"I used to be a libertarian because I just wanted to be left alone and I believed in extending that same courtesy to others. I became right-wing when I realized that the left will never, ever leave me alone."
The libertarians are a joke. I was the same way, joined a libertarian social group even. Almost all of them have TDS now. They try to appeal to leftists and win over exactly zero of them to their niche group. They love losing and they are complicit with the left. I had one on Facebook today from that group told me fuck you for posting that I was no longer going to wear a mask anywhere anymore.
Same thing can be said for cuckservatives. They sit back and whine about Trump's tweets or shit he says, like they have any idea of how to fight. Look faggot, do you want to have "muh conservative principles" or do you want to win?
I find this one so funny. What "conservative principles" has Trump betrayed?
Pro life? Lower taxes? Reduced regulatory burden? Pro law and order? Pro manufacturing and business? Oh wait--he's the first Republican President to actually uphold any of these since Reagan.
No, the "conservative principle" is apparently that people on the right should always bend over being nice to the liberal media and never make fun of their opponents, especially on Twitter.
... Yet I can't find that in a Republican platform from any time in history. Almost like the Bush 1&2 crew just made it up from whole cloth to excuse their fake "conservatism" of the past 30 years.
Conservatives need to understand that being tough is not immoral. When your opponent not only fights you but fights dirty there is no time to think about what is the most moral way to win.
Thats really what grinds my gears. A lot of conservatives want “purists”. Fuck that, I want to win and destroy liberalism! It takes action to win, not words!
To be fair, many people don't know their own true beliefs. There are RINOs, DINOs, and I guess LINOs (Libertarian in name only) as well.
I am a real Libertarian. I believe in the maximization of individual liberties. And I am aware of the enemies of these values. The government must be used against them, as they are using it against you. Reciprocity is a significant pillar in ethics - and nobody has to reject power if power is used against you. No - you have the DUTY to use power to defeat the aggressor, otherwise you let them get away with it and continue to do so.
But the end goal should be to increase Free Market Capitalism rather than spiral into working towards communism to defeat communists.
And another point: Whoever is not for the ABSOLUTE ELIMINATION OF MARXISM is not a true Libertarian. Whoever finds himself flirting with leftists or trying to appease them is a cuck that belongs in the trash bin.
It's like a home invader busting your door down and coming into your house and negotiating with you on how much stuff to take. No, no negotiation. Home invaders need to be dealt with. You don't give them any of your stuff. As long as a person doesn't invade your home, who cares what he does to his own place, but as soon as he attempts to bust the door to your home down, he should immediately lose all power to bust any door down ever again.
I am in a similar boat as a registered libertarian - I am against open borders because I can think past first order consequences and know that such policy is a kumbaya campfire fantasy that inevitably leads to the erosion of the rights of citizens.
Lots of libertarians like trump. Especially since their current presidential candidate is super woke. Why would any libertarian want to vote for someone who believes that we have to be actively "anti-racist". Why would any libertarian in their right mind would want a president that wants to actively discriminate against white people. Pretty dumb If you ask me.
Another former Libertarian checking in. It's the stand you take when you can't quite bring yourself to take a real stand. I went full on Trump Train after similarly realizing the left will never leave us alone.
I thought "when gay marriage became legal in all 50 states the left will leave it alone."
Nope. See pride month. Not even one day is good enough for them. Not even one parade is enough for them. They need a month of parades. That isn't even good enough -- they demand major corporations show support or risk getting crapped all over on social media forever. That isn't good enough either; the heterosexuals are still a looming threat. Everyone who protests homosexuality or even doesn't care for it needs to be accused of sexism, intolerance and ex-communicated from society
I see marriage as a covenant between a man and woman before God. Why should the state be involved in marriage at all? Let alone trying to force me to admit something is a marriage that according to my beliefs is not a marriage. And divorce, why is the state involved in that either? If it's a union before God, how is it that some judge should have the authority to abolish that union?
A Republican state representative once suggested the nuclear option if gay marriage were ruled the law of the land: abolish marriage as a State licensed activity and replace with implicit civil contract law.
