The way I've come to see it compared to how it was presented to us months ago is, basically, that it's just a nasty flu. I wouldn't want to catch it. But, then, that doesn't say much because I don't want to catch anything. Even then, we HAVE treatments for it. If I did get it I'd just ask my doc to hook me up with some dat hydroxy and zinc.
You do want to catch it depending on your age. Catch things young while your immune system is still working full steam. You develop antibodies that remember and can stop new strains in advance.
Bruh, measles has most of the same symptoms. Similar symptoms =/= same virus.
It isn't a "cold" or "flu". The problem is that "coronavirus" is an entire family of viruses, and that the antibodies these tests look for are not designed to be specific to a particular species of virus. Antibodies typically follow an "induced fit" rule, meaning that if a virus is "close enough", they will attach to said virus. Since SARS1, SARS2, MERS, and the four or so different human coronavirus species that can cause the common cold are all part of this same family, their surface membranes are likely similar enough that these antibodies will react the same way to all of them.
I've read a lot of things. From "it's a pneumonia but different because it attacks both lungs" to "it gets in the blood and frees the iron in hemoglobins, leading to hyperemia, and putting patients on respirators is the wrong way to go about it because no matter how much oxygen you put in their lungs, there's not enough hemoglobin to transport it when symptoms show up and they get diagnosed" or even "it can attack nerves as seen in patients who have lost the senses of taste and smell".
They're saying that strains of coronavirus are associated with the common cold which has been a thing before SARS-CoV-2. The antibody test doesn't seem to be specific enough to differentiate SARS-CoV-2 from other strains of coronavirus.
Exactly this. It's not that SARS-CoV-2 is the common cold (it's not; colds are caused by a variety of things from coronaviruses--around 20%--to rhinoviruses), it's that the IgG/IgM tests can't differentiate between it.
That means that all the estimates they've done based on previous penetration of this virus are completely untrustworthy. So this idea that there's as many as 10x the number of people who are positive based on antibody assays is almost certainly bunk. We have no way of knowing.
That means it's not an admission this is less serious than they're claiming. It's that they're actively lying to us about either the extent of the virus and its spread, its infectiousness, or both.
Thank you, this is the best explanation posted so far. I was going to post something similar.
Depending on the source, 15-25% of common colds worldwide are caused by one of four coronaviruses that have become endemic in the human population (there are more, but they don't affect people). I don't remember the origin, but they have mutated to the point that they are mostly benign.
10-40% of colds (again, depends on the cited source) are caused by a rhinovirus. 20% are caused by RSV or parainfluenza (which is different than influenza, but can be severe). Another 20-30% are caused by an unidentified virus.
If you had a cold "recently" and it was caused by a coronavirus, it MAY have conferred some amount of immunity to COVID-19 (and may be one of the factors on the severity of your illness). And as the previous comment says: the similarity between COVID-19 and a common cold coronavirus may result in a falsely positive COVID-19 antibody test.
But, I don't think anyone is intentionally lying, other than perhaps the Misleadia. The people doing these tests and compiling the data know and understand the limitations. But, by the time it makes it to CNN, it's trumpeted to uninformed viewers (on CNN, that's all of them) without the qualifiers.
Knowing this, I get really surprised to hear somebody get negative result. It is actually very difficult to get negative result unless you've never had any cold-like symptoms. I've had at least 4-5 times I felt like I had a cold because I got some coughs and sinus annoyance since November or something. I got a cold last November which lasted for a few weeks, and had some symptoms 3-4 times since the end of March, which went away in a few or even next day.
I will be surprised to see if I have negative now. I should get positive if I take the test.
I want to say that the way cases were counted changed to consider every positive antibody test as a new case. They were in essence counting COVID cases that very well could have been someone coming into contact with any given coronavirus, in that case.
I provided facts. You viewed them as me defending something. I was simply stating the way things are.
SARS-CoV-2 is beyond the common cold in terms of its virulence, but it is absolutely being overblown by the media. People of higher age and others with co-morbidities do get hit pretty hard by it. Younger healthier people handle it fine, statistically speaking.
It's a cold that can cause serious symptoms in the old and frail. That's why it killed so many in nursing homes but it only killed them a few weeks or months earlier than they would've died otherwise.
