
End the federal reserve!
Reeeee but then how will we print cash and keep the economy closed
You're absolutely right, money printer needs to go brrr!
But muh roads?
Reeeeee
But muh tolls.
Democrats: "Good idea, we'll do both."
Welcome to I-90 in Illinois, where it costs more per mile in tolls than it does in gas.
But muh Skyway.
I-90 through MA and NY is the same. I-87 south of Albany, NY is robbery too.
I crossed a bridge in NY once and IIRC it was like $20 one way.
Absolute insanity.
Sometimes I wonder why the federal government couldn't lower taxes by an enourmous amount, and then produce something within the government that we would want to buy as consumers. You know, like an actual business, instead of just taking it. If you want more money, trade me something for it.
Bonds
MAGA Hats
Weed?
You know that once the leftists get their hands on that, it will just be a means to pay off their friends and enrich themselves.
FUCK TAXES!
And my butthole!
You're VERY dedicated to this troll account.
I have a feeling you're actually Obama and just can't help but let us know how much your love dicks in your orifices.
And...cough my bow?
Any my cock
And my big rod!
"BIG MIKE" has entered the chat....
"THICK MIKE" has entered the chat...
nope
America's issue is its multilayer tax system. I think if we did a 10% state, 10% federal, we'd be in a lot better shape. This of course requires the government to reign in spending so it's a pipe dream.
It also Means you can’t use tax cuts and punishments to cajole people and pander to voters. So it will never happen.
How the fuck can corrupt assholes like Obama send $300-500 billion in unmarked bills to Iran in the middle of the night if he's not confiscating a significant portion of the US economy?
Will we ever see a refund for that money that was illegally sent to a terrorist regime?
Nope.
Of course not. Metric fucktons of it went into the pockets of terror groups. That money is GONE.
With America's current atmosphere I don't think a tax free government is realistic. In an ideal country I agree there should be practically 0 taxes.
Of course we need to raise taxes to provide for the common defense. That could be raised from import taxes. Sales taxes. The government should have NO CLUE what your income is and NO INTEREST in it either.
I'm not sure on the statistics for sales taxes, so I'm unable to say if that'd be more profitable than income. I agree with you that on a philosophical level income taxes are less moral. I do believe in a tax on luxury items such as alcohol and very unhealthy foods though. Only makes sense because people who buy those things inevitably cost the medical system more. I'd be willing to remove that if government was completely out of Healthcare though. Outside monopoly busting of course. Besides national defense I don't see a whole lot the federal government should be doing.
Regulating interstate commerce. Removing us from alliances. Ensuring a working justice system. Enforcing borders.
Or we roll back the 16th and 17th amendment and let each state figure it out.
Creates a less even field for businesses to have varying taxes state to state.
Well if you decide to open a business in California and be taxed to death, that was your mistake.
It would lead to a change in the political atmosphere. Most Dem controlled states won't be able to function if businesses decide to move out. Only thing left to blame would be the state and the idiots who run it.
I say give a shot. Let the market decide.
We don’t have a tax problem we have a spending problem. End government takeovers of industry & entitlements and welfare
Citizens shouldn’t pay federal taxes at all. Their money should go to the state they live in.
I’m just gonna anonymously mail mine in like a ballot...or maybe not but if anyone asks, I did
It was lost in the mail.
Honest question, if we abolish all forms of taxation, how will we pay for military, government, public infrastructure like schools and roadways?
You're right, taxes are a necessary evil. We all need to pitch in for the things that make this country great. The issue is that working people have been shouldering the majority of the burden for too long. Another problem is that a lot of our money is being wasted on crap that doesn't help us. Billions of taxpayer dollars go to foreign governments and politicians' "pet projects". Suspending the payroll tax will provide workers some relief in these tough times and force congress to FINALLY balance the budget by cutting unnecessary spending and eliminating loopholes for the rich and well connected.
There you go. That's a more reasonable take.
I live in the People's Republic of Illinois so any chance I get to screech about taxes I screech loud and proud. I pray that a day will come when we can all come together to make real reforms and compromises. In the mean time I'll take any tax break I can get. This is just a band-aid on top of an infected gangrenous wound.
Commifornia. They take a huge chunk of my paycheck. I wouldn't be as salty if I knew the funds were getting spent correctly, but obviously these crooks are skimming off the top and disappearing funds all the time.
Tariffs, customs, excise taxes, etc. That’s what we did before the 16th Amendment was ratified to authorize theft by the government, anyway. And maybe the government can finally learn how to get rid of waste and live within its means.
We can dream, anyway.
So, we tax foreign imports? Not sure if that's enough to cover all our bills
That’s exactly right. So they stop living above their means and budget the money they have. As government was meant to be. Not a super spy, nanny state, police state, or welfare state. A government that rules over each of the United States. States makes more of the decisions for their people. If you live in a shitty state, you can move to a new one.