He was laughed at, scorned as a radical loon, and told to go away by the media and people on the left and right. To this day I still don't understand the opposition since what he said - and what you're saying - sounds reasonable to me.
This is literally what happened to me. I was a registered libertarian (NOT ancap) for many years and I voted them every presidential election to try to help a third party come onto the stage. Then 2016 happened with that useless pothead Gary Whogivesashit and his RINO running mate Weld on the LIbertarian side, I realized that the LIberatrian party is controlled opposition and they will never do anything useful even if they ever got power. On top of that, the anti-conservative rhetoric from the Democrats building to a scream made it abundantly obvious to me that the left wanted to torture and kill me and my family just because I was conservative, and Republicans seem to be the only ones fighting against it (however limp-wristed it may be).
I registered Independent this year, but I have always voted full ticket conservative when I have a choice, and none when it's only Democrats. I honestly would rather vote MAGA party, but no one has started that yet, so I guess I'll vote straight Republican for now.
Outgroup. Marxists (and other authoritarian collectivists) weaponize ingroup/outgroup declarations to direct their drones and instill cohesion by giving them a holy enemy to unite against. Conservatives are just the current holy enemy, but ironically enough any one of their current demographic ingroups can and will be "othered" at any point that it becomes politically convenient.
When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.
When they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.
When they came for the trade unionists,
I did not speak out;
I was not a trade unionist.
When they came for the Jews,
I did not speak out;
I was not a Jew.
When they came for me,
there was no one left to speak out.
I realized that the LIberatrian party is controlled opposition...
Beyond that, it's not even possible for a third-party to usurp the uniparty these days. The game is rigged. Local election laws have been constructed by the incestuous web of state parties and legislatures, making sure parties remain a private system of the elites while having the power of quasi-governmental organizations. It is completely antithetical to what our founders envisioned.
Trump showed how to do it. We have to take over from within and show the people there's a better way. If we get enough MAGA in there, we'll have completely destroyed the Dems and may be able to split the GOP into a coalition of Patriots and RINOs who at least vote with us most of the time.
There's a mess because of etymology versus politics. For a long time many people have called themselves liberal with a different set of dominant meanings than today. Politically, ideologically, academically and institutionally approaching the turn of the century as the left sought to redefine itself under the concept of using the new millennium to orchestrate a renewal of sorts the meaning of liberal was reformed or rather deformed along with it. This change was in an effect a reversal.
As a result when you have people today who are carrying the liberal torch yet being strict (authoritarian) and while still calling themselves liberal it makes it very difficult to continue using the label.
A lot of people have started calling themselves classical liberals as a result. While the left wing party in the UK explicitly renamed themselves New Labour ideologically despite the radical changes no one bothered to rename it. Neo-liberal was already taken so then simply never bothered. The old name isn't appropriate either but because they claim it you can't do anything. You can control what you call things and yourself but not others. The name is now like Little John.
Because the left is authoritarian but liberal isn't appropriate loads of people just call themselves libertarians instead merely to identify themselves as anti-authoritarian with less syllables.
It's still messy because there's also an established libertarian political concept with far more specifics which often isn't what many people intend to mean when they say libertarian.
English is an ongoing battle for the shortest terms to efficiently describe something ideally using familiar rather than invented terms or random terms.
America: [squirt bottle squirt] NO. BAD democrats. NO.
2020 dems: disagree with black people burning your homes, businesses, and communities to the ground, or resist our dem supported terror groups, and you're RACIST. Also, people who don't like pedophilia on netflix are scandal-mongers. Kids who use lethal force to defend themselves from pedos are mass shooters. Critical race theory should be taught starting in preschool. Wear a mask, or I'll fucking kill you, you could hurt someone's feelings, but no, I don't have to wear a mask. Come to China Town, it's safe, join us / Trump is xenophobic for shutting down flights from china. Trump personally caused all of these people to die of covid. Trump just told everyone not to let covid dominate your life, and he told Americans we live in the greatest country on earth and to not be afraid and we can defeat this together. Reeeeeeeeeeeeee.