The flu can kill a bunch of people, and it does, but like covid 1984 most people have no to very mild symptoms.
I was supposed to have a medical procedure done but they said I had to have a CV screening before. I cancelled it and told them why. I'm not going to be entered into the government database with their case tracers and other bullshit. I haven't been sick with anything, but it could come back positive because we know they're being disingenuous and even falsifying lab results.
Then they would be contacting my family members who could then have their jobs at risk. I'm not playing their game and that procedure can hold. On that same note, the gal I spoke with at the medical office was based and completely understood my reason for cancelling. She knew exactly what it means to be screened.
People have actually been KILLED due to false positive tests, negative tests, and about every other situation that involves being ventilated for no sane reason.
Like most of us here, I'm not a tin-foil hat conspiracy theorist. At the very beginning, I was uncertain about the virus and what it really was. It was then revealed to those paying attention what it became, a political tool for society manipulation.
There is NOTHING about CV the media or government (feds, state and local) can tell me that I would believe. I distrust all of them. I do trust Trump because I believe he's really trying to find a way out of this that is quick and doesn't involve any tyranny or destruction of the economy.
This just happened a good friend of mine in late July, There was a prison outbreak so they forced all the staff to get tested, He tested positive despite having zero symptoms meanwhile his wife and their kid tested negative but the state(CA) sent the whole family(including his parents since he visited them a few days prior) orders with each of their names printed on them saying they have to spend 14 days quarantined or face a fine or jail. THE ENTIRE FAMILY. Meanwhile my friend tested negative 6 days later. So that potential fake positive caused 3 people in the family to have to give up their jobs for 2 weeks family friends had to go to the grocery store for them since they had a CA order saying they are basically under house arrest.
We know this shit is going on. I'm in Texas and I still don't trust any of them right now. Spend a little time here on T_D and you pick up a lot of information that's not covered by the media or is being completely suppressed. We're also good about providing legit, based sources to information and that's what makes T_D such a great place!
I'm not disagreeing with you, but a lot of people don't understand the difference between an antibody test vs. the test to see if you currently have the virus.
The antibody test in particular is the one that can't differentiate between coronavirus and SARS-CoV-2.
PCR test is also plagued with false positives. Even the inventor of the test said it’s especially susceptible to false positives (false negatives do happen but the nature of this method skews far to the false positive). Every test has the potential to give a false positive and it’s heavily influenced by the tech that runs it. If you run enough cycles there is a point where it will throw a positive.
It depends on the jurisdiction. My county health department does not include antibody tests. They only report confirmed COVID-19 cases, with the nose swab and a PCR.
I won't claim my entire state does this, because I don't follow the 200+ counties. But, my state mandates that all confirmed cases require a PCR test. They have a separate classification for ""probable" cases, and a positive antibody test is only considered "probable" if the symptoms meet the clinical criteria.
Some counties in my state may be combining "confirmed" and "probable" cases in their reporting. But, my county does not.
I was absent when this happened, can you link me to a source for the double counting? I can see where the false positive accusations are coming from but I don’t know where the double dipping accusation is coming from. I assume this was covered early when I wasn’t active.
It's worse than merely double counting. tons of people got out of line instead of waiting hours to be tested. They were given positive test results.
Tons of Drs have sent off 6 tests that were never used to get tested, and had them all return positive.
We should be going by Dr diagnosis, and immediately giving medicine to those at risk. This could've been brought to a screeching halt in March! 40+ Governors are mass murderers. We should file class action lawsuits, both civil and criminal, against their every act of tyranny. Then physically remove them from Office under citizen's arrest for mass murder.
That video is over 2 hours long and I'm not saying it's not worth watching the whole thing. 16:15 shows a screen shot of one major problem. 15:30 introduces this speaker, who is a purple haired land whale that starts at 16:00. Or maybe that's a Muslim head covering over more normal hair? Either way, we see what it takes to peddle this bs.
Easily multiply actual cases by 10. Deaths? Who knows, but it's exaggerated and many Drs from all over the Country have come forward about this.
Look at the total death rate from all causes and we are below 2019 and all other recent years. That could not happen if we were dealing with a deadly pandemic.
