Reconciliation was a farce. Yes the country was functionally made whole in terms of the states all participating in the federal government again, but the Democrats never got over their butthurt. They assassinated Lincoln and it just got worse from there.
I like to ask them to provide historical documents that alerted the voters that they needed to vote for someone different now. It's absurd that you would switch parties and not let the people who vote for you know.
He would have spent the rest of his presidency trying to undo the damage to the powers of the states, and re-enshrined into our civics the way that rights start with the individual, then form the rights of the locality, then the rights of the state, and then from there the rights of the federal government.
It's almost like Slavery was clung to in order to force a war to erode that system, and then Lincoln was murdered not BEFORE he could end slavery, but before he could repair the world's only free nation.
The "North" passed an amendment (Corwin Amendment) codifying slavery in the constitution in an attempt to stave off a Civil War. If all the South wanted was slavery, the southern states would have ratified the amendment and walked away, but they didn't. Just one of the many inconvenient truths your red diaper baby history teacher failed to mention.
Redditors genuinely think wars were fought over "morality" lmao. Some redditors seriously think that america joined ww2 to bash the fash because they hated nazis or something, or that northerners fought the civil war because they just thought slavery was so bad. Bro your grandpa would rather have lost the war than see the country be desegregated, shut the fuck up. I've literally had convos with Antifa-apologist retards trying to take credit for the GIs who stormed the beaches, and trying to paint Antifa as the same group of people, like the greatest generation really wanted to spend their time killing Germans on behalf of central banking interests or something, rather than be at home with their families.
I would like to politely disagree on a point you made here. I think it not entirely correct to define either the North nor the South as the "good guys" or the "bad guys," simply because they were ALL -- every single man who took to the field -- Americans. That's one of the reasons a war that should have taken four months at the most was protracted into four years. That's why an armistices was sought and Jefferson Davis not convicted of treason. And that's why the Southern monuments were "allowed" to be erected and stand: to preserve the honour of the Southerner and to accept him once again into the American union.
Listen, I think we VERY much agree on the overall sense; it's in this one stringy point that we see differently. But look at it this way: were we neighbours, we'd be having a roaring discussion over some mighty fine brews!
Not entirely true, Lincoln did make slavery the focus of the Civil War. Mostly to gain support in the south as well as nationally for a very unpopular war. He also did it to keep England from throwing support to the south, which was being considered.
The whole war had two madmen bookends—one from each side. John Brown, and then John Wilkes Booth. It was essentially perfect symmetry. Funny how that works.
Democrats remain ashamed of their history and that’s why they want to tear down statues.
Disagree. The federal government post civil war was fundamentally different than before the war. It was no longer a union of self governed states that worked out their differences via a weak Federal government, it became a Union of weak client states to a powerful Federal government.
We are not living under the government the founding fathers designed for us by way of the Constitution, that country ended when Lincoln went to war
Don’t get me wrong—I agree with what you’re saying here 100%.
It’s just that Lincoln didn’t set out to destroy the union. And States were already seceding as he made his way to Washington.
In the Lincoln / Douglas debates, he was pretty clear about not wanting to admit another slave state into the union—but to leave the existing ones. It was only later with the emancipation proclamation that really started to push back on that.
But I do 100% agree with what you said in your response. It was “these United States” before the war and it became “the United States” after. And you are very much right about us living under the giant monster government we live under today. It was a different country when Lincoln took office for sure.
The North decided that it would impose by force of arms that which was against the consent of those states that withdrew. Lincoln was always, first and foremost, willing to do ANYTHING to preserve the illusion of a Union.
Being ALL about slavery is revisionist history to hide the unlovely tyranny.
Slavery was the go to excuse when the British wanted to get involved who banned slavery in their neck of the woods. Taxation and tarrifs was more honestly what the war was about, see the South's taxes went towards the North's industrialization while the tarrifs hurt the southern economy by raising the price of their most common imports.
Not to mention that flag isn't the flag of the so-called Confederate States of America, it was the Battle Flag of the Army of Northern Virginia, led by Robert E. Lee, who fought to protect his home state and would have done so regardless of which side they had joined, and who after the war actually said that the abolition of slavery made the entire war worth the horrors. It's the flag of a good man put in a shitty situation who retained his loyalty to his family and his country (Virginia) and who after the war ended carried on and remained an American.
I’ll go one step further. He probably did more to heal the country as the war ended (by telling his men to lay down their arms and to be peaceful) than pretty much anyone.
He was a great guy. And he’s rewarded for it by having his statue torn down everywhere while everyone slanders him.
Both sides lost. And both sides won.
Edit: I'm talking about the American Civil War. Everyone loses with communism.
Reconciliation was a farce. Yes the country was functionally made whole in terms of the states all participating in the federal government again, but the Democrats never got over their butthurt. They assassinated Lincoln and it just got worse from there.
...BUT MUH PARTY SWITCH...
I love to point out to them that according to that logic, FDR was a Republican.
As was St. JFK (according to their "logic")
I like to ask them to provide historical documents that alerted the voters that they needed to vote for someone different now. It's absurd that you would switch parties and not let the people who vote for you know.
schroedingers party switch. when did it happen? right before democrats did something bad, of course!
Funny thing is
They'd actually be better off with Lincoln then they where without him. He would have been way kinder to the south
Lincoln also would have dealt with some of our current problems if he wasn't assassinated cough Liberia cough.