Also 2020 dems: Even if you agree with us we may still burn down your business or ruin your 3-year-old's birthday party if we happen to be nearby! And if we do, you'd better not complain!
That's the disclaimer at the bottom of every democrat advert.
No matter how passionately you virtue signal, no matter how humbly you genuflect before the alter of black supremacy, nothing will stop you and your children from being raped to death under the new world order.
Oh well shit, sign me right the fuck up! Lockdowns forever! It was her turn REEEEEEEE
I was thinking today how horrible it would be to be a leftist, in short because while the internal ideological contradictions and doublethink compound on your subconscious, externally you're surrounded by cynical, hateful sophists putting on airs of compassion and tolerance while they bide their time looking for the opportunity to step on your neck for more power to lord over you.
Leftists have created a world for themselves where their deepest beliefs clash with objective reality and everyone you know wears a hollow smile while looking for an opportunity to stab you in the back.
Is it any wonder they're such thoroughly miserable creatures...
This is my story too. I’m still appalled normies can’t see through the dem bullshit. Actually I’m convinced they can but their tribalism gets in the way. Yesterday I told my mom covid was political, she disagreed. I offered a $1000 bet saying it disappears after the election. She didn’t take the bet...
Haha. I've repeatedly offered a similar bet to my SO. They know in their hearts that we're right. A wise person once said "It is a terrible thing to fall, but far more terrible is to admit it."
My girlfriend was worried about her "at-risk" mother getting it, as well as her step dad. Me and my folks had it back in March and kicked its commie ass like the red blooded Patriots we are. Her mom and step dad got it, she freaked out for a day or two, and then literally has not brought it up one bit since. I can only assume they got over it like it was nothing, like I did.
I can only hope this shit is sinking in, because any direct attempt has been completely futile since she believes Trump is as guilty as the rest of them. No matter what evidence I bring she goes back to that. She'll claim she doesn't fit in with whatever groups, but regurgitates Democratic Party talking points to me whenever it does come up, including the old "Western European Democratic Socialism" argument.
I know exactly how you feel, pede. I have good friends - otherwise kind and smart people - who insist that they are neutral and moderate and formulate all their own opinions without outside influence they are just totally free thinkers coming to their own conclusions based on the facts.
... And then they will tow the party line harder than a fucking tugboat and literally shout me down Chris Wallace style and say I'm 'distracting from the issue' when I dare deviate from the neat little script they have in their heads. Two friends have literally covered their ears and said "LaLaLaLaLa" like a fucking child and then called me closed minded!! The cognitive dissonance is remarkable. That's why we call them NPCs. They are not bad guys, but until the system changes and they are told it's okay to not tow the line they are just mind slaves to the enemy. Very much like the Matrix.
Normies who don't have access to "alternative media" like us may never know that the wool is pulled over their eyes. Many of them probably see "alternative media" as a bunch of extremist conspiracy theorists shut off from reality trying to control them (ironically).
Ive been trying to think of who to get my mom to watch (she's 72) instead of CNN and Canadian state media because she's a natural catastrophizer and severely Trump Derranged.
My friend loves posting clips of CNN blatantly making fun of Trump and Trump supporters and still actually thinks CNN is real news and are presenting a fair and accurate view of the world.
I was in college. If you were OK with fighting terrorism, you were racist toward Muslims. "BUSH IS A WAR CRIMINAL!!!" was the "Trump is literally Hitler!" of my time.
Yup, same. I was a moderate Dem leaning in 2015. By 2016 they were calling everyone racist and I was out. Now they are worse.
Reminds me of a good quote I saw a while back:
"I used to be a libertarian because I just wanted to be left alone and I believed in extending that same courtesy to others. I became right-wing when I realized that the left will never, ever leave me alone."
The libertarians are a joke. I was the same way, joined a libertarian social group even. Almost all of them have TDS now. They try to appeal to leftists and win over exactly zero of them to their niche group. They love losing and they are complicit with the left. I had one on Facebook today from that group told me fuck you for posting that I was no longer going to wear a mask anywhere anymore.