Yep. But in a lot of states, testing positive means quarantine. Mandatory. I've had no flu or cold symptoms since this all started, so I haven't bothered. I just think it's too risky.
The hilarious thing is - and fucking maddening - is I get allergies, most of the year. I can take OTC like Flonase, and I'm fine, but if I forget, then it's sniffles and teary eyes, the whole deal - and morons think I have covid. IT'S NOT FUCKING COVID, I'M NOT COUGHING, MORON. So i carry a bottle of Flonase, instead of a phone.
You're lucky. I normally get allergies, and don't respond well to medication. Fortunately for me that's only during growing season, which is short in WI. Labor Day is typically my worst.
The initial spread of COVID-19 to my state from NY/CT/NJ (and the rest of the US) coincided with the start of spring allergy season. Due to a mild winter, the crap in the air was much worse than usual, and people that normally didn't have significant allergic reactions were experiencing them for the first time. So, a lot of people were panicking. But, a couple of days of Zyrtec and Flonase was all they needed to get it under control.
If I don't keep my allergies under control, I get a lot of sinus drainage into my throat while I sleep, and the irritation causes a dry cough during the day. I carry a bottle of water if it gets too bad.
I also cough as a side-effect of (3-seasons, ugh) seasonal allergies.
I don't smoke, but instead of trying to explain to people the process behind allergies and an immune system because most people without allergies seem incredibly uneducated on the subject, I just say "smoker's cough, don't fly into a tizzy".
So did they just lowkey admit that the tests have been identifying ANY coronavirus?
The way I've come to see it compared to how it was presented to us months ago is, basically, that it's just a nasty flu. I wouldn't want to catch it. But, then, that doesn't say much because I don't want to catch anything. Even then, we HAVE treatments for it. If I did get it I'd just ask my doc to hook me up with some dat hydroxy and zinc.
You do want to catch it depending on your age. Catch things young while your immune system is still working full steam. You develop antibodies that remember and can stop new strains in advance.
You can't get HCQ unless you live in one of a very few States.
Bruh, measles has most of the same symptoms. Similar symptoms =/= same virus.
It isn't a "cold" or "flu". The problem is that "coronavirus" is an entire family of viruses, and that the antibodies these tests look for are not designed to be specific to a particular species of virus. Antibodies typically follow an "induced fit" rule, meaning that if a virus is "close enough", they will attach to said virus. Since SARS1, SARS2, MERS, and the four or so different human coronavirus species that can cause the common cold are all part of this same family, their surface membranes are likely similar enough that these antibodies will react the same way to all of them.
I ENVY MUH DEAD
Fauci also said this.
Too bad his worshippers all have short term memory loss
And my favorite “no one healthy should be wearing a mask (in late March)
I think it's less memory loss and more "TEH SCIENCE IS ALWAYS CHANGING!!!"
It's actually a pneumonia, but any upper respiratory infection will have the same symptoms.
I've read a lot of things. From "it's a pneumonia but different because it attacks both lungs" to "it gets in the blood and frees the iron in hemoglobins, leading to hyperemia, and putting patients on respirators is the wrong way to go about it because no matter how much oxygen you put in their lungs, there's not enough hemoglobin to transport it when symptoms show up and they get diagnosed" or even "it can attack nerves as seen in patients who have lost the senses of taste and smell".
They're saying that strains of coronavirus are associated with the common cold which has been a thing before SARS-CoV-2. The antibody test doesn't seem to be specific enough to differentiate SARS-CoV-2 from other strains of coronavirus.
Exactly this. It's not that SARS-CoV-2 is the common cold (it's not; colds are caused by a variety of things from coronaviruses--around 20%--to rhinoviruses), it's that the IgG/IgM tests can't differentiate between it.
That means that all the estimates they've done based on previous penetration of this virus are completely untrustworthy. So this idea that there's as many as 10x the number of people who are positive based on antibody assays is almost certainly bunk. We have no way of knowing.
That means it's not an admission this is less serious than they're claiming. It's that they're actively lying to us about either the extent of the virus and its spread, its infectiousness, or both.
Thank you, this is the best explanation posted so far. I was going to post something similar.
