Yet today Newsweek publishes that Sweden failed to reach herd immunity and that the doctor that lead the charge has regrets that it failed.
Edit: Doctor states he may have locked down the old people sooner
Clown world.
To answer the idiots.
Yes Sweden reached herd immunity which means SARS-CoV-2 acted like every other virus in history.
Yes this strategy has higher deaths in the beginning and will end sooner while other countries MAY continue to have deaths in the future and catch up.
Yes people that were infected with SARS-CoV-1 in 2003 have shown to be immune to this virus.
Yes surrounding countries that locked down will spread it or be susceptible to future outbreaks unless it acts like SARS-CoV-1 and dies out on its own in 10 months (that would be August)
I left out that the SARS-CoV-2 antibody test is not very effective with after 3 months. It also seems SARS-CoV-1, the first corona virus also had the same problems with antibodies
T-cell immunity is the reason why. These viruses don't seem to cause humans to produce a lot of long-lasting antibodies, because the immune system uses a different tactic to fight it off.
If I had to give a hypothesis, based on my unverified and complete opinion on this, no facts or data involved, I would bet that Sweden has accurate reporting of COVID cases. If someone has COVID and is murdered, COVID isn't a cause of death. Same for a car accident.
I've seen too many reports of patients "dying of COVID" when they had other issues that would have given the same symptoms.
My wife is Swedish (and converted pede) and has been reading all about the Sweden approach and in regular contact with her family/friends, told me this is exactly right. They don’t play games in counting cases and C19 deaths. Their CDC by law is separated from their politics.
Already went state to state pulling records. California just had its first official Covid death of a Child. Except they won't tell you anything about it. County Health person also referenced it as "Covid Related Death"
disobedience.. no not really. Sweden's ruling party would have liked to do a "lock-down" but where constrained by anti-asshoe laws witch they tried to get repealed but where unsuccessful.
Swiss may have the best medical system in the world.
Sweden admits taking too long to lock down the elderly vs the Swiss. Since over 90% of deaths in Switzerland and Sweden were over 70.
Swiss did real contact tracing WITH blood work. They figured out children present first so they did not give it to family as was once thought
Both had the schools open. This means 30% of the population was allowed to catch it to go towards herd immunity.
Switzerland has a population of 8.5 million
Sweden has a population of 10.2
Sweden had 619 deaths under 70
Switzerland had 172 deaths under 70.
Swiss use chloroquine
Sweden stopped using chloroquine
Sweden has been opened
Switzerland has just allowed offices to open and dropped mandatory work from home
If you lock down you will stretch out the virus and exposure over time. The death numbers should look the same in the end. The real issue is what the numbers will look at in December
They most importantly Swiss locked down the elderly fast and not everyone down until April. They also have the most advanced contact tracing in the world
That's some good info. I believe it suffices to say that the wuhan virus is not an easy matter of "masks work, therefore mandatory state power" and "just let people live it's just a scare".
The virus is real and the virus does exist. And as always: don't watch CNN!
Flu deaths my inflate the numbers for Covid. So the hoax would be claiming FLU deaths as Covid. Also Look how bad the flu was this year, look at all deaths starting in January in the drop down in table one of the CDC. Select all deaths.
We got hit with a Flu pandemic at the same time. Without testing until April we had to create ASSUMED/PRESUMED Covid. Listen to everyone from February talking about Flu is more dangerous. Fauci said it on February 27th.
“These infection fatality rates are remarkably low and are similar to the fatality rate for the seasonal flu.”
“The virus is 10 times less fatal than we first thought.”
Dr. Rajiv Bhatia is an affiliated assistant clinical professor of Medicine at Stanford University. He is a former deputy health officer for the San Francisco Department of Public Health, [email protected]. Dr. Jeffrey Klausner is a professor of Medicine and Public Health at the University of California, Los Angeles.
“To properly assess the mortality risk associated with the coronavirus pandemic, it is necessary to examine deaths and death rates from all causes, not just deaths and death rates from COVID-19.”
They are asking this question because it is clear the Covid-19 numbers are highly inflated from other causes of death.
“During January-May 2020, the CDC and Department of Health and Human Services show about 120,000 total deaths in California, which is similar to the number during January-May 2018.”
They are comparing this current flu season against the last big pandemic that his us in 2017-2018 Flu season. The numbers look the same.
“Thus, the 2020 total death rates in California can be approximated by the 2018 total death rates, which are in the CDC’s WONDER database. I focus here on those under 65 years of age because they include students and most working-age people, and because COVID-19 deaths comprise only 3% of the total deaths in this age range during 2020.”
