Jews aren't exactly monolithic, either today or back then. It's true, some Jews did write some disgusting things about Jesus. It's also true that some long dead Jews presented Jesus to the Romans who actually executed Him on charges of sedition.
But it's also true that the "gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable." Now, nobody can live up to the law and they no longer have a temple to make any sin offerings in, either, there's only Jesus. In the NT, I believe it was Paul who even wishes himself to be accursed in order to save the lost Jews.
Yet it's also true that many particular people who were Jewish have done awful things. Some, like Saul who held the coats of those who stoned Stephen, repented. Others did not. Others delivered believers into prisons, beat them 39 times with rods, scourged them, disowned them, removed the believers from the places of worship and their homes.
But it's not right or good to assign collective blame. I know that I do not want to share blame with everyone who has the same sex organs, melanin content, or birthplace. Judge each one fairly, by their works. Some are, as you've said evil. Others, like Saul, may yet repent, even after doing evil things. God only knows.
Collective blame and assignment of it is exactly how we get into stupid conversations like repetitions.
Bottom line, and I know it’s hard to understand, but there is no central Jewish authority. Further, the sects of judiaisim are as different as catholic, and southern Episcopalian and 7th day.
Yeah, the Jews got divided up a lot after the 2nd Temple was destroyed. Some were the first Christians. In fact, the Bible indicates that only Jews were Christians up until that vision wherein God tells them to let the Gentiles join.
Now there were certainly other Jews who did not follow Jesus. There's also mention in the Bible of a "synagogue of Satan" and certain particular Jews and Romans persecuted Christians. Nero fed Christians to the lions. Some Jewish scholars wrote awful things about Jesus, saying He was in Gehenna, etc.
The reason most Jewish sects are somewhat anti-Christian today is because those Jews that didn't join the Christians fought with them. Then the Christians took over the Roman empire and they ended up being made to regret that, and the cycle repeated over and over in various times and ways.
So Christianity was founded by Jews: Jesus, all the apostles, etc. were Jewish Christians. But most (but not all!) of those who still call themselves Jews now are from those who rejected Christ and who continue to do so. Our modern experience with liberal, atheistic people who are ethnically Jewish, but who often reject even the trappings of their own ethnic religion, has not been the norm for all of history.
There are Messianic Jews and others who recognize Jesus to this day. And there are other groups of liberal atheists who are ethnically Jewish and have a hate-boner for Christianity. It's neither wise nor good to lump those groups together.
So. I’m Jewish. Know lots of Jews. Those Jews are in lots of sects. None of us are anti christian at the least. You kind ol are limping everyone together even though you say it’s not a good idea to do it. It’s easy to do I suppose.
I'm more trying to explain why people have the experience of meeting anti-Christian types and that there exist groups of such people. So groups may exist, just as there are groups of anti-Christian white people, etc., but I don't blame you or anyone else for the actions of any other people, Jewish or otherwise.
I won't disagree with you on that part. We do have to stand up to all who would silence us. We do have to destroy the cultural programming wherein we're taught things like "separation of church and state (which isn't even in the constitution proper) means that you can't legislate anything based on your morality, but let's just ignore that that doesn't apply to us..."
Just saying that I don't want to other all Jews. Instead, I'll speak against specific individuals who are doing or have done bad things and try not to blame people collectively, though it's hard when using the various shorthands for the group of people who believe X.
Yeah, i hear you. You're absolutely right that the left has spent all their time studying society and how to destroy it. Their complaints about privilege aren't there to abolish the practice, but to change it to benefit them, etc. I can go on about all sorts of cultural programming we've been subjected to, like their mantra of "racism, sexism and homophobia" to tie the practices of democrats burning crosses in black people's yards to blaming all men for trade-offs created due to needing to bear children, to a made-up fear to recast disgust as "unmanly" fear. I can talk quite a bit about how they work to shut us down and shut us up. For every discussion of the "closet" gay people were in, they've worked hard to shove conservatives into one, etc.
My only worry is that I don't want to become like the leftists in opposing them. I don't wish to become what I hate, but I agree that we have to fight back and stand up for ourselves. I just don't want to make the mistake of blaming huge groups of people--some of which support us!--for the sins of others. And it's hard. It's far too easy to talk about groups as political monoliths and it's hard to clearly separate things and not make people feel targeted when they're not being targeted, etc.
Anyhow, you too, you have a great day and a good one, fellow pede. I wish you all the best in destroying the evil cultural programming we've been subjected to.