Our collective military superiority can’t be paid for with just good will.
Before the income tax, the federal government was run off tariffs collected. They should try that model again.
If we collect only tariffs, it will be enough to maintain our military? You mentioned only income tax. What about property tax, sales tax, and I’m pretty sire there’s a multitude of other taxes I haven’t even heard about.
The same way you mow your lawns, or water your plants, or patch your driveway. Do it ourself or pay a private company to do it.
Communities have been functioning for thousands of years this way. In fact it’s infinitely cheaper and more efficient than government work.
Hold up, let me study freeway construction. Get real.
Don’t be an idiot. 1) You don’t have to personally build the freeway- your community can collectively hire an independent company 2) the government is fucking horrible at getting bids and doing construction work because they’re corrupt. You asked a question and I answered it.
Collectively hiring a company, i.e. collective pooling of funds, that suspiciously sounds like taxes.
You want free shit, from the sounds of it. This has nothing to do with taxes and everything to do with freedom and self reliance. You won’t HAVE to pay for a road if you don’t want to, or a roof over your head or any other luxury in a free world.
You scoff so readily at a system that worked fine in this country for hundreds of years before a forced tax, yet you fail to recognize how horrible our current system is. Look at Hawaii- 20 years and 20 BILLION dollars to build a RAIL. A RAIL in a 40 mile long ISLAND. Think about that. Now all the foundation work and pillars erected are already starting to crack and crumble. It’s a disaster and YOUR tax money is paying for it.
Would you build a RAIL on an island measuring 40 miles across if you had control of where your money went? Think before you react.
You’re right to be upset at the mismanagement of tax funding allocation, not the collection of taxes itself. Seems like you got it all twisted.
Stefan Molynuex has entered the chat
yep
Pedes remember this is a deferral, dont ruin yourself this tax season
“Oh, you know, tha thing.”
do people like tha thing?
You ain't black if you don't like the thing
Come on man!
kek shut it down
Well our government was set up because there needed to be something in place to represent us as a people. We need a military, infrastructure, and a court to make sure people aren't fucking each other over.
That being said, over the course of our history, being a congressman or president went from doing it as a part time gig, to it being a full fledged job with a 6 figure income and benefits for life.
If we somehow get term limits into the system, it would allow us to cut some of the fat that has grown in our government and it would be easier to cut unnecessary taxes and spending.
No one should be a career politician. No one should hold an elected office until death. It's a bullshit trend that needs to stop.
We're over $20 trillion in debt and running annual deficits of nearly $1 trillion/year!
THERE. IS. NO. MONEY. LEFT...
Taxes over the laffer limit means you can have your cake and eat it at the same time, less taxes with higher total revenues. Regan/Bush/Trump have all done it
Still doesn't make it right. We're gonna pay the piper sooner or later...
Government debt can be inflated into nothingness. It follows its own logic, to some degree a logic which no one understands
That also means your savings are evaporated into nothing. Responsible people who carry no debt and pay their bills on time are the ones who get shafted. You really want to give government that much economic power over you?
I strongly suggest you read more about founding fathers like Thomas Jefferson to get where I am coming from here.
Read about the Austrian School of Economics that Ron Paul is a big fan of. He discusses it in his book "End the Fed". Zero hedge believes in it too.
It explains why we have stock market bubbles.
We're gonna inflate the debt away, and so long as dollar is default currency ain't no one gonna question it
Inflation is just stealing from everyone with retirement investments.
No... lol Inflation inflates equities and assets too...
Inflation is not a good thing. That’s how you get Weimar republics.
More guns bought in 5 years than the entire military force in the world combined
The dollar is only the default currency because the military industrial complex will bomb or start revolutions in countries that oppose the fiat dollar hegemony.
Return to the gold standard and keep the spending by politicians in check!
Nah, sorry. This is stupid. Our current economy could not be maintained with the gold standard and we would dramatically reduce the rate of innovation. If you like the gold standard, just keep your savings in gold.
Yes, that's right our "economy" is a joke. Going back to a gold standard would introduce a shock in the economy that would kill malinvestments such as Tesla motors, a company that wouldn't have been able to get off of the ground without government subsidies.
Our economy since 1913 (when the Federal Reserve Act was passed) is designed for wealthy insiders (big bankers, corporate socialists like the Koch Bros etc.) to profit off of the newly printed money first. People like you or I see those dollars last once inflation is built-in.
Just read "End the Fed" by Ron Paul and he can explain the arguments a hell of a lot better than I can. You cannot escape basic economics. If you don't have the money to afford something, printing more money WILL NOT MAKE YOU RICHER. Think, bro.