Ding, ding, ding
He would have spent the rest of his presidency trying to undo the damage to the powers of the states, and re-enshrined into our civics the way that rights start with the individual, then form the rights of the locality, then the rights of the state, and then from there the rights of the federal government.
It's almost like Slavery was clung to in order to force a war to erode that system, and then Lincoln was murdered not BEFORE he could end slavery, but before he could repair the world's only free nation.
Yep.
The "North" passed an amendment (Corwin Amendment) codifying slavery in the constitution in an attempt to stave off a Civil War. If all the South wanted was slavery, the southern states would have ratified the amendment and walked away, but they didn't. Just one of the many inconvenient truths your red diaper baby history teacher failed to mention.
Redditors genuinely think wars were fought over "morality" lmao. Some redditors seriously think that america joined ww2 to bash the fash because they hated nazis or something, or that northerners fought the civil war because they just thought slavery was so bad. Bro your grandpa would rather have lost the war than see the country be desegregated, shut the fuck up. I've literally had convos with Antifa-apologist retards trying to take credit for the GIs who stormed the beaches, and trying to paint Antifa as the same group of people, like the greatest generation really wanted to spend their time killing Germans on behalf of central banking interests or something, rather than be at home with their families.
I would like to politely disagree on a point you made here. I think it not entirely correct to define either the North nor the South as the "good guys" or the "bad guys," simply because they were ALL -- every single man who took to the field -- Americans. That's one of the reasons a war that should have taken four months at the most was protracted into four years. That's why an armistices was sought and Jefferson Davis not convicted of treason. And that's why the Southern monuments were "allowed" to be erected and stand: to preserve the honour of the Southerner and to accept him once again into the American union.
Listen, I think we VERY much agree on the overall sense; it's in this one stringy point that we see differently. But look at it this way: were we neighbours, we'd be having a roaring discussion over some mighty fine brews!
Not entirely true, Lincoln did make slavery the focus of the Civil War. Mostly to gain support in the south as well as nationally for a very unpopular war. He also did it to keep England from throwing support to the south, which was being considered.
He made slavery the focus ex post facto. It was not started over slavery. You admit as much in your own post.
"It may be inferred..."
I can't learn anything from people who preface what they say with "It could well be...it may be...one can infer that...everyone just knows..."
We should have expelled the Democrats after the first civil war. They have shown to be cancerous as communists. They are communist lite.
The whole war had two madmen bookends—one from each side. John Brown, and then John Wilkes Booth. It was essentially perfect symmetry. Funny how that works.
Democrats remain ashamed of their history and that’s why they want to tear down statues.
The Cathedral will never forgive Russia for abandoning communism.
Lincoln destroyed the union to preserve the Union. The country has been on the wrong path ever since.
Correct. He swore an oath to uphold the Constitution, not “preserve” an involuntary union that half the states no longer wanted any part of.
Lincoln ushered in federal taxation, big government, and Americans fighting Americans.
I’d go back in time and smother him in his crib.
Disagree. The federal government post civil war was fundamentally different than before the war. It was no longer a union of self governed states that worked out their differences via a weak Federal government, it became a Union of weak client states to a powerful Federal government.
We are not living under the government the founding fathers designed for us by way of the Constitution, that country ended when Lincoln went to war
Don’t get me wrong—I agree with what you’re saying here 100%.
It’s just that Lincoln didn’t set out to destroy the union. And States were already seceding as he made his way to Washington.
In the Lincoln / Douglas debates, he was pretty clear about not wanting to admit another slave state into the union—but to leave the existing ones. It was only later with the emancipation proclamation that really started to push back on that.
But I do 100% agree with what you said in your response. It was “these United States” before the war and it became “the United States” after. And you are very much right about us living under the giant monster government we live under today. It was a different country when Lincoln took office for sure.
Abraham Lincoln was the first big government president
Lincoln was asshoe
The Confederacy was the Democratic Party.
It's almost like they democratically voted to keep slavery, while republicans established that a republic protects certain rights of its citizens.
The North decided that it would impose by force of arms that which was against the consent of those states that withdrew. Lincoln was always, first and foremost, willing to do ANYTHING to preserve the illusion of a Union.
Being ALL about slavery is revisionist history to hide the unlovely tyranny.
Slavery was the go to excuse when the British wanted to get involved who banned slavery in their neck of the woods. Taxation and tarrifs was more honestly what the war was about, see the South's taxes went towards the North's industrialization while the tarrifs hurt the southern economy by raising the price of their most common imports.
The South had tariffs on their exports as well as their imports.
"three fifths compromise meant that white people only saw black people as three fifths of a person!!!!!!!!!!!!!" and other such retardation
That’s what the Dems STILL want—for their black voters (and white voters) to be completely dependent on the government. They want us to be slaves.
Not to mention that flag isn't the flag of the so-called Confederate States of America, it was the Battle Flag of the Army of Northern Virginia, led by Robert E. Lee, who fought to protect his home state and would have done so regardless of which side they had joined, and who after the war actually said that the abolition of slavery made the entire war worth the horrors. It's the flag of a good man put in a shitty situation who retained his loyalty to his family and his country (Virginia) and who after the war ended carried on and remained an American.
I’ll go one step further. He probably did more to heal the country as the war ended (by telling his men to lay down their arms and to be peaceful) than pretty much anyone.
He was a great guy. And he’s rewarded for it by having his statue torn down everywhere while everyone slanders him.