Yeah I am certain that 5 years from now, we will see that covid made only the slightest blip of increased deaths. Probably followed by a down year in 2021 because covid took out a few extra people a year early.
Betting the most it will be up is 10,000. Or basically 1 out of every 30,000 people.
If Sweden is doing BETTER than some countries that locked down and WORSE than some others, it just goes to argue that lockdowns have little actual meaning. Which is what my theory is: that people are being ridiculous. Picking up a straw off the ground and recycling it and thinking they just cleaned up the oceans.
But there is little point comparing countries. It arrived fully, for better or for worse, in Sweden and they have had 5700 deaths and the vast majority of those were much older people, many of whom were close to death already. And now it appears to be done and there is no worry of second waves. And businesses did not get ruined. Kids did not die.
When did Switzerland lock down? Comparing charts, it looks like Switzerland got slammed much harder and earlier than Sweden, while Sweden looks like more of a slow burn until more recently when cases spiked and then fell.
Seems to me that the virus has to run it's course, and nations that got hit earlier are in much better shape now than countries that have took early active measures. Time will tell which approach was better in terms of total economic loss and total loss of life.
Switzerland locked down in the middle of March, about 16th or so. I cannot say anything more about the seriousness of the hits, because it is also dependent on measurement of the virus. Switzerland had a limit of 2'000 tests per day for a long time. These 2'000 tests also included all mandatorily tested people.
Of course we should. It supposedly spreads in dogs and cats and on frozen dinners (literally). You can supposedly get it from touching a gas pump. You'll never stop something that spreads like that unless you are Iceland or New Zealand and can separate yourself from the world.
This whole thing has been laughably pointless since day one, other than "slowing the spread to keep hospitals from being overcrowded".
It's pointless anyway - like spitting in to a headwind: the only way the New Zealand experiment works out is if COVID-19 disappears from the rest of the world, having run its course (herd immunity, is that you??!?). Otherwise, the minute you open back up to the world, it all comes roaring in and you have the same problem you were just trying to avoid.
It's all so stupid. The good news is, here in NZ I've been taking the temperature of people's attitudes to things like further lockdown and mandatory masks (they're just "strongly encouraged" at this stage...) and people are just not having it. There's a strong feeling that enough is enough.
I don't know, because you can listen to some YouTubers that are over there and they're saying things are way worse and that the media over there is lying about it
So I went to the hospital when I heard they were lying to us and my local hospital was empty. Go to the hospital and look otherwise if a YouTube is not at the hospital with a camera they are full of bs
In the county where I live, there have been zero people under the age of 20 hospitalized (and 0 deaths)
There have only been 42 deaths in a county of nearly 500k. The whole thing is ridiculous
Yet today Newsweek publishes that Sweden failed to reach herd immunity and that the doctor that lead the charge has regrets that it failed.
Edit: Doctor states he may have locked down the old people sooner
Clown world.
To answer the idiots.
Yes Sweden reached herd immunity which means SARS-CoV-2 acted like every other virus in history.
Yes this strategy has higher deaths in the beginning and will end sooner while other countries MAY continue to have deaths in the future and catch up.
Yes people that were infected with SARS-CoV-1 in 2003 have shown to be immune to this virus.
Yes surrounding countries that locked down will spread it or be susceptible to future outbreaks unless it acts like SARS-CoV-1 and dies out on its own in 10 months (that would be August)
https://www.newsweek.com/sweden-emails-anders-tegnell-johan-giesecke-herd-immunity-coronavirus-1524847
I left out that the SARS-CoV-2 antibody test is not very effective with after 3 months. It also seems SARS-CoV-1, the first corona virus also had the same problems with antibodies
T-cell immunity is the reason why. These viruses don't seem to cause humans to produce a lot of long-lasting antibodies, because the immune system uses a different tactic to fight it off.
Is there any way to measure T-cell immunity?
No idea, I'm a software guy.
Can you make a program to help our bodies fight the disease?
If I could I would give it away for free, unlike Fauci and Co.
You're still alive aren't you ?
yes but it is lab tested and not office or hospital tested
Skin tests...like when you get TB tested.
21 here, about 250K in my county
So our two counties are pretty similar
If I had to give a hypothesis, based on my unverified and complete opinion on this, no facts or data involved, I would bet that Sweden has accurate reporting of COVID cases. If someone has COVID and is murdered, COVID isn't a cause of death. Same for a car accident.
