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posted ago by Trashaccount121 ago by Trashaccount121 +3928 / -0

update: I didn't realize this would happen, but my phone stopped recording halfway through. File size too big maybe? Anyways, it's 26 minutes of audio only, but there's enough said in the pre-recorded bits I did capture that it gets real fucking close to Critical Race Theory. Will create new OP with new account this afternoon when I have the files ready.

Option 1.) Refuse to attend. Go up to NJP or request a court martial under the UCMJ for article 92 ("failure to obey a lawful order") and fight the battle of explaining POTUS's executive order.

Option 2.) I attend and just record to leak it.

Option 2b.) I attend, record, and also make a point to loudly and pointedly remind the trainers of the EO forbidding CRT in federal agencies during the post-video "discussion" scheduled to take place.

You guys have a bit less than two hours (1000 PST start time) to give me ideas or guidance. I am absolutely willing to burn myself to the ground with option 1 if need be, but I feel like 2 serves a better purpose?

Edit: for anyone worried about my career, I don't give a fuck. Was getting out in a year no matter what. Fuck em. Appreciate the thought, though. I'm leaning towards record and leak though.

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SF_3P0 1467 points ago +1467 / -0

Military Police pede here.

Edit: Use your chain of command first before going to IG.

They cannot charge you under the UCMJ Article 92 for disobeying an unlawful order. Citing the copy of the Executive Order, the President's orders are absolute. Report immediately to the Inspector General and file a complaint and encourage others to do the same. Go up the chain of command you are protected under federal law from retaliation. Should retaliation happen, document and consult with a Staff Judge Advocate.

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making_upvotes 470 points ago +470 / -0

Upvoted for the right answer. ^^^^^^

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deleted 321 points ago +322 / -1
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Ghostof_PatrickHenry 125 points ago +125 / -0

EXTERMINATION.

I ACCEPT YOUR TERMS.

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HisDudeness 44 points ago +45 / -1

It's really THEIR terms, but we will gladly accept. One can only take so much cheek turning on the way to the gulag.

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TheFountainhead 6 points ago +6 / -0

Did the ghost of Patrick Henry just say “give me liberty or give them death”?

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MURDER_ALL_MARXIST 23 points ago +26 / -3

MURDER ALL MARXIST

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CleanYourRoom 8 points ago +9 / -1

murder means it's unjustified

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deleted 17 points ago +17 / -0
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Trashaccount121 [S] 238 points ago +238 / -0

So you are saying, do not attend and submit an IG complaint?

One of my co-workers was helping set up the projector and shit and got a preview of it. He caught a bit of it while they were testing the screen and apparently, it's skirting the line of CRT - it's not saying white people are evil, etc., but it is saying shit like systemic racism exists.

I know you're not a lawyer, but to the best of your knowledge if I attended and recorded, without announcing my intent to record (should that spook them into dialing it back into normal Equal Opportunity levels), will that be held against me?

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PeaceThroughStrength 312 points ago +312 / -0

I'm not the MP guy but I am a lawyer.

Please note that the JAG corps are not your friends in this. They are out to defend the military.

I'm not sure you're going to get a lot of attorneys help on this because the UCMJ isn't exactly something which many people practice in, thus you'll probably be best served with Option 2B.

I'm fairly certain that if you make them aware that you are recording or get caught leaking, it will be held against you because you broke through chain of command.

Spez: I would bet a lot of money that the JAG Core was consulted prior to the release of this current version of this training to be legally compliant but in substance a breach of the EO.

When you record this, do not send immediately to Veritas or other 3rd parties. You need to let this sit for some time and allow others who think similar to you to release this information concurrently or before you so you can achieve your goal but minimize your own liability.

So it's the JAG corps, as in military unit and not core as in the center which I thought was applicable as JAG was the central legal body within the military.

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Smurfection 125 points ago +125 / -0

Listen to this lawyer.

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OGTD1 82 points ago +83 / -1

Step 1 would also include deleting this post if you choose to record it.

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Visolatte 61 points ago +61 / -0

What this guy said.

Go to the class and see what is presented. It may not be what your buddy thinks it is. If it says 'systematic racism' that absolutely a core tenet of CRT. JAG have the most cucked officers in the service, so I wouldn't be surprised if it past muster with them.

That said, I have yet to sit in a military training class and be told I cant record it.

Source: 37 years of being in uniform/being a military civilian including unfortunately being a supervisor.

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LowAPM 30 points ago +30 / -0

JAG is cucked, chucked, and fucked. The Navy (especially the officer corp) is thoroughly converged. It's going to take massive house cleaning to fix the military, and decades of replacement.

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ArchVileRespawned 13 points ago +13 / -0

Yep. A lot of people think the military is right-wing and based, but many of the officers have the same politics as corporate HR departments. They just do push ups and use guns.

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dougwiser 6 points ago +6 / -0

I got out of the Navy in 1985 because they were the biggest bunch of useless bastards I had ever seen and for some reason they thought I was a career guy. I have literally lit fires under their asses just to hear them whine about how hot their asses are.

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MAGA_8_BALL 27 points ago +27 / -0

Army guy here. This guy is right about not going to JAG, JAG is there for the command, not the Soldier (or in this case Sailor). Your 3 approved channels for getting this addressed are your chain of command, the IG, or your congressperson. I can only assume this was an unclassified briefing?

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deleted 148 points ago +148 / -0
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TwoStar 83 points ago +83 / -0

Correct answer.

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Emper 142 points ago +142 / -0

Don't be a dumbass. Go to the training take notes or get a copy. It's not classified material it's all public information under the freedom of information act. Tell your commanding officer why it is unacceptable. If they don't agree file an IG complaint. Filing an IG complaint without talking to whomever is in charge will just come back to them. It'll do nothing. Complain to whomever is in charge of EO training above your commanders level. If that doesn't work go to your republican Congress member.