Even if you hold your savings in gold, you're still required to pay your taxes in fiat dollars. Just because you buy gold doesn't mean you escape our ponzi economic system.
magic
IT'S MY MONEY AND I WANT IT NOW!!!
lmao.... government money is OUR money.
We will have to be taxed to "pay it off". Maybe not this year, but the years following certainly.
Yeah we pay an even heavier price for inflation
You're absolutely right that inflation is going to be high.
But technically, I think, it's the private bank called the Federal Reserve which "prints" money out of thin air... and then loans it to the government, with interest. Win for the bankers.
Interest that we end up having to pay back by guess what... higher taxes yay
All profits the fed makes from interest goes to the treasury. So any interest from printed money is zero.
False. Many billions of dollars go to private banks because the banks buy up the bonds magically created by the fed.
Disagree. The Federal reserve will print money loan it back to the government at an interest rate and then we will have to pay for that interest rate back with higher taxes.
Fed profits go back to the government though.
Yeah but not without getting their pockets lined with a percentage off the top for "expenses".
Nope - private banks get hundreds of billions in the cycle.
It's only meant to help liquidity for those who have been impacted by covid.
This is good, and much better for the country overall and the strength of US dollar.
FTFY
It's like an interest free loan... of your own money.
Most people don’t save money though and owing money to the government is going to fuck them.
To make the average person realize just how much money they lose to taxes? Thus causing them to react violently against all Democrat plans to add back in more taxes.
If your spouse is on unemployment and shit is really tight, a tax deferral could actually be pretty helpful if you're the main income of the household. You would probably want to adjust your withholding for next year though to offset what your making if it is only a deferral.
LOL Nope Trump will wave collection just like Obama and DACA. No enforcement.
If that is the case, you'd be better off not adjusting any tax withholding. Hopefully it's easy enough to decline the deferral. I could see a deferral helping some people who are very strapped now, but for a lot of people you'd be in for a big butt fucking when filing 2021 taxes.
Interested to hear more at least.
Oh you trust them to do the right thing down the line...yeah, don't hold your breath.
Absolutely. They have done much much worse and they keep getting elected. To think otherwise is ridiculously niave.
You don’t understand, next year congress will have to slash the government expenditure to prevent from having to collect that money from this year, or they will be defenestrated.
Or tarred and feathered. Or drug through the streets using a horse high on angel dust.
You know, peaceful protests.
Math isn't your strong suit, huh?
I don't think it would be that extreme. I'm not sure when the deferral would end, but basically it would mean the taxes you would have been paying anyway would be owed at some point.
So if the deferral is for 2020 taxes, that means that you're basically getting a loan from the fed on your taxes until April. So if you would have paid 10k in taxes from now until Dec 31, that amount would be due when the deferral ends.
Perhaps there might be some sort of payment plan you can do on the deferral so you're not stuck with a huge tax bill come April. If there isn't, you would likely see everyone's refunds evaporating in April and potentially many people owing some money back to the fed.
Most savvy people would take the deferral and invest the money elsewhere for a bigger return and then just pay at tax time. But that type of micromanagement isn't for everyone.
You sound like a Democrat screaming for free shit.
It's a 0% interest loan. Don't complain.
Expand your thinking. Just like the gun grabber debate has gotten more pro gun from the Democrats burning cities, the tax debate will become one of much lower taxes and smaller government expenditures. The only reason the government gets away with taxes is because they never let you actually hold that money.
Don't be a 1D thinker. Do you honestly believe that Trump would take the political hit of enforcing a deferral payback? Do you think Trump WANTS people to pay it back to begin with? Do you think he'd leave it to the Democrats to take credit for it?
Take the money if you want it. If you don't, then don't. But you don't have to be hysterical about it.
Triggered much? Must suck living paycheck to paycheck.
Don’t be a dick. Paycheck to paycheck people put Trump in the White House.
Living paycheck to paycheck is a choice to not live within your means. It's the same mindset that liberals use to justify social welfare.
This will get plenty of downvotes from those who don't want to look in the mirror, but truth hurts.
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. There are usually things people can do, yes, but there are a lot of blue collar workers who love their country, work their asses off, and for whatever reasons aren’t swimming in cash. You don’t need to make fun of them for it.
For a lot of people it is, but for a lot of people it's not. Unforeseeable illness/injury or being a victim of a crime can change someone's financial situation much faster than they can change their living expenses.
If you have a mortgage you can easily afford, but then get decimated by an illness in your family, or an uninsured drunk driver destroying your cheap used car that you need to get to work, and injuring you so that you can't work at your job for several weeks or months, or somebody breaks into your garage and steals all your tools that you need to do your self-employed work, your mortgage doesn't evaporate. You aren't just magically transported to a rented single-wide trailer which is what you can now afford, and your house instantly sold for as much or more than you owe on it before your next mortgage payment is due.