I've seen too many reports of patients "dying of COVID" when they had other issues that would have given the same symptoms.
They call that "Covid related" and they are weasel words
Sweden counts deaths "with covid". Statistics counts everyone with a recent positive test. Probably not injures and trafic accidents though.
Many People younger than 55 in the statistics are probably cancer patients.
My wife is Swedish (and converted pede) and has been reading all about the Sweden approach and in regular contact with her family/friends, told me this is exactly right. They don’t play games in counting cases and C19 deaths. Their CDC by law is separated from their politics.
I'm not so sure, They have a wired cultural hive mind. Reporting deaths may make the government look too bad.
Hmyaokaybutexpertssolockdownagainwhynot?economywhatsthat?
Because kids are immune.
Any news story with "Child dies of covid" it is a gun shot wound, or car accident.
Take a look for yourself, be warned, some news articles won't even mention the actual cause of death. May need to dig.
Already went state to state pulling records. California just had its first official Covid death of a Child. Except they won't tell you anything about it. County Health person also referenced it as "Covid Related Death"
Ha! Did some digging and for one, it was a 17 year old, not a child at all. And two, he died of septic shock in the hospital. Not covid.
Viruses can cause sepsis.
I heard about one (forget where) that had just had a triple organ transplant. Media claimed "child died of Covid"
This mask and lockdown shit is so fucking stupid.
It's not stupid, it's target societal descruction. It's not an over reaction, it's a calculated tactic.
People are afraid of the truth Sweden proves. It proves it was all a lie, just a bad Flu.
Early on the MSM claimed Sweden would have piles of dead people in the street for disobeying the lock down order from their CCP masters.
disobedience.. no not really. Sweden's ruling party would have liked to do a "lock-down" but where constrained by anti-asshoe laws witch they tried to get repealed but where unsuccessful.
Sweden the freest nation on earth. heuheuheuehe
If our "leaders" were held to the US Constitution we would be the freest nation on the planet. Instead we have cucks who vote in criminals.
Playing devil's advocate here. Switzerland is basically the same size as Sweden but has had less deaths and cases.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/switzerland/
Switzerland had a lockdown and a campaign for "social distancing" (which is a misnomer, it should be called physical distancing).
Difference between Switzerland and Sweden
Swiss may have the best medical system in the world.
Sweden admits taking too long to lock down the elderly vs the Swiss. Since over 90% of deaths in Switzerland and Sweden were over 70.
Swiss did real contact tracing WITH blood work. They figured out children present first so they did not give it to family as was once thought
Both had the schools open. This means 30% of the population was allowed to catch it to go towards herd immunity.
Switzerland has a population of 8.5 million Sweden has a population of 10.2
Sweden had 619 deaths under 70 Switzerland had 172 deaths under 70.
Swiss use chloroquine Sweden stopped using chloroquine
Sweden has been opened Switzerland has just allowed offices to open and dropped mandatory work from home
If you lock down you will stretch out the virus and exposure over time. The death numbers should look the same in the end. The real issue is what the numbers will look at in December
They most importantly Swiss locked down the elderly fast and not everyone down until April. They also have the most advanced contact tracing in the world
https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/covid-19_coronavirus--the-situation-in-switzerland/45592192
https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-swiss-children-under-10-allowed-to-hug-grandparents-as-they-do-not-transmit-covid-19-11980568
https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/icelandic-study-we-have-not-found-a-single-instance-of-a-child-infecting-parents/
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1110092/coronavirus-covid-19-deaths-age-group-switzerland/
That's some good info. I believe it suffices to say that the wuhan virus is not an easy matter of "masks work, therefore mandatory state power" and "just let people live it's just a scare".
The virus is real and the virus does exist. And as always: don't watch CNN!
Flu deaths my inflate the numbers for Covid. So the hoax would be claiming FLU deaths as Covid. Also Look how bad the flu was this year, look at all deaths starting in January in the drop down in table one of the CDC. Select all deaths.
We got hit with a Flu pandemic at the same time. Without testing until April we had to create ASSUMED/PRESUMED Covid. Listen to everyone from February talking about Flu is more dangerous. Fauci said it on February 27th.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm
Actually you have to understand that people over 70 die of one cause or another.
Total deaths in California from all causes first 5 months:
2020 is about 120,000
2018 is about 120,000
Wait a second how is that possible. Maybe if we did not have Covid people over 70 would not have died of other causes???
https://calmatters.org/commentary/its-time-to-end-the-state-of-emergency-over-covid-19/
“These infection fatality rates are remarkably low and are similar to the fatality rate for the seasonal flu.”