Jews aren't exactly monolithic, either today or back then. It's true, some Jews did write some disgusting things about Jesus. It's also true that some long dead Jews presented Jesus to the Romans who actually executed Him on charges of sedition.
But it's also true that the "gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable." Now, nobody can live up to the law and they no longer have a temple to make any sin offerings in, either, there's only Jesus. In the NT, I believe it was Paul who even wishes himself to be accursed in order to save the lost Jews.
Yet it's also true that many particular people who were Jewish have done awful things. Some, like Saul who held the coats of those who stoned Stephen, repented. Others did not. Others delivered believers into prisons, beat them 39 times with rods, scourged them, disowned them, removed the believers from the places of worship and their homes.
But it's not right or good to assign collective blame. I know that I do not want to share blame with everyone who has the same sex organs, melanin content, or birthplace. Judge each one fairly, by their works. Some are, as you've said evil. Others, like Saul, may yet repent, even after doing evil things. God only knows.
Collective blame and assignment of it is exactly how we get into stupid conversations like repetitions.
Bottom line, and I know it’s hard to understand, but there is no central Jewish authority. Further, the sects of judiaisim are as different as catholic, and southern Episcopalian and 7th day.
Yeah, the Jews got divided up a lot after the 2nd Temple was destroyed. Some were the first Christians. In fact, the Bible indicates that only Jews were Christians up until that vision wherein God tells them to let the Gentiles join.
Now there were certainly other Jews who did not follow Jesus. There's also mention in the Bible of a "synagogue of Satan" and certain particular Jews and Romans persecuted Christians. Nero fed Christians to the lions. Some Jewish scholars wrote awful things about Jesus, saying He was in Gehenna, etc.
The reason most Jewish sects are somewhat anti-Christian today is because those Jews that didn't join the Christians fought with them. Then the Christians took over the Roman empire and they ended up being made to regret that, and the cycle repeated over and over in various times and ways.
So Christianity was founded by Jews: Jesus, all the apostles, etc. were Jewish Christians. But most (but not all!) of those who still call themselves Jews now are from those who rejected Christ and who continue to do so. Our modern experience with liberal, atheistic people who are ethnically Jewish, but who often reject even the trappings of their own ethnic religion, has not been the norm for all of history.
There are Messianic Jews and others who recognize Jesus to this day. And there are other groups of liberal atheists who are ethnically Jewish and have a hate-boner for Christianity. It's neither wise nor good to lump those groups together.
So. I’m Jewish. Know lots of Jews. Those Jews are in lots of sects. None of us are anti christian at the least. You kind ol are limping everyone together even though you say it’s not a good idea to do it. It’s easy to do I suppose.
I'm more trying to explain why people have the experience of meeting anti-Christian types and that there exist groups of such people. So groups may exist, just as there are groups of anti-Christian white people, etc., but I don't blame you or anyone else for the actions of any other people, Jewish or otherwise.
I won't disagree with you on that part. We do have to stand up to all who would silence us. We do have to destroy the cultural programming wherein we're taught things like "separation of church and state (which isn't even in the constitution proper) means that you can't legislate anything based on your morality, but let's just ignore that that doesn't apply to us..."
Just saying that I don't want to other all Jews. Instead, I'll speak against specific individuals who are doing or have done bad things and try not to blame people collectively, though it's hard when using the various shorthands for the group of people who believe X.
Yeah, i hear you. You're absolutely right that the left has spent all their time studying society and how to destroy it. Their complaints about privilege aren't there to abolish the practice, but to change it to benefit them, etc. I can go on about all sorts of cultural programming we've been subjected to, like their mantra of "racism, sexism and homophobia" to tie the practices of democrats burning crosses in black people's yards to blaming all men for trade-offs created due to needing to bear children, to a made-up fear to recast disgust as "unmanly" fear. I can talk quite a bit about how they work to shut us down and shut us up. For every discussion of the "closet" gay people were in, they've worked hard to shove conservatives into one, etc.
My only worry is that I don't want to become like the leftists in opposing them. I don't wish to become what I hate, but I agree that we have to fight back and stand up for ourselves. I just don't want to make the mistake of blaming huge groups of people--some of which support us!--for the sins of others. And it's hard. It's far too easy to talk about groups as political monoliths and it's hard to clearly separate things and not make people feel targeted when they're not being targeted, etc.
Anyhow, you too, you have a great day and a good one, fellow pede. I wish you all the best in destroying the evil cultural programming we've been subjected to.