Depending on the source, 15-25% of common colds worldwide are caused by one of four coronaviruses that have become endemic in the human population (there are more, but they don't affect people). I don't remember the origin, but they have mutated to the point that they are mostly benign.
10-40% of colds (again, depends on the cited source) are caused by a rhinovirus. 20% are caused by RSV or parainfluenza (which is different than influenza, but can be severe). Another 20-30% are caused by an unidentified virus.
If you had a cold "recently" and it was caused by a coronavirus, it MAY have conferred some amount of immunity to COVID-19 (and may be one of the factors on the severity of your illness). And as the previous comment says: the similarity between COVID-19 and a common cold coronavirus may result in a falsely positive COVID-19 antibody test.
But, I don't think anyone is intentionally lying, other than perhaps the Misleadia. The people doing these tests and compiling the data know and understand the limitations. But, by the time it makes it to CNN, it's trumpeted to uninformed viewers (on CNN, that's all of them) without the qualifiers.
Knowing this, I get really surprised to hear somebody get negative result. It is actually very difficult to get negative result unless you've never had any cold-like symptoms. I've had at least 4-5 times I felt like I had a cold because I got some coughs and sinus annoyance since November or something. I got a cold last November which lasted for a few weeks, and had some symptoms 3-4 times since the end of March, which went away in a few or even next day.
I will be surprised to see if I have negative now. I should get positive if I take the test.
Well shit. Gotta fix this too.
I want to say that the way cases were counted changed to consider every positive antibody test as a new case. They were in essence counting COVID cases that very well could have been someone coming into contact with any given coronavirus, in that case.
I provided facts. You viewed them as me defending something. I was simply stating the way things are.
SARS-CoV-2 is beyond the common cold in terms of its virulence, but it is absolutely being overblown by the media. People of higher age and others with co-morbidities do get hit pretty hard by it. Younger healthier people handle it fine, statistically speaking.
It's a cold that can cause serious symptoms in the old and frail. That's why it killed so many in nursing homes but it only killed them a few weeks or months earlier than they would've died otherwise.
The flu can kill a bunch of people, and it does, but like covid 1984 most people have no to very mild symptoms.
LOL okay tough guy, what're you going to do about it?
I was supposed to have a medical procedure done but they said I had to have a CV screening before. I cancelled it and told them why. I'm not going to be entered into the government database with their case tracers and other bullshit. I haven't been sick with anything, but it could come back positive because we know they're being disingenuous and even falsifying lab results.
Then they would be contacting my family members who could then have their jobs at risk. I'm not playing their game and that procedure can hold. On that same note, the gal I spoke with at the medical office was based and completely understood my reason for cancelling. She knew exactly what it means to be screened.
People have actually been KILLED due to false positive tests, negative tests, and about every other situation that involves being ventilated for no sane reason.
Like most of us here, I'm not a tin-foil hat conspiracy theorist. At the very beginning, I was uncertain about the virus and what it really was. It was then revealed to those paying attention what it became, a political tool for society manipulation.
There is NOTHING about CV the media or government (feds, state and local) can tell me that I would believe. I distrust all of them. I do trust Trump because I believe he's really trying to find a way out of this that is quick and doesn't involve any tyranny or destruction of the economy.
GOOD FOR YOU!
I wish more people understood this. And they say our healthcare system is systemic racism? Oy vey.
This just happened a good friend of mine in late July, There was a prison outbreak so they forced all the staff to get tested, He tested positive despite having zero symptoms meanwhile his wife and their kid tested negative but the state(CA) sent the whole family(including his parents since he visited them a few days prior) orders with each of their names printed on them saying they have to spend 14 days quarantined or face a fine or jail. THE ENTIRE FAMILY. Meanwhile my friend tested negative 6 days later. So that potential fake positive caused 3 people in the family to have to give up their jobs for 2 weeks family friends had to go to the grocery store for them since they had a CA order saying they are basically under house arrest.
DO NOT GET TESTED IF YOU ARE NOT SICK.
We know this shit is going on. I'm in Texas and I still don't trust any of them right now. Spend a little time here on T_D and you pick up a lot of information that's not covered by the media or is being completely suppressed. We're also good about providing legit, based sources to information and that's what makes T_D such a great place!