“The virus is 10 times less fatal than we first thought.”
Dr. Rajiv Bhatia is an affiliated assistant clinical professor of Medicine at Stanford University. He is a former deputy health officer for the San Francisco Department of Public Health, [email protected]. Dr. Jeffrey Klausner is a professor of Medicine and Public Health at the University of California, Los Angeles.
“To properly assess the mortality risk associated with the coronavirus pandemic, it is necessary to examine deaths and death rates from all causes, not just deaths and death rates from COVID-19.”
They are asking this question because it is clear the Covid-19 numbers are highly inflated from other causes of death.
“During January-May 2020, the CDC and Department of Health and Human Services show about 120,000 total deaths in California, which is similar to the number during January-May 2018.”
They are comparing this current flu season against the last big pandemic that his us in 2017-2018 Flu season. The numbers look the same.
“Thus, the 2020 total death rates in California can be approximated by the 2018 total death rates, which are in the CDC’s WONDER database. I focus here on those under 65 years of age because they include students and most working-age people, and because COVID-19 deaths comprise only 3% of the total deaths in this age range during 2020.”
https://news.yahoo.com/california-reopen-coronavirus-stats-science-230000221.html
Science
Yeah I am certain that 5 years from now, we will see that covid made only the slightest blip of increased deaths. Probably followed by a down year in 2021 because covid took out a few extra people a year early.
Betting the most it will be up is 10,000. Or basically 1 out of every 30,000 people.
If Sweden is doing BETTER than some countries that locked down and WORSE than some others, it just goes to argue that lockdowns have little actual meaning. Which is what my theory is: that people are being ridiculous. Picking up a straw off the ground and recycling it and thinking they just cleaned up the oceans.
But there is little point comparing countries. It arrived fully, for better or for worse, in Sweden and they have had 5700 deaths and the vast majority of those were much older people, many of whom were close to death already. And now it appears to be done and there is no worry of second waves. And businesses did not get ruined. Kids did not die.
"vast majority" = 90%
Swedish Source:
https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/09f821667ce64bf7be6f9f87457ed9aa
Switzerland is using Hydroxychloroquine routinely.
Do you know that? I was actually wondering that.
c19study.com
When did Switzerland lock down? Comparing charts, it looks like Switzerland got slammed much harder and earlier than Sweden, while Sweden looks like more of a slow burn until more recently when cases spiked and then fell.
Seems to me that the virus has to run it's course, and nations that got hit earlier are in much better shape now than countries that have took early active measures. Time will tell which approach was better in terms of total economic loss and total loss of life.
Switzerland locked down in the middle of March, about 16th or so. I cannot say anything more about the seriousness of the hits, because it is also dependent on measurement of the virus. Switzerland had a limit of 2'000 tests per day for a long time. These 2'000 tests also included all mandatorily tested people.
Good work, Sweden!
I am more and more of the opinion that we should just let the WuFlu run its course.
Of course we should. It supposedly spreads in dogs and cats and on frozen dinners (literally). You can supposedly get it from touching a gas pump. You'll never stop something that spreads like that unless you are Iceland or New Zealand and can separate yourself from the world.
This whole thing has been laughably pointless since day one, other than "slowing the spread to keep hospitals from being overcrowded".
It's pointless anyway - like spitting in to a headwind: the only way the New Zealand experiment works out is if COVID-19 disappears from the rest of the world, having run its course (herd immunity, is that you??!?). Otherwise, the minute you open back up to the world, it all comes roaring in and you have the same problem you were just trying to avoid.
It's all so stupid. The good news is, here in NZ I've been taking the temperature of people's attitudes to things like further lockdown and mandatory masks (they're just "strongly encouraged" at this stage...) and people are just not having it. There's a strong feeling that enough is enough.
Exactly. A big pointless exercise that we have no hope of ever winning unless we literally achieve immortality.
One big chicken pox party
sweden didn't have a government official who was intentionally trying to kill people like cuomo.
That's terrible. I wanted the coof to cull some of the kebabs or the soyfucks.
I don't know, because you can listen to some YouTubers that are over there and they're saying things are way worse and that the media over there is lying about it
So I went to the hospital when I heard they were lying to us and my local hospital was empty. Go to the hospital and look otherwise if a YouTube is not at the hospital with a camera they are full of bs
What a goofy language haha. Always makes me think of that muppet chef.