Once somebody gets behind, especially with children to support, getting out of the paycheck to paycheck cycle can be very difficult, and impossible if there are additional rounds of bad things happening to you. Like your business income evaporates because the government orders it closed because of a pandemic.
No one vilified anyone. Your brain immediately went there on its own. Kind of like Democrats and racism.
You just doubled down like Biden and your analogy is a self-fulfilling prophecy.
If you boys can't settle down I'm afraid I'm going to have to ask you to leave.
Lmfao trust me when I say you're getting A LOT more of my money than I am yours.
How do I know? Because if that wasn't the case you'd be use to getting jack shit from these "stimulus" bills. But clearly you're furious at the idea of not getting more handouts.
Wow jerk move
That you have to pay off in 18 months
Its not a loan. That's my money. It's deferred theft.
... Which is fine. I'll make a bit of money in interest in the meantime.
I mean a certain amount of taxation is required. It's not theft. How else do you want to fund the military? The police? Any other worth while institution.
It's taxation without representation that is the true crime. But an incredibly imbalanced budget is more harm to this country and our financial stability than a well allocated and reasonable tax.
I'm all for wanting to keep my own money, but let's not pretend we're not the same group of people arguing for continued support and funding of police.
Oh, I know. Just being a bit silly.
The problem is how many people will realize that be able to pay it back when it comes due? My guess is not a lot since people are fucking stupid with money.
It took my wife’s coworkers 2 months to realize that Trumps tax cuts were the reason they were making more money.
He said both Deferal and that it was suspended.
We'll have to see the exact wording but it's most likely a deferal and we'll owe it next year anyway.
But for those complaining - note that ALL these $600 stimulus checks are TAXABLE AS INCOME and many people will be pushed up a few brackets by taking them.
Yes, all unemployment is taxable. And if you didn't set a withholding amount in the payment system you will owe the whole amount.
Brackets don't work like that.
EDIT: If you guys think your income is taxed fully at the higher bracket level if you "go up a bracket" you really need to check out how taxes work. Here's a good explanation:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/turbotax.intuit.com/tax-tips/irs-tax-return/what-are-tax-brackets/amp/L8jeM6XaJ
Aside from some fringe cases applying for benefits or something there's no reason at all to be afraid of being in a "higher bracket".
This.
Come on, man!
People don't want to make more money because of tax brackets???
Skywise, if you are, say 100$ over a bracket, you are ONLY taxed slightly higher on only that 100$.
Never worry about making more money. You've been duped, likely by a shitty boss that convinced you that the government was taking all your overtime or something.
Good news, right!
The level to which public schooling failed people blows my fucking mind, man.
Not sure how/why we're being downvoted here... do people really think once they enter a bracket they're then taxed at that rate for all of their earnings? Sad!
Because you two are going off on a tangent and arguing against a strawman.
Wait so having a higher amount of income doesn’t effect a person’s tax bracket? Hmm
The portion above the bracket limit is taxed at the higher amount. The portion below the bracket limit is taxed at the lower amount.
In other words, if someone gets an extra $600, $500 of which is "above their bracket", only that $500 is taxed at the higher bracket amount.
...so why the downvotes?
He didn’t make the claim that you’re arguing against, that’s why the downvotes.
$600 isn't going to get you "pushed up a few brackets" even if you took it for weeks on end. The gap between brackets is too large.
I also posted an explanation above as to how tax brackets operate at levels, not a sum total of your income. Going "up a bracket" only affects the money above that bracket limit.
EDIT: Dude, if you're going to ask a question and then edit your comment at least be forthright about it. Bottom kek.
So you’re saying there’s a chance
Of course changing your income can have unintended consequences, suggesting otherwise is untrue
And there’s your straw man
I only edited my comment to change it from being facetious to literal because you seem to be confused about details. The message was exactly the same
That's not how tax brackets work, how did you even get 12 upvotes
Following
Dude I’m sorry. Are you able to make ends meet? What can we do?
Dude don’t feel that way. I’m not one who believes the virus is a hoax, so I’ll say that at least as far as I know, it’s no one’s fault you’re out of work, least of all your own. And if I’m wrong, and it is all a work, it’s still not on you. You’re not a loser, brother. You’ll be back in business before too long. What is it that you do if you don’t mind saying?
Just because the virus is real doesn't mean it isn't anyone's fault his business is suffering. These governors should hang.
Hang in there man. That's EXACTLY what this is about for politicians; this is a way for them to impose their will become little dictators. They want your business crushed so that you have to be dependent on them. They're absolute scum.