Same thing can be said for cuckservatives. They sit back and whine about Trump's tweets or shit he says, like they have any idea of how to fight. Look faggot, do you want to have "muh conservative principles" or do you want to win?
I find this one so funny. What "conservative principles" has Trump betrayed?
Pro life? Lower taxes? Reduced regulatory burden? Pro law and order? Pro manufacturing and business? Oh wait--he's the first Republican President to actually uphold any of these since Reagan.
No, the "conservative principle" is apparently that people on the right should always bend over being nice to the liberal media and never make fun of their opponents, especially on Twitter.
... Yet I can't find that in a Republican platform from any time in history. Almost like the Bush 1&2 crew just made it up from whole cloth to excuse their fake "conservatism" of the past 30 years.
Conservatives need to understand that being tough is not immoral. When your opponent not only fights you but fights dirty there is no time to think about what is the most moral way to win.
Thats really what grinds my gears. A lot of conservatives want “purists”. Fuck that, I want to win and destroy liberalism! It takes action to win, not words!
I agree!
To be fair, many people don't know their own true beliefs. There are RINOs, DINOs, and I guess LINOs (Libertarian in name only) as well.
I am a real Libertarian. I believe in the maximization of individual liberties. And I am aware of the enemies of these values. The government must be used against them, as they are using it against you. Reciprocity is a significant pillar in ethics - and nobody has to reject power if power is used against you. No - you have the DUTY to use power to defeat the aggressor, otherwise you let them get away with it and continue to do so.
But the end goal should be to increase Free Market Capitalism rather than spiral into working towards communism to defeat communists.
And another point: Whoever is not for the ABSOLUTE ELIMINATION OF MARXISM is not a true Libertarian. Whoever finds himself flirting with leftists or trying to appease them is a cuck that belongs in the trash bin.
It's like a home invader busting your door down and coming into your house and negotiating with you on how much stuff to take. No, no negotiation. Home invaders need to be dealt with. You don't give them any of your stuff. As long as a person doesn't invade your home, who cares what he does to his own place, but as soon as he attempts to bust the door to your home down, he should immediately lose all power to bust any door down ever again.
I am in a similar boat as a registered libertarian - I am against open borders because I can think past first order consequences and know that such policy is a kumbaya campfire fantasy that inevitably leads to the erosion of the rights of citizens.
I can respect that Evil. I’m overgeneralizing for sure, but it feels necessary. Too many cucks, too little time and I’m addicted to winning!
Lots of libertarians like trump. Especially since their current presidential candidate is super woke. Why would any libertarian want to vote for someone who believes that we have to be actively "anti-racist". Why would any libertarian in their right mind would want a president that wants to actively discriminate against white people. Pretty dumb If you ask me.
Post Ron Paul I suspect the party leadership has been puppeted much like the RNC and DNC since It got big enough to be a potential political threat.
I would say that Libertarians are a joke, but libertarians are not. I consider myself the latter but definitely not the former.
Another former Libertarian checking in. It's the stand you take when you can't quite bring yourself to take a real stand. I went full on Trump Train after similarly realizing the left will never leave us alone.
I thought "when gay marriage became legal in all 50 states the left will leave it alone."
Nope. See pride month. Not even one day is good enough for them. Not even one parade is enough for them. They need a month of parades. That isn't even good enough -- they demand major corporations show support or risk getting crapped all over on social media forever. That isn't good enough either; the heterosexuals are still a looming threat. Everyone who protests homosexuality or even doesn't care for it needs to be accused of sexism, intolerance and ex-communicated from society
All of these groups have always been about exerting power. Everything else is just window dressing.
I see marriage as a covenant between a man and woman before God. Why should the state be involved in marriage at all? Let alone trying to force me to admit something is a marriage that according to my beliefs is not a marriage. And divorce, why is the state involved in that either? If it's a union before God, how is it that some judge should have the authority to abolish that union?
A Republican state representative once suggested the nuclear option if gay marriage were ruled the law of the land: abolish marriage as a State licensed activity and replace with implicit civil contract law.