We need reparations for not being locked down for all of history!
Not so; there are a good number of coronavirus, and one of them is the most prevalent strain of common cold that essentially everyone will catch.
What this proves is that the numbers mean fuck-all if testing can be positive for people who have had ANY coronavirus.
It also proves a flawed methodology if the testing can't specifically pinpoint this virus.
For the antibody test, yes.
I'm not disagreeing with you, but a lot of people don't understand the difference between an antibody test vs. the test to see if you currently have the virus.
The antibody test in particular is the one that can't differentiate between coronavirus and SARS-CoV-2.
PCR test is also plagued with false positives. Even the inventor of the test said it’s especially susceptible to false positives (false negatives do happen but the nature of this method skews far to the false positive). Every test has the potential to give a false positive and it’s heavily influenced by the tech that runs it. If you run enough cycles there is a point where it will throw a positive.
This is literally what happened with Alyssa Milano. Who tested negative on the pcr test.
BUT SHE'S LOSING HER HAIR
It depends on the jurisdiction. My county health department does not include antibody tests. They only report confirmed COVID-19 cases, with the nose swab and a PCR.
I won't claim my entire state does this, because I don't follow the 200+ counties. But, my state mandates that all confirmed cases require a PCR test. They have a separate classification for ""probable" cases, and a positive antibody test is only considered "probable" if the symptoms meet the clinical criteria.
Some counties in my state may be combining "confirmed" and "probable" cases in their reporting. But, my county does not.
goldfish...
I was absent when this happened, can you link me to a source for the double counting? I can see where the false positive accusations are coming from but I don’t know where the double dipping accusation is coming from. I assume this was covered early when I wasn’t active.
It's worse than merely double counting. tons of people got out of line instead of waiting hours to be tested. They were given positive test results.
Tons of Drs have sent off 6 tests that were never used to get tested, and had them all return positive.
We should be going by Dr diagnosis, and immediately giving medicine to those at risk. This could've been brought to a screeching halt in March! 40+ Governors are mass murderers. We should file class action lawsuits, both civil and criminal, against their every act of tyranny. Then physically remove them from Office under citizen's arrest for mass murder.
That video is over 2 hours long and I'm not saying it's not worth watching the whole thing. 16:15 shows a screen shot of one major problem. 15:30 introduces this speaker, who is a purple haired land whale that starts at 16:00. Or maybe that's a Muslim head covering over more normal hair? Either way, we see what it takes to peddle this bs.
Easily multiply actual cases by 10. Deaths? Who knows, but it's exaggerated and many Drs from all over the Country have come forward about this.
Look at the total death rate from all causes and we are below 2019 and all other recent years. That could not happen if we were dealing with a deadly pandemic.
Yep. But in a lot of states, testing positive means quarantine. Mandatory. I've had no flu or cold symptoms since this all started, so I haven't bothered. I just think it's too risky.
The hilarious thing is - and fucking maddening - is I get allergies, most of the year. I can take OTC like Flonase, and I'm fine, but if I forget, then it's sniffles and teary eyes, the whole deal - and morons think I have covid. IT'S NOT FUCKING COVID, I'M NOT COUGHING, MORON. So i carry a bottle of Flonase, instead of a phone.
You're lucky. I normally get allergies, and don't respond well to medication. Fortunately for me that's only during growing season, which is short in WI. Labor Day is typically my worst.
The initial spread of COVID-19 to my state from NY/CT/NJ (and the rest of the US) coincided with the start of spring allergy season. Due to a mild winter, the crap in the air was much worse than usual, and people that normally didn't have significant allergic reactions were experiencing them for the first time. So, a lot of people were panicking. But, a couple of days of Zyrtec and Flonase was all they needed to get it under control.
If I don't keep my allergies under control, I get a lot of sinus drainage into my throat while I sleep, and the irritation causes a dry cough during the day. I carry a bottle of water if it gets too bad.
I also cough as a side-effect of (3-seasons, ugh) seasonal allergies.
I don't smoke, but instead of trying to explain to people the process behind allergies and an immune system because most people without allergies seem incredibly uneducated on the subject, I just say "smoker's cough, don't fly into a tizzy".
Sounds like it