Cousin It and Captain Cuck won’t be able to suppress you and your business forever. Hang in there, and you will make it to the other side. A lot of businesses are hanging in for dear life in PA because of Wolf and the clown car that he brought in to run PA
if only we could get a pedefund.win
Yea how's that impeachment going? I'm sick of his dictator role play.
It's because he can and no one will do anything about it, which is maddening. One thing is for sure - a shit storm is coming this November when so many (D) lose due to being MFing 'activists' instead of doing their GD jobs. Our PA governor is not up for election, but he will feel the political change come November. Mark. My. Words.
Tarred and feathered together.
Payroll suspension, if it isn't just a deferral, would hit the turbo button on the economy once work is legalized. Be ready to work your ass off and make it back.
Wew. Never thought I would see a hard hitting fact of our country right now.
See This guy's take
Maybe the change from deferral to suspension will be a campaign issue
A deferral would be fucking worthless and would it would be I’ll Advised for any pede to bother with taking it.
You have a lot of support here. Hang in there. That sounds so rough, man. Essentially I think the Dems are punishing us for voting for Trump. Especially Pennsylvania, which hadn't voted red for years. It's awful. You are among frens here.
God bless, stay strong.
I am and have been blessed man. My life hasn't really been affected. In fact, I've been working about 50 hours a week the last month and a half.
I feel for the small business owners. I've dabbled in entrepreneurship but never been too successful. I got a lot of respect for yall. It pisses me off.
I think this whole thing has been a deliberate attempt to shake out small businesses and consolidate towards the top. They've let all the big stores stay in business but attacked the mom and pops. It's some evil times we're in. Hope everything works out.
yep
Username appreciation comment 😄
Taxation is robbery. Inflation is theft (a hidden tax)
This fucking GOD EMPEROR. Protect him with your lives.
That’s when he introduces the presidential alert system and starts blowing up everyone’s phones.
What does this mean exactly? Will workers see more money, or is this just going to help the business?
EDIT: Thanks for the replies, but I'm a cynic and will believe I have a bigger paycheck when I see a bigger paycheck.
LOL and a lot of other taxes if you live in a (D) fucking state.
It's true, I got a 10% raise for simply moving out of California.
Social Security is the world's biggest and most government-funded Ponzi scheme in history. It literally requires the population to perpetually remain a sharp pyramid, with vastly more youthful workers feeding the fund than retirees draining it, while also requiring inflation to stay at 0% in order for the money put in to match with the money that would later be taken out.
At no point in human history could it ever function as originally described. At best, it's constantly stealing money from the young to give a tiny stipend to the old. At worst, it's nothing more than a giant slush fund to be frivolously used/abused by any politician who even glances in its general direction for more than 2 seconds.
No money will be taken out of your paycheck for taxes.
Payroll taxes are the taxes taken out of your paycheck besides income tax:FICA, Medicare, idk some other bullshit. It is not a tax break for some who is paying a “payroll”
Damn that’s serious. I was about to check my last paystub and see what I’d be looking at
Workers will see more money now, and get ass raped next tax season when they owe it all back.
On top of the first stimulus checks that we’ll have to pay back.
If you’re salaried, take your gross pay per pay period and multiply by 7.65%. This will fall straight to your bottom line. Multiply by number of pay periods left in 2020 with your employer, that’s the total of TrumpBucks you’re getting from this stimulus in total.
Get fucked liberals without jobs screeching about this.
Reeeeee but lowering taxes doesn't help people who don't work!
My understanding is that the president can postpone/defer taxes but can’t forgive them. That would require Congress.
Paying people not to work is a perverse inventive. Rewarding them more for working is what we need. Payroll tax cut is great. Hopefully this will put incredible pressure on Congress. Trump will be able to campaign on, “if you don’t want to have to pay that back, vote Trump and republican!”
He does need to go more on helping us essentials out. Biden is going around claiming "He is our friend," Trump needs to counter that good and with stuff that will work or else Biden will swing some indy's away with that. Last thing we need.
I'm not super thrilled with the tax cut as my return won't be as big as I want next year so I hope something good comes out of it to make up if we can get Congress back.
Yes that would be true, if there was enough jobs for people to go back to. For those of us who live in smaller towns that's not necessarily an option. You think those people should just be screwed because the government decided to decimate the economy?
Will we have to pay that back though?
Not if you can live without it and work with a financial advisor to invest it (if you don't know how to work the market yourself).
If it gets suspended, what does that mean for my paycheck?
Means you keep more of what you make.
Yes, it's just that your employer is not deducting more than you owe, hence the tax refund at the end of the year. And you won't be giving the government an interest-free loan every week.
But you can choose your withholdings (allowances). I don't see how this helps the average worker. I'm happy to be wrong.