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SF_3P0 44 points ago +46 / -2

Yes, Use the chain of command.

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raid 9 points ago +9 / -0

The more folks in your unit that stand with you on the same complaint the better.

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Liver_Kick 61 points ago +61 / -0

Attend, get the info first hand, then if the content clearly violates the POTUS EO - do all that SF-3PO recommends.

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D3vst8r 22 points ago +22 / -0

Jaggernaut here. Thats not totally accurate. They can and will order you to sit in training, not the route to go. Record and voice your thoughts and reinforce that what they are saying is NOT normal. Not legal adivce

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muslimporn 0 points ago +3 / -3

You can go AWOL. It's a risk but also the right thing to do. You can be punished for doing the right thing which is sad. Open refusal to attend is better than trying to be absent on the sly.

Sending people to these kinds of "diversity training" sessions is the equivalent of sending them to attend religious service.

It's neither constitutional nor anything to do with maintaining a military force. It's the same kind of situation as if a sergeant went mad and ordered all the privates to masturbate into each others mouths.

The purpose of being able to give orders is not for the sake of giving orders.

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D3vst8r 2 points ago +2 / -0

more infoThere is an argument that acommander has decided that the training is needed to maintain "good order and discipline" a vague discretion granted to a commander that is rarely questioned.

Theres lots of case law regarding your sergeant scenario. That would not be a good comparison as it involves a sex act and opens LOTS of legal issues/aggrivating factors and less about lawfulness of the orders. The elements in the UCMJ are pretty clear.

From article 90, not sure which year MCM (on mobile) could change slightly on who is giving the order but not much. " Inference of lawfulness. An order requiring the performance of a military duty or act may be inferred to be lawful and it is disobeyed at the peril of the subordinate. This inference does not apply to a patently illegal order, such as the one that directs the commission of a crime. (ii) Authority of issuing officer. The commissioned officer issuing the order must have authority to give such an order. Authorization may be based on law, regulation, or custom of the service (iii) Relationship to military duty. The order must relate to military duty, which includes all activities reasonably necessary to accomplish a military mission, or safeguard or promote the morale, discipline, and usefulness of members of a command and directly connected with the maintenance of good order in the service. The order may not, without such a valid military purpose, interfere with private rights or personal affairs. However, the dictates of a person’s conscience, religion, or personal philosophy cannot justify or excuse the disobedience of an otherwise lawful order. Disobedience of an order which has for its sole object the attainment of some private end, or which is given for the sole purpose of increasing the penalty for an offense which it is expected the accused may commit, is not punishable under this article.(iv) Relationship to statutory or constitutional rights. The order must not conflict with the statutory or constitutional rights of the person receiving the order."

Military courts tend to error on the side of tradition and upholding command authority.

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muslimporn 1 point ago +1 / -0

I think there's an element to this beyond the legal wrangling.

The fact is that this is wrong. In cases like these if instead of weighing up the legal manoeuvring and how to use that in a Machiavellian scheme there is a concept of not going along with something that is wrong regardless of the artificial consequences.

For example, openly disobeying the order up front. If it means a court martial, then court martial it is.

Many people might say this is a risky option and they would not be entirely wrong but it is an option.

In this situation the command should not put someone in the position of having to disobey orders. That undermines the entire command structure.

This would usually be bad advice because often people are opinionated and wrong. You can't afford to go second guessing in combat situations where time is limited.

For things such as this however, it should be very clear that it's not what you sign up for.

In this situation ALL of your options are risky. Doing this kind of political indoctrination session shows the chain of command is corrupt. They are taking advantage of that. Do something and your neck is on the line. Do nothing and you have to attend a political service that doesn't reflect your beliefs.

That's a serious problem and when you have a situation like that which is divisive then you'll end up with a military split into two sides and a point of contention where there can be no negotiation or compromise (the Democrat side is in the wrong but in their mind it's switched).

Around half the military is Democrat and if they all go along with these Democrat indoctrination screenings and insist on it then basically it means ridding the military of some proportion of its manpower approaching half to achieve the EO.

This is actually inevitable. The left is increasingly not secular in its politics. Normal people if your making cars then your business is making cars. Democrats don't work like this. You have to be an activist all the time and any access you get, authority or anything else is given for that purpose for you to do as you can with to further your political ends.

You cannot reason with them. For them it is imperative to impose their woke religion and bring everyone into the fold. It can only rise to the level of who has the most force to bring to bare.

Bloodshed on a huge scale and the USA losing its nukes because an unstable country locked in brutal civil war can't have nukes / WMDs that it can't control. That's a threat to every other nation in the world.

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VoterIDMatters 9 points ago +16 / -7

Exposing them to the public will not do SHIT.

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Two_Scoops__ 14 points ago +14 / -0

yes it does, it makes people aware. Nothing is better than visuals to see for yourself what is really going on

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Saremei 1 point ago +5 / -4

No it doesn't. The public are largely unaware of everything. And exposing shit hasn't changed anything. Don't leak it, document it and bring it to the right people.

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VoterIDMatters -1 points ago +6 / -7

If he wants people to be aware, that’s wonderful but what will that accomplish? NOTHING

In my opinion we are all aware of a coup against the president and it continues to this day so how much less will result from this?

If he has an option to go up the chain of command it may actually cause this to stop.

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deleted 15 points ago +16 / -1
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misterLahey 5 points ago +5 / -0

Navy IG? Cuck central though.

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lanre 3 points ago +3 / -0

IG works for the chain of command, lol. That's like saying to report your boss to HR when they report to him.

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deleted 1 point ago +1 / -0