He was laughed at, scorned as a radical loon, and told to go away by the media and people on the left and right. To this day I still don't understand the opposition since what he said - and what you're saying - sounds reasonable to me.
This is literally what happened to me. I was a registered libertarian (NOT ancap) for many years and I voted them every presidential election to try to help a third party come onto the stage. Then 2016 happened with that useless pothead Gary Whogivesashit and his RINO running mate Weld on the LIbertarian side, I realized that the LIberatrian party is controlled opposition and they will never do anything useful even if they ever got power. On top of that, the anti-conservative rhetoric from the Democrats building to a scream made it abundantly obvious to me that the left wanted to torture and kill me and my family just because I was conservative, and Republicans seem to be the only ones fighting against it (however limp-wristed it may be).
I registered Independent this year, but I have always voted full ticket conservative when I have a choice, and none when it's only Democrats. I honestly would rather vote MAGA party, but no one has started that yet, so I guess I'll vote straight Republican for now.
Outgroup. Marxists (and other authoritarian collectivists) weaponize ingroup/outgroup declarations to direct their drones and instill cohesion by giving them a holy enemy to unite against. Conservatives are just the current holy enemy, but ironically enough any one of their current demographic ingroups can and will be "othered" at any point that it becomes politically convenient.
When the Nazis came for the communists, I remained silent; I was not a communist. When they locked up the social democrats, I remained silent; I was not a social democrat. When they came for the trade unionists, I did not speak out; I was not a trade unionist. When they came for the Jews, I did not speak out; I was not a Jew. When they came for me, there was no one left to speak out.
Pastor Marten Niemoller 1892-1984
I used to just call it tribalism but "weaponized ingroup/outgroup declarations" is even better.
Beyond that, it's not even possible for a third-party to usurp the uniparty these days. The game is rigged. Local election laws have been constructed by the incestuous web of state parties and legislatures, making sure parties remain a private system of the elites while having the power of quasi-governmental organizations. It is completely antithetical to what our founders envisioned.
Trump showed how to do it. We have to take over from within and show the people there's a better way. If we get enough MAGA in there, we'll have completely destroyed the Dems and may be able to split the GOP into a coalition of Patriots and RINOs who at least vote with us most of the time.
Many libertarians now believe that GEOTUS is part of the uniparty and that they use him to make life more authoritarian.
You can't win with these nerds. We try to make their speech more free, and they just dig their heels into lala land.
There's a mess because of etymology versus politics. For a long time many people have called themselves liberal with a different set of dominant meanings than today. Politically, ideologically, academically and institutionally approaching the turn of the century as the left sought to redefine itself under the concept of using the new millennium to orchestrate a renewal of sorts the meaning of liberal was reformed or rather deformed along with it. This change was in an effect a reversal.
As a result when you have people today who are carrying the liberal torch yet being strict (authoritarian) and while still calling themselves liberal it makes it very difficult to continue using the label.
A lot of people have started calling themselves classical liberals as a result. While the left wing party in the UK explicitly renamed themselves New Labour ideologically despite the radical changes no one bothered to rename it. Neo-liberal was already taken so then simply never bothered. The old name isn't appropriate either but because they claim it you can't do anything. You can control what you call things and yourself but not others. The name is now like Little John.
Because the left is authoritarian but liberal isn't appropriate loads of people just call themselves libertarians instead merely to identify themselves as anti-authoritarian with less syllables.
It's still messy because there's also an established libertarian political concept with far more specifics which often isn't what many people intend to mean when they say libertarian.
English is an ongoing battle for the shortest terms to efficiently describe something ideally using familiar rather than invented terms or random terms.
The authoritarians are the ones who want to use a virus as an excuse to lord over everyone with an iron first.
2016 dems: disagree with us, and you're RACIST.
America: [squirt bottle squirt] NO. BAD democrats. NO.