Can someone pls answer this dude I just wanna know if imma make more money
This is the social security and I believe medicare part of the taxes so your withholdings won't affect it
I'm not so sure that's true. My understanding is that Trump is allowing "employers to defer payment of the employee portion of payroll tax", which means that you would still have to withhold income tax from your paycheck (FICA, federal, and state taxes), but the employer does not have to remit the taxes until a later date if they elect to do so. It essentially allows business to have more cash in the near-term, but they have to be careful because eventually they will have to pay the tax when it becomes due. Please correct me if I am wrong.
No fed tax. Still FICA I believe
correct, would take an act of congress to touch those
Payroll taxes are FICA and Medicare if I’m not mistaken
FICA is Social Secuirty (6.2%) and Medicare (1.45%).
Yes, double that. I was clarifying exactly what FICA was for the previous poster. Also as others have pointed out, unless you are a 1099 employee or business owner that pays yourself wages, you will see a 7.65% savings unless/until YTD gross pay hits $137,700 before year-end, in which case the Soc Security portion (6.2%) is waived.
All the taxes that typically get taken out besides income tax ( FICA, Medicare, I think there’s another stupid one) won’t come out. Your net pay will go up probably significantly
But they’re only deferred, so you’re getting more money now but going to have a pretty big bill at the end of the year.
You’re right- some places are calling them suspended, some are calling them “cuts” and then later in the article calling them deferrals.
Fake Fox News suggested he might campaign on cancelling them which would be great.
Yes. Some people will find that option attractive though and would rather have the money now for present expenses. The IRS also has options for payment plans, which while not ideal, still give you time to get things back together.
Being in debt but able to pay bills and live inside a building is a much better situation than trying to start over as a homeless person.
That’s true. I just want to be able to opt out because I highly doubt even a solidly Republican Congress will approve of actually canceling the taxes.
There was some fear mongering from lefty rags that employers would still withhold it so they don't end up on the hook if you leave the job, but my guess is Trump will have the IRS work a repayment provision into the 1040 for 2021. There's already a way to pay these taxes on the 1040 if you're self employed, or get a refund if you make over the SS cap through multiple jobs.
If you make, say, 25 dollars an hour, that is the equivalent of a 4-5 dollar an hour raise.
This guy womps. Thanks for doing the math and knowing the exact percentages.
My raise this year was like $1, which is sad. $5 would be great!
God, this man is the greatest friend the working class has ever had in the White House. All this winning. It’s almost too much. 😄
Taxes should never be taken out of paychecks. Pay taxes once per year at tax time. The way the current scam runs, the cattle never feel the real burden of taxes.
It's a deferral, not suspension. You still get taxed later. We need to get cuts, not deferrals.
Exactly this otherwise I expect everybody soaking up all that unemployment to pay that shit back as well.
Pulled this from Motley Fool:
Traditionally, Democrats have favored payroll tax cuts because these cuts provide a direct tax cut that benefits workers over investors since payroll taxes are only paid on income from work and not on investment income. Because payroll taxes are paid only on income up to the wage base limit, a payroll tax cut also disproportionally benefits low and middle income workers who are taxed on their entire salaries instead of only on part of their income. These workers typically spend -- rather than save -- the extra money, bolstering the economy by helping businesses.
Now bring back the gold standard, declare a jubilee, and end the fed.
If you just stopped rolling down the hill, wed have already done all that
Watch NY use the opportunity to raise taxes and lose even more citizens!
I hope you're wrong, but I know you're right...
IL too.
Fucking Pritzker is about to put a tax on the air we breathe.
Lets get some overtime boys!
GET RID OF THE ILLEGAL AND UNCONSTITUTIONAL INCOME TAX
NO ONE SHOULD BE PUNISHED BECAUSE THEY CAME TO AN AGREEMENT TO DO SOMETHING IN EXCHANGE FOR SOMETHING ELSE.
THE INCOME TAX WAS FORCED UPON THIS NATION.
ALSO, END THE FUCKING FED.
So I will be saving about 7.65% and my company (small company under 500) will save another 7.65%
Yes!
Just read somewhere, I think Care Act already having company saving on payroll taxes right no? Nice A reduction of almost $400+ per pay period
Defer? Does that mean it needs to be payed at the end of the year or is he taking it to zero?
Payed by July 1
Thanks!
How does a retroactive tax deferment work? Wasn’t it already taken out of a paycheck?
I don’t think this is a misstep. The details just need to be clear. Is he taking the tax rate to zero or is everyone just getting a bill in a few months? I don’t know if he has the power to completely eliminate the payroll tax or if he only has the power to delay it. If he can only delay it, then this makes a lot of sense.