2020 dems: disagree with black people burning your homes, businesses, and communities to the ground, or resist our dem supported terror groups, and you're RACIST. Also, people who don't like pedophilia on netflix are scandal-mongers. Kids who use lethal force to defend themselves from pedos are mass shooters. Critical race theory should be taught starting in preschool. Wear a mask, or I'll fucking kill you, you could hurt someone's feelings, but no, I don't have to wear a mask. Come to China Town, it's safe, join us / Trump is xenophobic for shutting down flights from china. Trump personally caused all of these people to die of covid. Trump just told everyone not to let covid dominate your life, and he told Americans we live in the greatest country on earth and to not be afraid and we can defeat this together. Reeeeeeeeeeeeee.
America: [racks shotgun]
Also 2020 dems: Even if you agree with us we may still burn down your business or ruin your 3-year-old's birthday party if we happen to be nearby! And if we do, you'd better not complain!
That's the disclaimer at the bottom of every democrat advert.
No matter how passionately you virtue signal, no matter how humbly you genuflect before the alter of black supremacy, nothing will stop you and your children from being raped to death under the new world order.
Oh well shit, sign me right the fuck up! Lockdowns forever! It was her turn REEEEEEEE
I was thinking today how horrible it would be to be a leftist, in short because while the internal ideological contradictions and doublethink compound on your subconscious, externally you're surrounded by cynical, hateful sophists putting on airs of compassion and tolerance while they bide their time looking for the opportunity to step on your neck for more power to lord over you.
Leftists have created a world for themselves where their deepest beliefs clash with objective reality and everyone you know wears a hollow smile while looking for an opportunity to stab you in the back.
Is it any wonder they're such thoroughly miserable creatures...
This is my story too. I’m still appalled normies can’t see through the dem bullshit. Actually I’m convinced they can but their tribalism gets in the way. Yesterday I told my mom covid was political, she disagreed. I offered a $1000 bet saying it disappears after the election. She didn’t take the bet...
Haha. I've repeatedly offered a similar bet to my SO. They know in their hearts that we're right. A wise person once said "It is a terrible thing to fall, but far more terrible is to admit it."
My girlfriend was worried about her "at-risk" mother getting it, as well as her step dad. Me and my folks had it back in March and kicked its commie ass like the red blooded Patriots we are. Her mom and step dad got it, she freaked out for a day or two, and then literally has not brought it up one bit since. I can only assume they got over it like it was nothing, like I did.
I can only hope this shit is sinking in, because any direct attempt has been completely futile since she believes Trump is as guilty as the rest of them. No matter what evidence I bring she goes back to that. She'll claim she doesn't fit in with whatever groups, but regurgitates Democratic Party talking points to me whenever it does come up, including the old "Western European Democratic Socialism" argument.
I know exactly how you feel, pede. I have good friends - otherwise kind and smart people - who insist that they are neutral and moderate and formulate all their own opinions without outside influence they are just totally free thinkers coming to their own conclusions based on the facts.
... And then they will tow the party line harder than a fucking tugboat and literally shout me down Chris Wallace style and say I'm 'distracting from the issue' when I dare deviate from the neat little script they have in their heads. Two friends have literally covered their ears and said "LaLaLaLaLa" like a fucking child and then called me closed minded!! The cognitive dissonance is remarkable. That's why we call them NPCs. They are not bad guys, but until the system changes and they are told it's okay to not tow the line they are just mind slaves to the enemy. Very much like the Matrix.
Normies who don't have access to "alternative media" like us may never know that the wool is pulled over their eyes. Many of them probably see "alternative media" as a bunch of extremist conspiracy theorists shut off from reality trying to control them (ironically).
Ive been trying to think of who to get my mom to watch (she's 72) instead of CNN and Canadian state media because she's a natural catastrophizer and severely Trump Derranged.
My friend loves posting clips of CNN blatantly making fun of Trump and Trump supporters and still actually thinks CNN is real news and are presenting a fair and accurate view of the world.
I was a moderate Dem leaning in 2000. By 2001 they were calling everyone racist and I was out. Now they are worse.
-Me
I never noticed any racism propaganda prior to 2015 but I was also young.
I was in college. If you were OK with fighting terrorism, you were racist toward Muslims. "BUSH IS A WAR CRIMINAL!!!" was the "Trump is literally Hitler!" of my time.