I love low taxes but we need to cut spending. We’re gonna get a wealth tax through inflation if we don’t cut spending, as well
Yeah these stimulus bills are going to rape our savings
Yup, there’s an economic shit storm on the horizon but most can’t see it because they can’t grasp the consequences of our monetary policies
Somewhere in the future I am hoping that the federal reserve is gone, and our savings will actually be worth something again. Trump is the man to do it!
KEEP AMERICA GREAT
I personally am probably not going to benefit much from the payroll tax cuts but I think a lot of people will. More student loan deferments will be a huge boon. All in all Covid has put enough in my pockets to just about pay off the whole thing in a lump sum. Anyone with student debt please be smart and use this time to attack that principle balance of you can.
I love the student loan interest deferment! I bumped my payments up a little bit even because I love watching the principle fall so much faster.
Actually that’s not a smart play. Government backed public student loan debt sucks for society, but it’s ‘good’ debt to an individual. If you don’t have private loans, there’s no reason to pay off any student loans with a rate generally below a 4-5%. You’re better off minimizing your payment and investing the rest and turn a 6-10% yearly with it.
Besides. It’d be my luck I make my last payment right before they wipe them all. (Not likely or desired...I’ll pay my debt back, but that’s exactly what would happen; I know it!)
Smart play is owing nothing to nobody, imho.
Certainly won’t argue with that.
The sneaky, low risk, cleverly smart play is to make money with money that costs nothing, so you have more money at the end of the year, and can pay off the loan quicker overall.
If you make money, and you haven't made 135k by July 1st, you should be benefiting.
Trump is going to end the abuses of the fed. Follow X22report on youtube.
Oh man, I fuckin' love it!!
He knows tariffs are bringing in a huge amount and it could be more. China has a disaster happening, even if the 3 Gorges Dam holds up. There is massive flooding above and below the dam. Crops are ruined and winter is on the way. They will be forced to buy food elsewhere. On top of that, the dam is damaged.
In principle, I support the move. In practice I have several questions, chief among them: How?
Is he simply directing federal agencies not to collect the taxes? He would seemingly be in his rights to do so, but that does nothing about whatever or not you, as a citizen, owe them.
A complicated move here. It was probably his best available play. Lot of questions.
TRUMP 2020
Agencies can’t pass laws, but agencies pass rules. They will establish a new Treasury agency rule that suspends the collection mechanism, and guidance will go out to satellite offices and industry associations to recommend accountants adjust their tax guidance to their customers. Software companies like Intuit will adjust their code to recalculate deductions after they have some time, and that will be it.
That’s exactly what happened after the CARES act passed. About a month into it, options appeared in QuickBooks payroll to add PTO options to staff for the three options for expanded leave, and the payroll tax reports automatically deduct the tax credit for your payments out to the Treasury.
Right so he’s directing that the taxes not be collected. But don’t the citizens still owe them?
That’s the part of the final rule we will have to see. Laws are written but rules set processes on how to apply them. We will see where this lands. They could set it to be paid back spread over multiple years for all we know right now.
Well i know Mnuchin was working on a new relief effort and was very hush hush about the details last month when they inquired about it. Maybe this was it? Instead of everyone getting 1 check, we all get to keep 8% of our paychecks until the end of the year.
I'm sure the "How" part has already been figured out, and the plans for it will be rolled out in a press conference in the near future I suspect.
Gonna be interesting for sure.
I'll take, or keep, what I can get. When Dems get back into power they are going to tax the fuck out of us to make up for all this lost revenue.
Then they will lose their power again. People are short sighted. They don’t care how or why, they just know if they are getting less on their check.
Hell Yes! I just saved 15.3% for a few months and I’m saving 7.65% off all my employees AND they just got a 7.65% raise. I’m tired ATM, but I ain’t tired of winning. Love this POTUS.
Most people don’t even know the employers pay that. It’s not like you accept a job at $12/hr including employer payroll tax. It’s an employer tax not an employee tax. Why shouldn’t they keep it?
Actually I just realize you don’t know that the employee pays 7.65% AND the employer pays 7.65% as well.
It's not free money. It's MY money. And YOUR money we get to keep in our paychecks. Sweet.
Finally. Tired of seeing these fuckers whistling and jogging every morning while I gotta fight traffic to go to my shitty job
I am in MN and after king walz's mask decree there were all kinds of openings at the factory I work at.
He said that by the end of 2020 the payroll tax break could be extended.
“Hopefully I’ll be here to do the job,” Trump said, hinting at the results of Election Day.
**slow clap, then happy dance! 😄
yeah its a deferral, not a suspension or a cut
I’ll give you an upvote to bring you back to zero, and just add that these are usually taken out of a future tax CREDIT, so it isn’t something someone would pay BACK, but it would certainly reduce a future refund. That however, could happen via an adjustment to the standard deduction, etc. so it’ll go unnoticed by most.
Yeah, can you imagine that negotiation 6 months from now? Who has the upper hand? The guy who wants to let you keep your money or the guy who wants you to pay it back? This is a brilliant move.
Yeah? I mean, "bribing" voters with their own money is pretty okay with me. Do you mean "tax credits" instead of "tax cuts"?
Well the plan was to increase tax receipts with low unemployment, withdrawal troops from foreign wars and re-negotiate the bad trade deals in our favor. I'm assuming you are libertarian and want small government. Tell me, what has Rand and Ron done the past 3 decades in Congress that we could emulate on a large scale to reduce the national debt?
Hmm...interesting. Let me make sure I understand you. The Trump Tax Cuts was in 2017. Was the federal tax revenue in FY2019 higher or lower than FY2017? Was the massive Trump tax cuts able to generate enough growth to offset the initial loss of revenue?
I think we’re just speaking from different reference points. It isn’t paid back if it happens this way, it is simply a tax credit taken EARLY.
Again, that’s only if this is the avenue it plays out. We still don’t know the details.
Interesting. First time I've read this information.
Just saying it’s one of many possibilities.
It's late for me to be doing maths, but if you claim the right amount of exemptions on your W-4, you don't usually owe or get much of a refund. Claiming the right amount of exemptions lets you keep most of your money, without anticipating a refund (read: giving the government an interest free loan).
Now, if you are claiming the right amount of exemptions, and they defer the payroll tax, aren't you going to either make the adjustment to your W-4, claiming zero exemptions, or have to bank the "extra" cash you are now getting to pay back, because now you will be getting "more" on your checks?
I am not a tax person at all, I am just wondering how exemptions are offset from a payroll rax deferral.
You don’t adjust your w4. Even last year with the payroll tax change, the withholdings just updated on the payroll softwares and the manual tax spreadsheets (if anyone does payroll taxes manually when hand writing checks.)
W4s just tell your employer how much to withhold, based on selecting IRS criteria. You don’t say ‘24% bracket’, you say ‘head of household’ etc.
The # of exemptions actually doesn’t exist anymore on the w4. They took that away in 2019.
This still doesn't answer my question. I can still claim dependents and filing status on my W-4. And it impacts how much I owe, or get a refund on.
It sounds like a payroll tax deferment would by like claiming exempt from withholding by default, if it is "automatic", meaning I start seeing more money on my check, but they still want it back at some point. People might not be cognizant of this until tax season, and that money may already be spent, then you might have to pay "double" taxes to catch up through the next tax season, if you can't pay it when the deferment comes due. Am I not being clear with what I am asking?
You are clear, and I understand your statement. What we are missing each other on the main theme. I describe altering the standard deduction above, but the most likely scenario is they would be giving you a reduction in your withholdings as an 'early' refundable credit anyway. So getting it this year (spread across six months’ paychecks) would simply remove it from a future year...it isn't owing more taxes when you do that year, it is just getting that credit now...(and still getting this year’s) You are envisioning a loan, to be paid back. I’m describing an advance on a future discount, so to speak. A discount you get every year, so this year you get it twice, next year none. Not a loan, just early.
On the exemptions: The IRS dropped them last year, and you don't get to claim the arbitrary numbers you used to. There is no way to file exempt now when you are not exempt. There is no way to lower your taxes either....you used to enter extra exemptions, but that is gone. The only options is to pre-calculate your estimated deductions v. the standard deduction (pg. 3) and/or reduce the amount of withholdings directly related to your child tax credit (see step 3 on the form, it's in dollars now) IF you will make low enough to claim it. For a reference, here is the current W4
They are going to be pissed when the Republicans introduce a bill to cancel it and th Democrats vote against it.
Hoooolyyyyyy fuck.
This is HUGE.
Make it permanent, "Taxation for Revenue Is Obsolete" - Beardsley Ruml"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfZCdISWgx0
I love Donald Trump.
They'll call him a racist for this, since it primarily helps the employed.
Blacks are getting reemployed at the same rate as Whites right now.
Nothing for illegals and people who get paid under the table, Democrat RRREEEEE in 3-2-1
Man is extra spicy today!
Best news I've heard all day
This doesn’t say that he's done it. This says he’s still considering.
Should be signed by the end of the coming week.
I understand. But SHOULD AND COULD doesn’t mean HAS AND WILL. Fucking title is misleading.
Retroactive! Retroactive! I can not contain my excitement. This is real conservatism, what many of us have had a mere pipe dream of for decades.
This is a big deal. 7.5% tax cut for voters. Dems cant say its "for the rich" either. Let voters see Democrats openly plot against them
Brilliant.
This is one hell of a power move.